Help please - he a bucker..

[lavroski]

Im looking for some advice from those of us who are mad enough to break in Ponies and Horses.
Ive been working on a 5 yo 13hh very chunky coloured chap.Every step he has asked the question 'why' I have answered him as clearly as poss and he has accepted it and moved on.Generally hes been a joy to do.I backed him and my friend took him for a walk while I was on him for about 300 yds.He was so good,going off the leg,halting and walking on so he got lots of fuss and was turned out.Wanting to keep the flow I did the same the next day but he felt different.We had only gone about 10 yards and he hesitated so I gently put my leg on and wow.He totally rodeoed.Unfortunately he is a very round boy.. and in 5 seconds the saddle was up his neck and a second later I was on the deck!I am so frustrated with coming off but boy he can buck.I guess hes asking his questions again.His back was fine - no pain and physically hes sound so any ideas on what to do next? I did get back on him while he was stood for a minute or so but that was it.I could realy use some advice,Ive not had a bucker like him before.
Thanks

 

[saddlesore]

Could it be a panic response? If your friend walked with you the day before and he was fine, then tense when asked to go it alone? Maybe asy your friend to walk out with you a few more times or long line first to get him used to going alone? Also, as he is young he probably panicked (sp) when the saddle started slipping and you started moving in the saddle so continued to buck until you came off? You could also do some more saddle desensitising work by saddling him up (stirrups down) in the school and then immidiately sending him out to work on the track and see what his reaction is?
Sorry if I have misunsderstood your post!

 

[Parkranger]

I think it's a bit early to be taking him out on his own (unless that's the only option with him). Have you long reined him out on his own etc to build up his confidence on his own?

 

[thumperbos]

This is sooo eerie, but we had a near identical problem with 16hh tb mare we've just broken.
She was a doddle, then whilst out for a gentle hack with my brother, the saddle slipped and she give some of the most enormous bucks I've ever seen, until he'd hit the deck.
She was definitely very worried about things after that, and we found a better fitting saddle in the form of my bro's albion xc saddle with thicker knee rolls.
We had to virtually start the backing process again, as she was very wary about everything. So there was more lungeing with saddle and stirrups down, and lots of long walks on the lunge rope and continuous patting, with my brave little brother turning round to pat her bum, stroke her tummy etc, to get her used to the shifts in weight, and the movement, up top that she could still see in her peripheral vision.

Luckily after that, little bro went back down to college and life got more hectic at home, so she had a bit of a breather for a week or so out in the field to chill out. Now we've got a new girl riding her, and we're back on track and just started a few jumps too!

 

[millitiger]

sometimes you can be almost too quiet during the backing process so the horse isn't really aware you are riding.

have you done all of the really yanking the saddle around, banging down his shoulders, on his bum, around his ribs etc where the legs go when you were lying across him?

when you first started riding him did you go off in straight lines or do some circles first? some horses are a little dim and need to do circles to make sure they have noticed you sitting up on them.
he may have just caught sight of you out of the corner of his eye and lost the plot.

either way, i'd go back and redo the steps above before trying to ride him out again... and perhaps try and find a saddle which won't fly up his neck if he has a paddy?

 

[dunthing]

I think you have to look at this from the horses point of view. He's just had an "alien/predator" on his back and that was acceptable. The next time it happens, said predator is creeping up his neck and may well attack him. It's the instinct of any horse to be scared initially of something on his back. As the other posters have said, don't treat him too gently, get him used to all the movements and shfts in weight before you start going out on your own with him.

 

[lavroski]

Thanks for all you replies.He is inclined to be a bit sharp,but mainly in fear or panic than anything else.I have done lots of lunge work and loads of long reining.He responds great to vocal commands too.My friend was with me the second day I took him out aswell,but when he exploded they let go,which isnt a bad thing realy because he could have totaly lost it and reared.I did try to prep him as much as poss with the lying across him and getting him used to the on off thing.
Thanks again for your advice.I will be lunging with stirrups down,lots of lying across him and making more noise and then hopefully grabbing hold of my 'courage' and trying again.I sometimes think I am getting too old for this...

 

[Shilasdair]

Your saddle doesn't fit him - you can't ride on a saddle which slides up his neck at the first sign of trouble.
I'd take him back a few steps in the breaking process, and find a saddle that does sit firm (have you tried Limpet pads, or maybe familiarise him with a crupper?).
Good luck.
S

 

[lavroski]

Will try a crupper.His saddle is extra wide fitting and he has no withers and has quite a sprung barrel.Theres nothing else to stop it doing that if real force is put in place.He is rather fat too though he is living out and gets no extra food / hay.This makes fitting a saddle to him harder.Does anyone know of a make of saddle that caters for the more round type?