Help with new horse planting..

Thank you all for taking the time to reply, too many posts to reply individually, but I will be taking everything mentioned a try, which I started last night. Husband walked out with us, and I got on, admittedly with the attitude that we would have a problem which won't have helped. I am trying to get over this mindset. I think a lot of it is the fact in my head I am still riding my old boy who was difficult so always expected a problem. However, I will say that we managed to get all along the road where we have stopped three times before, as soon as he walked out of the gate (where he planted the day before) I was talking to him, moving him forwards with a purposeful walk, which he did. When we got to the yard he'd previously stopped at I kicked him forward as felt him slow, so am paying more attention to his pace already. Didn't stop at the next yard, or the following one where he had previously, so I started to feel a bit more confident. We got to the corner where he has planted, and he did stop, but only briefly and I got him moving again by growling at him and giving him a crack with the whip. He also then didn't stop at the next gate where would not walk past the other day, in fact didn't even glance in the direction, carried on past the building site which he has previously stopped at, and again, didn't even look at it. We got down the track and then he started with the planting. In all honesty even though I was trying, I knew he was going to stop, so will had fed that through to him I guess. I tried some of the suggestions above, cracking my boot with the whip to make a noise, turning him in a tight circle several times, moving from side to side, anything but letting his feet be still. As soon as I tried to get him to go forwards, he wouldn't... almost like he enjoyed being spun in a circle etc! To be fair it was only a few minutes, but he was not moving so my husband led him on whilst I growled at him to walk on. Once walking I made him trot, but he then stopped another 100 yards down the track and again did the same but still wouldn't move, again he was led on. Once more he did it and the same thing, but as soon as he was going he was made to fast trot to the end with me growling at him to trot on as I kept feeling him try to slow. I then made him wait at the end and we had no more problems as we were then on the way home. He looked to me for confidence when someone was pulling their hedge around, which I gave him calmly and told him it was fine whilst pushing forward and he went past ok, gave it a wide berth (fine) but went past and then we got home without stopping again. It's just the going out part I am having issues with. Please tell me that that is some sort of positive victory, that we didn't stop as much? What do I do if the turning circles, walking back, cracking the whip doesn't work when I am on my own? Get off and back on and keep doing so so he doesn't ever go home?
 
Well done, that’s a definite victory! It sounds to me like he is taking the mick a bit. Think about 3 positives from yesterday and when you go out next, focus on them again. Try not to think “he’s going to stop” but more “if he tries to stop, this is what works to get him going so this is what i’ll do. It sound like you can give him a crack with the whip and he won’t overreact so use it if you have to.
 
annagain said:
Well done, that’s a definite victory! It sounds to me like he is taking the mick a bit. Think about 3 positives from yesterday and when you go out next, focus on them again. Try not to think “he’s going to stop” but more “if he tries to stop, this is what works to get him going so this is what i’ll do. It sound like you can give him a crack with the whip and he won’t overreact so use it if you have to.
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I hope so, I was so happy we got along the road without stopping, and then again when he did but I got him going quickly, just annoyed that my other half had to led him on three times, as I would probably still be sitting there now if I was on my own!! I will try to think of the positives, but it will be hard. He doesn't overreact to the whip, doesn't react at all once stopped!
What do I do if the turning circles and everything else doesn't work.... or will it eventually and I just have to sit there for ages before it does? I don't mind this, anything to get us to where we need to be, but didn't know if there was anything else I could try? I am riding out with a friend at the weekend too so hopefully that will help too.
 
Try to get him to step side wards but not in a circle, just from side to side (if you understand what I mean) and then ask him to go forwards again if he does, then praise him if not back to stepping side to side he should realise going forwards is easier
 
HorsesRule2009 said:
Try to get him to step side wards but not in a circle, just from side to side (if you understand what I mean) and then ask him to go forwards again if he does, then praise him if not back to stepping side to side he should realise going forwards is easier
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Ok will give this a go, I do know what you mean I think, just bend him round enough so he has to take a step, but then pull him the other way? Friend is walking out with me Thursday, so will try this when he does it then. Will lunge him this afternoon as I can't ride this evening, just to get that contact and bond building going, and see where we are then.
 
You saw for yourself how when you set out with a determined state of mind he did better. It can be tiring to keep that up if you are not used to it but each time you do you will feel better about it. Make sure you feel for any backing off the aids and go after him at that point so he doesn't get the chance to stop. I've found that leaving the yard at a spanking trot can sometimes help the horse's mindset.
 
if mine do this I either get off and lead or turn the horse round and back it up for as far as it takes then turn it round again and off we go. tends to work for me.
 
I would keep going out with someone on foot or another horse whenever possible and he should start to gain confidence as should you, when he has successfully gone out without stopping, needing a lead, a few times then think about going alone, ideally with someone in the background for a time or two just in case, you need a committed OH who is prepared to keep going but it may be only a few more times before the horse decides to cooperate fully.
 
GG80 said:
I hope so, I was so happy we got along the road without stopping, and then again when he did but I got him going quickly, just annoyed that my other half had to led him on three times, as I would probably still be sitting there now if I was on my own!! I will try to think of the positives, but it will be hard. He doesn't overreact to the whip, doesn't react at all once stopped!
What do I do if the turning circles and everything else doesn't work.... or will it eventually and I just have to sit there for ages before it does? I don't mind this, anything to get us to where we need to be, but didn't know if there was anything else I could try? I am riding out with a friend at the weekend too so hopefully that will help too.
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I know it's hard but you need to try to stop thinking about the 'what ifs'. You've seen what works with him - being determined, planning ahead and trotting past difficult spots so replicate it. He WILL do it and if he doesn't get angry not scared - release your inner hulk! It really worked with my boy when I'd had enough of his napping and went out extra determined - he just sensed I wasn't going to take any nonsense so he didn't give me any! As BP says, keep going with someone on foot until you get all the way round without any help.
 
Well done, you sound to have made good progress. It really is mindset. Are you able to trot across your yard, trot through the gate and keep trotting along the road, in fact just keep trotting. That would be ideal if it was safe. Trotting it is easier to drive on and easier to spot the slightest slowing down.

If you circle, back or whatever you do to keep his feet moving and it doesn't work keep doing it. Just keep irritating him. You may have to do it for a long time. Don't stop, everytime he plants he has to be made to turn, back or do anything however ungainly it looks. You have to sit it out until he gives in. If you just do it a couple of times, he still plants and you get off it adds to his amusement. If you keep on it will eventually get through but it has to be consistent. Think of it as a child wanting sweets at the supermarket till. You say no, the child moans, you say no, the child moans and in the end you give in for a quiet life. The child is trained that it if keeps moaning you will give in. That is what he is learning if you get off.
Are you able to vary the route or even do it in reverse? if you do the same thing each time apart from lacking stimulation for him it will have a lot of "set places" for planting that could become standard. If you have to ride alone and really do need to get off it would be better to do it in your own time not his. Getting off if he won't go rewards him. Perhaps doing a little trot, stopping, backing and then getting off would be better as it is your choice not his. That may get you over the difficult stretches.
 
Following up - I found that the secret is to go in really hard as soon as you feel the slightest intention to stop and do not EVER give in. Sometimes I think you do need to be hard and stop making excuses for the poor little things, some of them really are that clever! I had tried all the taking my time, circling, getting off etc and hitting her with a normal crop, but none of them made any difference and she got worse and worse.

I got a professional in who just hacked her out once and gave her a good few whacks every time she slowed up, then I got on and did the same. After that she still thougt about it for a few rides, but every time (and even if people were nearby) she thought about stopping I really walloped her with the whip and kicked her hard (rubber top spurs). I also made sure that my mare did everything when I told her, e.g. I did not allow her to just drop from canter to walk and generally took charge. She is now a delight to ride, no spurs, and I only use the whip for flies.
 
paddy555 said:
Well done, you sound to have made good progress. It really is mindset. Are you able to trot across your yard, trot through the gate and keep trotting along the road, in fact just keep trotting. That would be ideal if it was safe. Trotting it is easier to drive on and easier to spot the slightest slowing down.

If you circle, back or whatever you do to keep his feet moving and it doesn't work keep doing it. Just keep irritating him. You may have to do it for a long time. Don't stop, everytime he plants he has to be made to turn, back or do anything however ungainly it looks. You have to sit it out until he gives in. If you just do it a couple of times, he still plants and you get off it adds to his amusement. If you keep on it will eventually get through but it has to be consistent. Think of it as a child wanting sweets at the supermarket till. You say no, the child moans, you say no, the child moans and in the end you give in for a quiet life. The child is trained that it if keeps moaning you will give in. That is what he is learning if you get off.
Are you able to vary the route or even do it in reverse? if you do the same thing each time apart from lacking stimulation for him it will have a lot of "set places" for planting that could become standard. If you have to ride alone and really do need to get off it would be better to do it in your own time not his. Getting off if he won't go rewards him. Perhaps doing a little trot, stopping, backing and then getting off would be better as it is your choice not his. That may get you over the difficult stretches.
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Ok, all taken on board and this is what I will do. I will just have to think to hell with what anybody who happens to be about thinks, even if it they find it amusing. I could do the same route in reverse yes, so will maybe try that, my thinking was just get him walking round one route, the same way without stopping and then tackle changes. But if you think this could help get him past his sticking points as he will then be heading home, I will give it a go. You make perfect sense in everything you say, and I definitely need to harden up and stop making excuses for his behaviour.

Petalpoos said:
Following up - I found that the secret is to go in really hard as soon as you feel the slightest intention to stop and do not EVER give in. Sometimes I think you do need to be hard and stop making excuses for the poor little things, some of them really are that clever! I had tried all the taking my time, circling, getting off etc and hitting her with a normal crop, but none of them made any difference and she got worse and worse.

I got a professional in who just hacked her out once and gave her a good few whacks every time she slowed up, then I got on and did the same. After that she still thougt about it for a few rides, but every time (and even if people were nearby) she thought about stopping I really walloped her with the whip and kicked her hard (rubber top spurs). I also made sure that my mare did everything when I told her, e.g. I did not allow her to just drop from canter to walk and generally took charge. She is now a delight to ride, no spurs, and I only use the whip for flies.
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His previous owner did say he planted with her first year of having him, which she put down to not being schooled, but perhaps he is like you say, just that clever. My husband did say he could hear the fear in my voice when he planted last night (past experiences on a difficult horse, who was extremely unpredictable) so if he can hear it, so can my horse. If I don't succeed, I have been speaking with his old owner and she will come and help me if I need, but we are going to give it another week of riding out with someone walking and another horse to see where we are then. If that doesn't work, then I do know someone who is of very high standing who will probably help and ride him out if I ask her. We will get there, I am sure of that!
 
GG80, it doesn't matter what anyone thinks, those who find it amusing have probably all been there at some time. Trying to get just one route correct sets it up for plants as it becomes predictable. Do something unpredictable, set off at a trot, trot for a mile and then just turn round and walk home on a loose rein. Something like that. If he walks along he has plenty of time to think. Try trot 5 strides walk 5 strides, a couple of half halts. Something to break the cycle of his boredom and time to think. Get him concentrating on you.

You are doing great and will have a lovely horse once he has learned the rules. When you got to tack him up march up to him, march up to the mounting block. Don't think, there cannot be any room for doubts in your mind. Don't wonder how he will be today. You are marching up there and your attitude is "I will kill you you little wretch if you don't get it right". Remember it takes seconds for him to assess you and he has worked out your mood before you even get into the yard.
 
paddy555 said:
GG80, it doesn't matter what anyone thinks, those who find it amusing have probably all been there at some time. Trying to get just one route correct sets it up for plants as it becomes predictable. Do something unpredictable, set off at a trot, trot for a mile and then just turn round and walk home on a loose rein. Something like that. If he walks along he has plenty of time to think. Try trot 5 strides walk 5 strides, a couple of half halts. Something to break the cycle of his boredom and time to think. Get him concentrating on you.

You are doing great and will have a lovely horse once he has learned the rules. When you got to tack him up march up to him, march up to the mounting block. Don't think, there cannot be any room for doubts in your mind. Don't wonder how he will be today. You are marching up there and your attitude is "I will kill you you little wretch if you don't get it right". Remember it takes seconds for him to assess you and he has worked out your mood before you even get into the yard.
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Thanks Paddy, for all your time and advice - Has really helped and I will definitely be taking it all on board. I am a little 'come on sweetheart let's see if we can get it right today' when I go to get him in and tack him, so I am really not helping myself am I! I will be more assertive whilst doing it, with no hesitation getting on. I will also try the trotting up to the end of the road and turning round and walking back, but think I will try the hacking route in reverse first, as already I am thinking if I trot to the point where he stops on the corner, and then turn him for home, that's what he will then think he does. I can't go the other way as it goes towards a busy road. I did stop him a few times and made him stand on the way home last night to get him listening to what I want him to do, and he moved off first ask each time... but that was after we had to overcome the planting! I shall harden myself up!
 
Definitely an improvement there! Well done :-)
I would see if he is prepared to follow your OH while you do your riding bit, rather than actually being led, or even see if your OH could drive him on from behind, as I feel that this makes it more into your riding that achieves the victory, if you know what I mean!
 
I also remember reading somewhere about training a Highland Pony to speed up a bit on rides by keeping back half of their feed until they got back from the ride! So, give them half, take the bowl away and put it to one side ( in sight out of reach), get on and ride, and straight on return let them finish it off! This rather novel method might appeal to a cobby sort.
 
I haven’t read all the replies but just wanted to reassure you with my experience with my mare.
She did it a couple of times with her old owner when she was younger. Came to me and did it a couple of times in the first month or 2. She now doesn’t do it at all so hopefully it’s just a settling in stage.
 
Tarragon said:
Definitely an improvement there! Well done :)
I would see if he is prepared to follow your OH while you do your riding bit, rather than actually being led, or even see if your OH could drive him on from behind, as I feel that this makes it more into your riding that achieves the victory, if you know what I mean!
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Could try this with my friend when she walks out with me yes, will try anything! Would help me more doing this so in my head I think it is me getting him going!

Tarragon said:
I also remember reading somewhere about training a Highland Pony to speed up a bit on rides by keeping back half of their feed until they got back from the ride! So, give them half, take the bowl away and put it to one side ( in sight out of reach), get on and ride, and straight on return let them finish it off! This rather novel method might appeal to a cobby sort.
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Ha ha, I like the idea, but if he is anything like my old boy and food, he wouldn't move off the spot if he knew there was food left!!!

Translationsneeded said:
I haven’t read all the replies but just wanted to reassure you with my experience with my mare.
She did it a couple of times with her old owner when she was younger. Came to me and did it a couple of times in the first month or 2. She now doesn’t do it at all so hopefully it’s just a settling in stage.
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I really hope this is the case. His previous owner messaged me earlier to see how he was going, and is convinced he is just being stubborn, but she is more than happy to come and help if we are no further forward after this weekends tries.
 
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I've ridden a few nappy horses and to be honest it something I can find quite stressful and I have to be careful to stay positive when dealing with napping as it is easy to get into a negative mindset and let it cloud your opinion of an otherwise lovely horse.

You have already some great advice, especially always trying to plan a circular route and moving the horse to the side rather than forwards to get the feet moving. If you have a school / field available I would also work on getting the horse responding well to forward aids in the school and maybe avoid hacking for a couple of weeks to give yourself chance to bond with him and have some (hopefully) easy wins.

I have found waiting the horse out does work in the end when I had quite a sharp mare who napped. More leg used to result in her threatening to go up when she planted but if I sat eventually she would fidget and then move on and gradually she stopped napping.

As a last resort clicker training could help but it sounds like being in a new environment has unsettled him and has resorted to old habits. Both my current and last loan horse had problems in the early days and and I look back now and can't believe that the first downright scared me with her spookiness and my current planted like your boy but in the school not hacking. I'm sure you'll get there with him :)
 
You are marching up there and your attitude is "I will kill you you little wretch if you don't get it right". Remember it takes seconds for him to assess you and he has worked out your mood before you even get into the yard.
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While I agree that you need to have a determined and positive attitude with no doubts, I don't agree with the above thought.

I don't consider horses to be 'wretches' and I don't think about killing them (even as a threat) and I don't whip or spur mine hard. You don't need to be that aggressive to overcome nappy-ness.
 
There is some very sound advice and you are building on it, keep going! Remember you can be persistent without being horrid to your horse(which you obviously don't want to do) and you have some tools up your sleeve now.
The other thing which may help as an add on is doing some ground work in hand, reinforcing the idea that you move his feet. (without going all horse whispery ) If you can lunge him ok, work on moving him around the school (or where ever you lunge), varying the sizes of circles and pace (taking care that he is comfortable to do this). If you look at how someone such as Richard Maxwell does groundwork stuff it may help.(There are others) I suggest this not as a miracle cure but as a way of you gaining confidence in your ability to control the movement of his feet and develop your relationship with him. This can help when you are getting him to move his feet when you are riding.
You can do this when leading a horse as well, just getting them to stand, back up, change direction when going about daily handling just reinforces that idea that when the tack or headcollar is on, you are in charge.
 
Faracat said:
While I agree that you need to have a determined and positive attitude with no doubts, I don't agree with the above thought.

I don't consider horses to be 'wretches' and I don't think about killing them (even as a threat) and I don't whip or spur mine hard. You don't need to be that aggressive to overcome nappy-ness.
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oh come on, I am trying to boost the owner's mindset, I am hardly suggesting she really kill the little "wretch" :eek:
 
paddy555 said:
oh come on, I am trying to boost the owner's mindset, I am hardly suggesting she really kill the little "wretch" :eek:
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Having seen people who genuinely think that intentionally having the horse more scared of them than anything else is 'good training' I'm afraid that I didn't see the joke.
 
Faracat said:
Having seen people who genuinely think that intentionally having the horse more scared of them than anything else is 'good training' I'm afraid that I didn't see the joke.
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before making that comment have you actually read this thread? does it appear likely that OP's horse is more scared of her? my comments were aimed at OP and her horse and the circumstances they find themselves in to try and make suggestions that may help. They are not a general discussion of good training/scared horses or anything else.
 
Berpisc said:
There is some very sound advice and you are building on it, keep going! Remember you can be persistent without being horrid to your horse(which you obviously don't want to do) and you have some tools up your sleeve now.
The other thing which may help as an add on is doing some ground work in hand, reinforcing the idea that you move his feet. (without going all horse whispery ) If you can lunge him ok, work on moving him around the school (or where ever you lunge), varying the sizes of circles and pace (taking care that he is comfortable to do this). If you look at how someone such as Richard Maxwell does groundwork stuff it may help.(There are others) I suggest this not as a miracle cure but as a way of you gaining confidence in your ability to control the movement of his feet and develop your relationship with him. This can help when you are getting him to move his feet when you are riding.
You can do this when leading a horse as well, just getting them to stand, back up, change direction when going about daily handling just reinforces that idea that when the tack or headcollar is on, you are in charge.
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No, I definitely don't want to be horrid to him, but I do need to harden myself up and stop being so fluffy and making excuses for his behaviour. I did lunge him the first few days I got him home and he was fine, foot perfect and did as I asked, but then started hacking him out and the planting started, so probably (definitely) haven't given either of us enough time to form that bond and for him to gain respect for me. I lunged him yesterday and it proved as such, he was hard work,when given an instruction we had bucking, squealing, kicking out (not at me) and doing what he wanted. However, I do feel good that by the end of the 30 minute session, he was doing only as I asked, transitioning from walk to trot and back to walk, going from a few strides to longer and back to short to keep his mind working and focused on me. Took a few growls and cracks of the whip, he did stop but a short, firm, 'walk on' and he moved. It was like lunging a stroppy teenager, he got praise when deserved, but I do feel we had got somewhere by the end. I think he was wondering where the nice calm, soft lady had gone! Was talking to his old owner last night some more and she is convinced he is just trying it and it should take just a couple of times for me to 'win' a battle and he'll be fine. She did say when we brought him home to be fair, that he was the sort to 'test' once he had been with us a few weeks, and it is tieing in perfectly!

Faracat said:
Having seen people who genuinely think that intentionally having the horse more scared of them than anything else is 'good training' I'm afraid that I didn't see the joke.
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I clearly have no intention of making my boy scared of me, I just want that nice relationship where we can both have respect for each other and fun, the advice I have been given here has helped a lot with my mindset, and I needed to be told I was being a bit to mamby pamby with him because he was in a new home etc, and posters here have given me that confidence boost I needed.
 
Hello GG80,

When I read your post, I was reminded of something I read in a book by Tom Roberts. It's on my bookshelf so I have quoted from it. It's long, so you'll need a cup of tea to go with it.

Don't get disheartened though. The horse that Tom Roberts refers to is faaaaaaaaaaaaaar worse than your fellow, who to me sounds like a lovely boy. You've just got a few teething troubles to sort out.

Without further ado, here's the quote (but first, just to put you in the picture, Tom Roberts is recalling the time when a brilliant horseman by the name of Captain J.J. Pearce visited
the military riding school where Tom was training):

One particular morning during one of these inspiring talks and demonstrations, one of the students chirped up, "That's all right for you, Sir, with your trained horses that you've had since they were broken in, but how would you deal with some of the outlaws we have here?"

I can still see the intent look on the faces of my fellow students as we waited for a reply.

"A fair question. A v-e-r-y fair question," the captain drawled in reply. "Tomorrow, bring me your fourteen worst horses."

At nine o'clock the next morning, with keen anticipation we produced the required number of what we considered our most difficult horses. One after the other, Pearce rode them, and no matter what their particular vices might have been, he was able to ride them and make them do what he wanted.

He lectured and demonstrated as he rode each horse. Our estimation of his skill rose sharply, as to our surprise and admiration he seemed to have little trouble in getting them to do as he wished---and they were a very mixed bag.

It was nearly 11.30 a.m. when the last horse for the morning was brought up. We were all most keen to see what he did --- or couldn't do --- with this horse, for it was a notorious jibber.

The Captain mounted, sat talking for a short time, then in the middle of his talk he drew out a watch from the fob pocket of his waistcoat. Glancing at it, he said, "Half past eleven. It is getting late. I'll finish now Gentlemen; take this horse back to the stables and I will start with him first thing tomorrow. Good morning, Gentlemen."

The next morning we were there in readiness [with his first horse, the jibber]. There was quite an air of expectation among us.

In horse regiments, this type of horse was not uncommon: horses that would work well in the ranks with other horses but which were useless for individual work such as scouting etc. This horse was a confirmed jibber. He would not move when ridden alone. He just stood.

We were all eyes -- and ears. How would the Captain fare with this horse?

Promptly at 9.00 a.m. the Captain mounted and began to talk, as was usual. He was a most interesting lecturer and he went on and on. He made no attempt to move the horse, which was what we students were all waiting to see.

He talked and he talked. It was not until about 11.30 a.m. that the captain withdrew his watch and appeared very surprised that it was so late.

"I am sorry Gentlemen, he said. "I had no idea I've been speaking for so long. Now... what is the matter with this horse?"

"Try and get him to move!" yelled several voices simultaneously.

To our utter astonishment and confusion, the horse cantered straight off down the school.

After a few minutes work, the Captain returned smiling. And in his most charming manner, said, as he halted in front of us, "Gentlemen: I have deceived you. Yesterday when I mounted this horse, I immediately recognised that I had to deal with a jibber. I could feel he was determined not to move. The hour was late and I knew I would need time. Always allow yourself time when about to start on a difficult horse, whatever the difficulties he presents.

This morning at nine o'clock, I mounted this horse with several hours ahead of me. The horse was determined not to be ridden forward. But I, too, was determined not to move.

At half past nine, we were both determined not to move.

Ten o'clock came, and he was still determined not to move. So was I.

At ten thirty, I could feel he was starting to become a little restive. But I was still determined not to move.

Now, at 11.30, we are both ready to move."

From: Horse Control, Reminiscences by Tom Roberts.

What I think you should do is to lead your boy along the road where you cannot afford to stand about, and when you get to a safe place (but which is not on the way home), mount. If your fellow plants at any time. Just sit there, like the Captain did. And only move off when you decide to move off.

It is not comfortable for a horse to stand about with a rider on board. It is not a rest. Walking with a rider on board is far easier on the horse than is standing. Make sure you wait him out and never mind what any passer-by might think.

I definitely would not use reinback in an attempt to make him go forward. Patience is the key... plus it is a lot safer.

Have fun with this training. Think of it as a challenge. You have the sort of horse I'd love to have and if I lived anywhere near you I'd offer you a decent sum if ever you wanted to sell him.

: )
 
Lois Lame said:
Hello GG80,

When I read your post, I was reminded of something I read in a book by Tom Roberts. It's on my bookshelf so I have quoted from it. It's long, so you'll need a cup of tea to go with it.

Don't get disheartened though. The horse that Tom Roberts refers to is faaaaaaaaaaaaaar worse than your fellow, who to me sounds like a lovely boy. You've just got a few teething troubles to sort out.

Without further ado, here's the quote (but first, just to put you in the picture, Tom Roberts is recalling the time when a brilliant horseman by the name of Captain J.J. Pearce visited
the military riding school where Tom was training):

One particular morning during one of these inspiring talks and demonstrations, one of the students chirped up, "That's all right for you, Sir, with your trained horses that you've had since they were broken in, but how would you deal with some of the outlaws we have here?"

I can still see the intent look on the faces of my fellow students as we waited for a reply.

"A fair question. A v-e-r-y fair question," the captain drawled in reply. "Tomorrow, bring me your fourteen worst horses."

At nine o'clock the next morning, with keen anticipation we produced the required number of what we considered our most difficult horses. One after the other, Pearce rode them, and no matter what their particular vices might have been, he was able to ride them and make them do what he wanted.

He lectured and demonstrated as he rode each horse. Our estimation of his skill rose sharply, as to our surprise and admiration he seemed to have little trouble in getting them to do as he wished---and they were a very mixed bag.

It was nearly 11.30 a.m. when the last horse for the morning was brought up. We were all most keen to see what he did --- or couldn't do --- with this horse, for it was a notorious jibber.

The Captain mounted, sat talking for a short time, then in the middle of his talk he drew out a watch from the fob pocket of his waistcoat. Glancing at it, he said, "Half past eleven. It is getting late. I'll finish now Gentlemen; take this horse back to the stables and I will start with him first thing tomorrow. Good morning, Gentlemen."

The next morning we were there in readiness [with his first horse, the jibber]. There was quite an air of expectation among us.

In horse regiments, this type of horse was not uncommon: horses that would work well in the ranks with other horses but which were useless for individual work such as scouting etc. This horse was a confirmed jibber. He would not move when ridden alone. He just stood.

We were all eyes -- and ears. How would the Captain fare with this horse?

Promptly at 9.00 a.m. the Captain mounted and began to talk, as was usual. He was a most interesting lecturer and he went on and on. He made no attempt to move the horse, which was what we students were all waiting to see.

He talked and he talked. It was not until about 11.30 a.m. that the captain withdrew his watch and appeared very surprised that it was so late.

"I am sorry Gentlemen, he said. "I had no idea I've been speaking for so long. Now... what is the matter with this horse?"

"Try and get him to move!" yelled several voices simultaneously.

To our utter astonishment and confusion, the horse cantered straight off down the school.

After a few minutes work, the Captain returned smiling. And in his most charming manner, said, as he halted in front of us, "Gentlemen: I have deceived you. Yesterday when I mounted this horse, I immediately recognised that I had to deal with a jibber. I could feel he was determined not to move. The hour was late and I knew I would need time. Always allow yourself time when about to start on a difficult horse, whatever the difficulties he presents.

This morning at nine o'clock, I mounted this horse with several hours ahead of me. The horse was determined not to be ridden forward. But I, too, was determined not to move.

At half past nine, we were both determined not to move.

Ten o'clock came, and he was still determined not to move. So was I.

At ten thirty, I could feel he was starting to become a little restive. But I was still determined not to move.

Now, at 11.30, we are both ready to move."

From: Horse Control, Reminiscences by Tom Roberts.

What I think you should do is to lead your boy along the road where you cannot afford to stand about, and when you get to a safe place (but which is not on the way home), mount. If your fellow plants at any time. Just sit there, like the Captain did. And only move off when you decide to move off.

It is not comfortable for a horse to stand about with a rider on board. It is not a rest. Walking with a rider on board is far easier on the horse than is standing. Make sure you wait him out and never mind what any passer-by might think.

I definitely would not use reinback in an attempt to make him go forward. Patience is the key... plus it is a lot safer.

Have fun with this training. Think of it as a challenge. You have the sort of horse I'd love to have and if I lived anywhere near you I'd offer you a decent sum if ever you wanted to sell him.

: )
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Thank you for taking the time to post this.

I have been working together with my boy for the last few days and I finally feel we are gaining that trust in each other and learning about the other one... because three times now we have been out, and he hasn't planted once. Went out with a friend on Thursday evening, he planted in the same place down the marsh track and on the corner, but did get him going after a few gruff walk on's, trotted him along the marsh track and gave him a stern walk on whenever I felt him try and slow, and we made it round with no further stops. Took him back round the section where he plants, he stopped again, but I just kept unbalancing him and each time he had to take a step forward, so he was getting a mixture of good boys when he stepped forwards and gruff walk ons when he stopped, it worked, within two minutes he'd gone past it. Took him out the following evening with a friend on a bike, and he didn't stop once. Then with a friend Sat morning and he led the entire way round, even got him past some cows when we went a different route without much argument from him. Sunday afternoon took him out again with a friend on her bike, but she stayed well back so he didn't know she was even there... and.... not a problem. Really feel he might be starting to listen to me now and placing that bit of trust. He is having the day off today as he has done a lot of work this last week (for him) and then back on it tomorrow to see how he goes. Not sure whether to chance it alone, or still get friend to come out with us like yesterday just in case, but, I definitely feel we are getting there and so does his previous owner who has been asking and also giving advice. So thank you to all the advice on here, I took it all on board and it seems to be working. I am under no illusion that he won't do it again, but for the moment if I can get him round that one route without planting, by the time I change routes, I am hoping we will have enough trust and confidence in each other that he will go forward when I ask.
 
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