HELP!! sorry another post about the new trailer law!!

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charlotte79

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OK people so my licence only covers me for the 3.5t rule....now i have been over and over with people about this and its driving me bonkers, so some opinions/facts would be appreciated. I have a mitsy pajero swb 2.8 which from what i gather is around 2t in kerb weight if i were to get a trailer of 600kgs plated for mam of 1400kg and my horse weighs 600kg i am legal??
horse + unladen trailer weight = 1200 so is less than kerb weightof truck, also horse + trailer + vehicle = 3200 so is less than kerb weight of truck but then someone threw a spanner in the works and said that gross vehicle weight + mam of trailer also has to be less than 3.5t....i can't find GVW for a swb pajero anywhere and am confused:confused::confused:!!!! I have been saving for a new lightweight trailer and now am worried i won't be legal. I don't need opinions on taking test as that is not an option at the moment thanks :)
 
I think they're correct. If your theoretical max train weight is over 3.5 tonnes then that isn't ok. Even if you never go over in practise. That's why most people doing it this way tow with a large saloon for example instead of a 4x4, to keep the total weight down.
 
it will go on the info on the data plate on the trailer, if that says gross weight 1500kg for example the heaviest the towing car can be is 2000kg, because both together will = 3500kg

BUT the towing car MUST be heavier than the laden trailer, which is what makes it so difficult to get the balance right, most IW trailers are plated with their gross weight which together with your average 4 x 4 will put you over the 3500kg limit.

I have a Sinclair which is very light weight, however the plate says a gross weight of 2000kg, which when paired with my 4 x 4 takes me over the 3500kg
the only answer I think is to be naughty, remove the plate, go to a weigh bridge and weigh 4 x 4, trailer, with horses, fuel and all your equipment and see the true weight.....
 
I think you'd be struggling to get a safe trailer weighing 600kgs, even the ifor williams single trailer is 770kg. I had an older style rice years ago and on a weigh bridge is was 750kg without the partitions, a wooden floor counts for a lot of weight.
 
My Sinclair weighs 800kg and is in very good condition, I have since removed the partition and have a single breast bar as we only travel one small horse, so I would think that would help keep the weight down too.

There are certain trailer makes that are lighter than others, I know the Cheval Liberate (sp) is very lightweight due to the construction materials, and like others have said IW are on the heavy side.
 
i am looking to buy the cheval liberte 1003 which is very safe according to reviews as my pajero is imported all the plates are in japanese anyway?? its so confusing !!
 
charlotte79 said:
i am looking to buy the cheval liberte 1003 which is very safe according to reviews as my pajero is imported all the plates are in japanese anyway?? its so confusing !!
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I would have thought that the Pajero is the Jap version of the Shogun??? Can you not find the kerbweight for a Shogun? Surely they would be the same? :o)
 
birchave0 said:
the only answer I think is to be naughty, remove the plate, go to a weigh bridge and weigh 4 x 4, trailer, with horses, fuel and all your equipment and see the true weight.....
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That's a no go on a new trailer. It has to be on there if the trailer is new or else that's a wrist slapping too.
 
yes but the kerb weight isn't the same as the gross vehicle weight which is what i need to find...if it was down to the kerb weight i would be fine but someone said i need to find the gvw and add that to the mam of trailer?? i would sell my pajero and buy a car but i need a 4x4 as it snows where i keep her.
 
i think the pajero is no good as if the kerb weight is 2t then the gvw will be at least another 6/700kg so that plus the 1400 is over the 3.5t. Can anyone recommend a decent 4x4 car for towing??
 
Sorry no advice but this is absolutely NUTS!!

we all know you NEED the weight of a good 4x4 to tow horses safely and legally yet this law is encouraging/forcing people to tow with a lower weight vehicle!!

Absolutely nuts!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! IMHO

These laws must be the only reason I am glad I am older :D:D:D
 
I think it's the weight of the Capacity of the trailer, not what you actually have in it.

I have a cheveal liberte light-ish trailer but the max capacity is 3t ish so hubby had to do his trailer test.
 
I'm afraid I would be amazed if you could find something safe to tow with a light enough trailer to keep it under 3.5 tons with horse, fuel, tack etc on board. Would be delighted to be proved wrong tho!
 
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soulfull said:
Sorry no advice but this is absolutely NUTS!!

we all know you NEED the weight of a good 4x4 to tow horses safely and legally yet this law is encouraging/forcing people to tow with a lower weight vehicle!!

Absolutely nuts!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! IMHO

These laws must be the only reason I am glad I am older :D:D:D
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Course you don't if your trailer is nice and light and well made. It is the weight of trailer proportional to car which is the safety issue. If your trailer and horse is lighter than it used to be then you can use a lighter (relatively speaking) car to tow it safely.

I think it's nuts that people are allowed to tow without any training whatsoever. That is what's dangerous to me.
 
jesstickle said:
Course you don't if your trailer is nice and light and well made. It is the weight of trailer proportional to car which is the safety issue. If your trailer and horse is lighter than it used to be then you can use a lighter (relatively speaking) car to tow it safely.

I think it's nuts that people are allowed to tow without any training whatsoever. That is what's dangerous to me.
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Fair enough I have a lorry so its been years since I towed so don't keep up with things really


In reality I don't know anyone that does it without training. My ex was a police advanced driving instructor including HGV/towing and he taught me how to tow and how to drive my 7.5t Also dad was HGV driver for 20+years and he came out with me the first few times hubby couldn't make it.

all people I know had someone show them the ropes first
 
i was in the usa for 3 yrs on a hunter barn and was perfectly legal to pull 3horses which is why it frustrates me i'm not legal in this country, and i only missed the change in law by 2 months:mad:!!! i obviously want to be legal which is why this is all so confusing the cheval liberte is super light and with my horse is 1200 which + the 2000 kerb weight is well under the 3.5t and gives me 300kg for tack feed etc, but its the gvw thats throwing me and all websites say different bloody things!!!!
 
soulfull said:
Fair enough I have a lorry so its been years since I towed so don't keep up with things really


In reality I don't know anyone that does it without training. My ex was a police advanced driving instructor including HGV/towing and he taught me how to tow and how to drive my 7.5t Also dad was HGV driver for 20+years and he came out with me the first few times hubby couldn't make it.

all people I know had someone show them the ropes first
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sorry SF. That sounded a bit grumpy when it really wasn't supposed to at all :) I do wish I could drive a lorry, but that'll be another spensive test when the time comes. Sounds like you're in a good position if you ever need a driver. I'm jealous!

I do think there are some people out there who really haven't ever been shown the ropes, not so much us horse people as we're carrying precious cargo, but I do wonder about some people pulling caravans!
 
charlotte79 said:
OK people so my licence only covers me for the 3.5t rule....now i have been over and over with people about this and its driving me bonkers, so some opinions/facts would be appreciated. I have a mitsy pajero swb 2.8 which from what i gather is around 2t in kerb weight if i were to get a trailer of 600kgs plated for mam of 1400kg and my horse weighs 600kg i am legal??
horse + unladen trailer weight = 1200 so is less than kerb weightof truck, also horse + trailer + vehicle = 3200 so is less than kerb weight of truck but then someone threw a spanner in the works and said that gross vehicle weight + mam of trailer also has to be less than 3.5t....i can't find GVW for a swb pajero anywhere and am confused:confused::confused:!!!! I have been saving for a new lightweight trailer and now am worried i won't be legal. I don't need opinions on taking test as that is not an option at the moment thanks :)
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I'm just going thru the process off lorry to 4x4 and trailer and its a pain in the butt.

"Apparently" your trailer laden shouldnt be more than 80% of the weight of your towing vehicle??????????

Theres a website called "What Tow" and you can put your veh details in there then add weight of trailer plus gestimated weight of horse and it will tell you if its safe to tow with your chosen vehicle!
 
Hi,

I passed my driving test in 1999 so needed to do a trailer test and did this a few years ago.

You need to do a trailer test for all trailers which have are over 750kgs. All horse trailers are in this category

The 3.5kg is the lorry test and you would additionally need that if you wanted to drive a lorry. Or a combined weight if the trailer is less than 750kg.

To know whether a car can tow - the maximum towing capacity of the car MUST exceed the horse + unladen weight of the trailer - if it doesn't, then its illegal.
Because its the unladen weight of the trailer, it doesn't matter if you remove the centre partition etc, because its legal based on the plate. You can however, apply for a reduction on the plated unladen weight in some cases.

Try these websites:

http://www.towinghorsetrailers.co.uk/towing_weights_law.htm
http://www.direct.gov.uk/en/Motoring/DriverLicensing/CaravansTrailersCommercialVehicles/DG_4022521

So in summary, there are two laws to consider:

1) Trailer test - If you passed after jan 1997, then you need a test to tow over 750kg (all horse trailers)
2) Car MTC must exceed trailer plated capacity + horse & equipment

Hope this helps.

Natalie
 
mahonenx said:
Hi,

You need to do a trailer test for all trailers which have are over 750kgs. All horse trailers are in this category
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They really aren't anymore. I think OP said she is looking at a trailer at about 600kg. It is just about possible to tow a horse without taking the test if you're really careful with what trailer/vehicle you use.
 
As far as I was aware, you would have to do the trailer test to tow ANY 2 horse trailer.....The only ones light enough for you to tow on your licence are the single horse ones....
 
jesstickle said:
They really aren't anymore. I think OP said she is looking at a trailer at about 600kg. It is just about possible to tow a horse without taking the test if you're really careful with what trailer/vehicle you use.
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This isn't correct - If the weight of the trailer is 600kg and the horse weighs 500kgs then that is overweight. I did see another post that said the trailer was 800kgs.

Unless she wants to tow a horse under 150kg then its illegal.
 
mahonenx said:
This isn't correct - If the weight of the trailer is 600kg and the horse weighs 500kgs then that is overweight. I did see another post that said the trailer was 800kgs.

Unless she wants to tow a horse under 150kg then its illegal.
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It is my understanding that she can tow a trailer up to 750kg providing the payload of said trailer plus its gross weight is not heavier than her car AND that the car and trailer fully loaded does not exceed 3.5 tonnes.

That is what I was told when taking towing lessons in November. It is very hard to achieve, but it is possible. One of our instructors is clearly wrong
 
Maybe I'm reading the information differently. When I did my test, I was told the above details.

Personally. I wouldn't risk it being wrong. In an accident, neither me, my horses and equipment, or anyone involved would be covered by insurance. Too much to risk in my opinion.
 
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