Help with loaning

[Devlin23]

Been looking into loaning a pony for my daughter from the riding school she goes too weekly. Had a big discussion with them but I wanted to double check if it sounds right. Only because I've searched forums and other schools websites at their loaning prices etc and what we are been offered and asked to pay extra appears to be a lot more. But maybe I have been looking in the wrong place.
So loan pony from the riding school, can not use it at weekends due to lessons. There is a big question mark about weather it may or may not be used in private lessons once in the week which again would mean couldn't use as it be getting used after school in privates. But they aren't 100% on this so that would need confirming.
Cash, monthly in advance £190. Then we are required to pay for wormers, vaccinations, dentist, farrier, if pysio required and if horse requires vet whilst we loan.
On site we can use indoor or outdoor arena but to use indoor need to pay.
She has lessons weekly anyway but they did state would need ride weekly and if she misses a week she then needs to have double lesson the following weekend weather it be usual lesson and a private or usual lesson and then into another group lesson.
There was a limit to how many hours could ride a week but can't remember what it was now.
All lessons etc remain the same price and she may not be able to use the loan in her lessons as others may book the pony.
Obviously need own insurance.
School holidays would be different as they often do events where the pony is used so that would affect when we could go or if she could use the pony.
I was meant to recieve a contract around a 6 weeks ago and as of yet received nothing, so haven't parted with any money or started the loan. Have asked a few times and keep getting told will get it sorted. Originally the loan was meant to Start beginning September but as haven't got a contract that hasn't happened. Not sure if that's purely down to time or if there is an issue I'm not been made aware of.
Any advice would be appreciated. I understand the initial £190 a month isn't much but after looking around at other riding schools some are more like £150-£170 but they offer discounted riding lessons etc and they don't mention having to pay the farrier, dentist, vacs etc on top. So was just hoping maybe people had some personal experiences to share

 

[Crazy_cat_lady]

I used to loan a rs pony when I was younger, so didn't get involved with costs, but cost wise it sounds like they're taking the Mickey that is huge costs especially dentist etc on top! I think my mum just paid the price each month for the daily loan cost (I did Wednesdays so 4 daily loan fee).

Re the lessons, do they have quieter days you can loan on? We used to on a day the rs was shut, but it was on the understanding on school holidays etc if there were events the pony would likely be used for them (e.g. foreign students) and we would have to wait until before or after to ride

Do they offer a one or 2 day a week loan option so you could loan in the week when it's quieter? You're effectively wasting money including the weekend as you'll be paying for others to ride the pony with your daughter not having any access.

We were expected to do all chores for the pony on the day we had it eg tack clean/ muck out etc. We were only allowed to ride on site e.g. the fields or in the school and I think a member of staff who was first aid trained had to be around, I can't remember if this was for any riding or if we wanted to jump

I had great fun loaning as a whole gang of us had ponies on loan from them so we could ride together, however it did make me jealous seeing other people ride "my" pony and it upset me the amount of work he had to do

Also if your daughter wants to buy accessories for the pony e.g a saddle pad or anything, I'd recommend only using them when she's riding, then taking them back home with you and putting the school issued version on, or they'll just get ruined, and they're your daughter's items

I'm pretty sure we still had to have regular lessons, probably so you were still a customer of the rs.

I'd try and see if they will do an agreement where you pay per day, that way daughter could loan on one or 2 of the quieter days in the week then fulfill the lesson quota at the weekend when pony is off limits due to being used for the lessons?

 

[AShetlandBitMeOnce]

No, that's a con. Look elsewhere and get a nice share for a few days per week - you won't have huge costs, you'll be able to learn more as you'll be on an independent yard, you can make horsey connections, and you'll actually get a chance to use the school which it sounds like you won't at this riding school.. You also won't be paying through the nose to be dictated to when you can and can't ride, you have your horse/pony on your day and that's that.

 

[HappyHollyDays]

It’s not a loan, it’s robbery and by asking for cash they are ensuring it doesn’t go through the books. You are essentially paying for everything with a limited amount of allocated time and many restrictions. Next they will be telling you that the pony needs new tack and rugs and it’s up to you to provide them. Walk away and depending on her age and your commitment find your daughter a private share where you have set days for a financial contribution and stable duties on your days.

 

[Polos Mum]

IMHO sounds like you'd be writing them a blank cheque for all the necessary extras. Those could double the price if there is a vet niggle and they decide the physio is needed regularly.

There are 100's of private loans being advertised currently becasue we're heading into winter and cash for lots of people is tight. Even in expensive south East I'd expect those to be £20-£40 a week for 3 day inc one weekend day and that includes extras. Around here (Yorkshire) you'd pay £10 a ride.
Lots of nice kids ponies need extra exercise over winter so lots of choice. If you were happy to supervise her in a private home

 

[Arzada]

I was meant to recieve a contract around a 6 weeks ago and as of yet received nothing, so haven't parted with any money or started the loan.

That's very fortunate. Look elsewhere as advised above.

 

[Devlin23]

Thank you for the replies.. as it stands the loan is basically your any days. Apart from fact they say can't use at weekends due to lessons etc.
And there is a chance once in the week also. So would be limited to 4 evenings as she is at school but also around my shifts it would be more like twice a week.
Yes the loan would have to stay on the yard can't be taken off. Which isn't an issue but I was surprised would have pay to use indoor arena on top.
The yard have livery aswell so the arenas can get busy if you have a couple of livery there riding aswell.
After looking around and seeing others where not charging the farrier etc on top of the loan for riding school ponies I did Start to think it wasn't common.
I never loaned as a child but we used to do own a pony for a week in the holidays etc so it was very different.
Yes she does want all the lemieux matchy match as the kids seem to now but I did say she wouldn't be able to leave it at the yard.
They actually haven't said about staff having to be on site just that she needs an adult with her at all times and that we would need make them.l aware if we was going on the yard and when leaving. But as she would only be able use it after school in the week I think the owner is usually around then.

 

[JBM]

Uh..no this sounds ridiculous
They own the place so there isn’t any livery to be paid so your monthly payment should be going towards the horses bills
You either pay that a month or the bills (farrier and such) not both
Definitely wouldn’t agree to vet bills what if the horse gets hurt during one of the lessons? You still have to pay?
Horrible deal wouldn’t be glad you haven’t got a contract and pull out

 

[ycbm]

Cash, monthly in advance £190. Then we are required to pay for wormers, vaccinations, dentist, farrier, if pysio required and if horse requires vet whilst we loan.

Tell them to jog on.

My bolding. You will not be able to insure for this under those conditions, and it's a blank cheque.
.

 

[Devlin23]

It’s not a loan, it’s robbery and by asking for cash they are ensuring it doesn’t go through the books. You are essentially paying for everything with a limited amount of allocated time and many restrictions. Next they will be telling you that the pony needs new tack and rugs and it’s up to you to provide them. Walk away and depending on her age and your commitment find your daughter a private share where you have set days for a financial contribution and stable duties on your days.

My daughter did say someone had told her at weekend the ponies rug wasn't suitable for winter and she would need a new one!! So you are probably right they would ask we provide it

 

[JBM]

My daughter did say someone had told her at weekend the ponies rug wasn't suitable for winter and she would need a new one!! So you are probably right they would ask we provide it

Sounds like they want someone to pay for the horse and they can use it for free tbh

 

[Arzada]

as it stands the loan is basically your any days. Apart from fact they say can't use at weekends due to lessons etc.
And there is a chance once in the week also.

I foresee this changing in the school holidays and not in your favour

 

[SBJT]

I don’t often respond to this sort of thing, so the fact that I am means that I feel very strongly on this.

Walk away.

As @Katie&Judy said, what happens if the horse gets hurt in a lesson, you still have to pay? Ridiculous. Plus paying for use of the arena (on top of not being able to use certain days), not a chance IMO. They are using your naivety having not done this before to assume you don’t know any better.

To add more context, if you have exclusive use then yes you pay those things. If you are sharing with the facility then they pay and you get an all in fee paying a proportion towards it within the fee they set, and they take on the risk of injury to the horse.

That’s how everyone else I’ve ever known has done it, unless you’re in a special type arrangement with a specific or upper level horse, or there’s something else I’ve just never seen.

 

[Motherofwelshies]

Seems they want to have their cake and scoff it. They get a pony to still use and make money with whilst you foot the bill and only get to ride when they say so.

I would look for a nice share pony for her a few days a week. Can be difficult to find but worth looking for. My best friend has a local child sharing her daughter's pony who has been outgrown for some time but they can't bare to part with. They are out there you just need to look.

Also I think your daughter will get far more from having a share with a privately owned pony than a RS, more freedom and the experience of being on a private yard etc.

 

[Peglo]

You pay for lessons, farrier, vacs, dentist, physio etc. clean tack and do chores. You don’t get to chose when your daughter can ride and to top it off you pay £190 on top? I have no idea what that £190’s for. Please do not pay this! (If I’ve got this right)

me and my friend helped at a trekking centre when we were young. We mucked out and fed and groomed the horses and tacked up when needed. We were both very skinny teenagers and helped back 2 half miniature shetlands and we would get free hacks if the ponies weren’t being ridden much (more so in winter) it was a great set up for us.
Your paying a large sum for your ‘loan’ and getting very little out of it.

 

[JackFrost]

I had a similar loan from a RS. I had a jolly good look at the small print of the contract and saw that I could make it work for me. Actually the contract was so badly worded that I doubt it could have been enforced. If she can enjoy riding just in the times you are allowed, it could be ok, but they are being greedy, and unless you really want this pony, walk away. If you want to do it, get the contract first and study it hard. Or just start the loan with one payment and no contract, and give it up after a month if it's not working for you. Do not give them access to your bank account via direct debit.

For comparison, a sensible RS loan policy I know of is £100 per month + farrier and worming and lessons on top. If the pony is a popular one, it is not often free or really has already worked enough, so find out also how much work this horse is already doing.

 

[w1bbler]

Run rather than walk away. Looks like you would be paying for a full loan whilst the rs still uses the pony during the busy times & when daughter is most likely to want to ride

 

[The Xmas Furry]

OP, a very local riding school near me charges a similar amount, but that's about all that's the same.

Included in their cost is:
Loaners have 2 x weekdays as theirs till 6pm. (Some lessons are still held after this and pony might be used for others).
Also have a lesson on 'their' pony on one weekend morning. Usually 1st lesson so they can get pony ready etc, but they are flexible.
Shoes, worming, feed, hay and clipping included.
Can bring own tack, saddle cloths etc but cannot be left at yard (in case of being borrowed and not returned)
1st in queue to book 'their' pony for monthly yard comps and other events.
Vet bills included unless in accident caused by loaner.
Not included is cover for chores when loaner cannot go on their day.

I think that's pretty reasonable.
What you are being offered is not.

 

[babymare]

Sorry I would walk away very quick. Look for a private loan. Couple of days a week. Cost be less and a chance you find a great owner. But that cost is robbery ? contact local pony club and post on localFB sites. Far better loans for child’s pony out there ?

 

[AmyMay]

Nope, ridiculous.

 

[SilverLinings]

Tell them to jog on.

My bolding. You will not be able to insure for this under those conditions, and it's a blank cheque.
.

As YCBM says the vet fees are a particular concern as you could end up paying thousands of pounds just for one single illness/injury, especially as you can't decide when to PTS and the RS might want all treatment options to be tried. For example the average cost of colic surgery alone is around £6,500, but can be up to £10k (and colic is responsible for approximately one third of all emergency vet call-outs, although not all cases will need surgery).

They are basically charging you what it would cost to keep your own horse but you will only be allowed to ride it when and where it suits them, and have no say in the decision making and care of the horse.

I feel very strongly that you should look elsewhere.

 

[Pmf27]

As others have said, walk away! The additional costs are absolutely ridiculous, I take particular issue with being asked to pay to use the school.

Private loans will almost always be cheaper than RS loans, but this one is just taking the Mickey.

 

[splashgirl45]

You would be better off letting your daughter have extra lessons, you could get quite a few for £190 without the extras .. I would also go to another riding school as these people don’t sound nice to me

 

[SBJT]

As YCBM says the vet fees are a particular concern as you could end up paying thousands of pounds just for one single illness/injury, especially as you can't decide when to PTS and the RS might want all treatment options to be tried. For example the average cost of colic surgery alone is around £6,500, but can be up to £10k (and colic is responsible for approximately one third of all emergency vet call-outs, although not all cases will need surgery).

They are basically charging you what it would cost to keep your own horse but you will only be allowed to ride it when and where it suits them, and have no say in the decision making and care of the horse.

I feel very strongly that you should look elsewhere.

Sorry yes it was @ycbm who said that. That to me is ridiculous and the contract person in me shivers with the liability fallout which would certainly happen when it comes to horses and getting hurt. If the horse ends up needing unbelievably expensive treatment that OP would refuse to do as it’s cost prohibitive then the RS could try to invoke contract to try to make them pay.

Some lawyer somewhere will be rubbing their hands with glee at that prospect of billable hours…

 

[Trouper]

I really think children need to go to a RS for lessons to learn to ride properly first. When they get to the competent stage and want their own pony, then it needs to be in a situation where they can learn all about care and routine and the discipline needed to look after an animal.

This situation seems to fail in all ways. There is not even a guarantee that your child will be able to ride "her" pony at the times when she is most likely to want to - ie weekends. An adult friend put her newly acquired horse on working livery (which is a more structured form of what seems to be on offer to you). Even as an adult, she could not make it work as the horse she had bought and paid for was either "wanted" for lessons or not available because it had just been working.

Please just walk away from all this. It is just a money-making scam and your child will end up being very unhappy.

 

[black and brown]

The bare-faced cheek of some people never ceases to amaze me!