Help with border collie pup's issues

NOISYGIRL

NOISYGIRL

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There's a young couple round by me who walk their puppy they rehomed, he's approx 8 months old. We stop and have a chat etc anyhoo

They are having problems with him wanting to chase cars, does anyonen have any ideas to stop him doing it ? They go to a trainer but he is not helping them much, he tends to go to the well behaved ones in the class and not bother with them. They are trying really hard with him, as in they've taken him to lessons but not getting the help.

He doesn't respond to his name very well, so I told them to try holding a treat to their face and each time he responds give it to him, this worked with our springer we rehomed.

I was wondering about clicker training ?

They were advised by the trainer to use those training discs but he ignored them after the initial couple of times. Thing is with these things I think you have to know what to do, when to do it and it depends on the dog, he is quite timid, his tail is between his legs all the time and seems stressed all the time.

Any ideas for me to pass on would be greatly appreciated

Thanks
 
A 1-2-1 with a different trainer might help - one that knows about clicker training. You need to set a good foundation for this method to work.

Training discs etc are not always advisable, I personally would not use them on a nervous pup. Distraction with a squeaky toy or game might be better in this case.

It's natural that this breed would want to chase, so giving him an alternative outlet for this might well help. Of course the danger is in overdoing it and damaging his joints - but training a fun retrieve might well help - get him switched onto balls and off cars. No ball chucker yet as his age though, IMO. One to talk to a trainer about for sure.
 
tell them to seek the advice of a behaviourist who knows about collies

have a look on agilitynet.com and if you post on the forum there someone will help you.

it's fixable, Ive sorted it in 2 of mine but they are both very different personalities and timing is everything hence Id be reluctant to offer advice without actually seeing the dog. Hope that helps :)
 
As others, you need to tell them to go to a trainer who knows about collies, it is a common collie trait and they are much more amenable to clicker training than discs, collies are not big fans of loud/sudden noises, I cannot believe a reputable trainer would suggest this for a young collie!!!
The can be incredibly ball focussed and his focus needs to be redirected as mentioned.
Sorry but trainer sounds like a plank.
 
Thanks for the replies, CC yes I thought that too re the plank ! and the use of discs in an already timid/nervous dog, he has a good reputation although they seem to get his daughter most times they've been so maybe she can't read how the dog is as well as her father, I'll suggest a one to one with him

I'll suggest they do what people have suggested.
 
As others have said, it sounds like they need to find another trainer, 1 that uses positive reinforcement and not negative training methods. Discs can solve the problem in the short term, but as they have found out unless you solve the underlying problem the behaviour won't go away. BC's aren't an easy breed, they learn the bad behaviours easily if you haven't got the experience and chase is a highly inbuilt behaviour for them, with a good trainer though they can be the best dogs, easy to train and eager to please.
 
Agree with all of the above, but at home make sure they use his name to call him when absolutely they know he is going to respond, mealtimes, when he's getting a treat, stuff like that.

Playing hide n seek is a good way of tiring collies out that doesn't involve them bombing round at a million miles an hour, start with short distances (the other side of the chair, behind the sofa) & build up to perhaps in another room or out in the garden. Ours love playing that game & because it makes them think the brain gets tired so the legs will follow :)

One other thought - does he like/recognise his name? If they've changed it perhaps he's not worked that out yet or maybe it just not a sound he recognises as a name for him, for example if it matches a word used a lot round the house for other things it might just be something he tunes out as not for him, i.e. if they talk about the telly & the dogs called Nelly - daft example but I can't think of a better one, but if its a sound he hears a lot he may just have become deaf to it.

Might sound daft but I have known of people who've had this problem & tried various different sounding names until they got something the dog appeared to respond to & the problem went away.
 
My collie, 5 yrs old, is obsessed with cars. He loves being in them, and he would love to chase them. His father chased my car when I went to pick him up. He doesn't get let off the lead anywhere near a road, although I can walk along the path without him taking too much notice. If he does look interested, I flick the end of his rope against his shoulder and say 'leave'. He is not interested in chasing trains, infact if he hears one approaching he will sit. This is in contrast to my mate's collie who isn't interested in cars but goes nuts at trains!!
He has been a challenge in many ways, including being rather anti-social with other dogs which we have worked on, fathomed out is because he is a scaredy cat, and he now has friends that he will play with. The cars are another matter though, and I would never allow him off the lead anywhere near a road. It can't be trained out of him, they are just too exciting.
Should add that mine is not interested in either food or balls when he is out for a walk!!
 
Mynstrel said:
Agree with all of the above, but at home make sure they use his name to call him when absolutely they know he is going to respond, mealtimes, when he's getting a treat, stuff like that.

Playing hide n seek is a good way of tiring collies out that doesn't involve them bombing round at a million miles an hour, start with short distances (the other side of the chair, behind the sofa) & build up to perhaps in another room or out in the garden. Ours love playing that game & because it makes them think the brain gets tired so the legs will follow :)

One other thought - does he like/recognise his name? If they've changed it perhaps he's not worked that out yet or maybe it just not a sound he recognises as a name for him, for example if it matches a word used a lot round the house for other things it might just be something he tunes out as not for him, i.e. if they talk about the telly & the dogs called Nelly - daft example but I can't think of a better one, but if its a sound he hears a lot he may just have become deaf to it.

Might sound daft but I have known of people who've had this problem & tried various different sounding names until they got something the dog appeared to respond to & the problem went away.
Click to expand...

They rehomed him so I presume they named him or that's what he was called in the kennels, you are right and I was thinking down those lines, when we first had the springer we have now, she was rehomed, but we knew where from, and she has the same name, however she didn't listen or have any recall, so my husband found this american chap on youtube who made alot of scense. He said about holding a treat to your face when you say their name and give it as soon as they react, its worked with our dog and I was telling her about that, I did it a few times while we were chatting, he started to react quicker each time so I'm sure if they practiced in the house he would improve no end. I told her to find something really tasty, as he doesn't seem that interested in treats but he ate the ones I had so I told her the make.

I have limited knowledge so its nice for people to reply with their ideas thanks, much appreciated. I gave them my lunge line I wasn't using anymore and told them to practice with that, recall and stuff and not to let him off the lead, they learnt that lesson themselves unfortunately, they were lucky he didn't get hurt.

I said about clicker training but they would need to find everything out about it and to not attempt it without researching/getting help.

I do think they need to find another trainer as these methods aren't working
 
One of my collies used to chase cars - anything with wheels really. What we did with the car problem was when out on a walk ever time a car went past we mad her sit and diverted her attention with a squeaky toy. At first she'd literally try and hang herself on the lead by swinging out after the car but eventually she learnt that if she sat quietly she got to play with the toy. Now she doesn't bother at all. We had to get her out of it because we live on a farm and obviously with tractors and machinery about it could have been a deadly trait for her. Every so often she might have a go at the wheely bin but it's very rare.
 
CaveCanem said:
The can be incredibly ball focussed and his focus needs to be redirected as mentioned.
Click to expand...

haha, clinically OBSESSED is the word id used for mine!

i didnt actually realise that this was a recognised collie trait - altho the amount that do flyball i suppose it should have been obvious
 
Funnily enough my collie has no interest in playing ball whatsoever and I have tried, over and over again! She will run after one I have thrown, race to where its landed, look at it, look back at me as if to say "there it is Mum - did you lose it?" and then run off to find something more interesting :rolleyes:

Back to the couple that have rehomed the puppy - would it be worth suggesting they introduce a whistle for recall? All mine are whistle trained (including the collie) and I think that a couple of quick sharp pips on a 2/11 catches their attention so much quicker than calling their name. The minute their attention is caught, they are distracted and mine always come back immediately without question much more so than if I just called them by voice. Food for thought anyway :)
 
We were really lucky with our border, we figured out really early on that she would walk over hot coals to get to a tennis ball! So for most things waving the tennis ball (and then later just holding it up) really caught her attention and now it's like she's on an invisible elastic band, she'll go off exploring in the bushes or trees but she's always looking for me and if I keep walking she'll come back to me.
She also wanted to chase cars when she was a pup (collie thing i'm afraid, if it moves herd it! :D) and we weren't getting very far till we got a compressed air tube from the pet shop, when you push the button it skooshes (is that a word?) a blast of air out. If you get your timing right i.e see collie getting ready to lunge, say "NO" in a clear firm voice (split second before lunge) and if they spring for the car skoosh the air. It worked really well and she stopped being interested in cars pretty quickly.
Also got a brill piece of advice that says: Never tell your dog to do something it clearly won't comply with if you have no way of enforcing it or they will learn to ignore you. If you tell your dog to do something they are already doing (just after they are doing it) i.e as a recall, when they start walking back to you say "come!" in a light happy tone of voice and then lots of praise/play/treat when they reach you works brilliantly.
Never tell your dog off for doing something after they have come back to you or they will associate the return to you as a bad thing.
Hope this helps! :D Lots of love for borders :)
 
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