Hillside Animal Sanctuary show their investigation into Horse Cruelty on Sky News 19t

It is not fewer horse abattoirs but more properly regulated and controlled.
It is terrible that this has happened and I feel for the poor animals involved but hopefully it was a short time and over relatively quickly which is more than can be said for those well meaning people that rescue a foal with no idea on how to care for it. Those poor mites are often starved restored to good health starved again and pushed from pillar to post through sales rings before being herded into a lorry and traveled hundreds if not thousands of miles to their death. It can only be good that they meet their end quickly. I have seen what some horses are like at rescue centers and a good percentage would be better off if they could be PTS before the long process of rehabilitation only to end up in pain and hobbling around or standing heads hanging in misery and boredom.
It is a horse owners responsibility to do the right thing by their animals but I am not surprised at the lack of care and humanity involved after all they wouldnt be bred if the owners had any sense of responsibility.
I hope the slaughter house involved get to stay open and they are disciplined and get good people in to do the job properly. To close yet another one is a step in the wrong direction but the process should be as humane as possible. the nearer the market to the slaughterhouse the better
 
Alec as another poster has stated you have experience with slaughter work, how do you feel about the horse being stunned/killed in front of the other? i am in 2 minds about it, as a herd animal their stress levels must go through the roof when separated from others especially if feral/unhandled previously. i dont think they really register what has happened to the other

my friend had her 2 old ponies shot on the same day 4 yrs ago and the local huntsman came and carried out the deed, her husband held one leadrope in each hand and the huntsman dropped one and then the other, there was no panic or fanfare, she then walked the others horses out to see the bodies again no panic just a sniff or nuzzle then grazed right next to the bodies because all the horses were so calm they left them grazing and went and had a cuppa before putting the horses in the stables where they could not see what was going on whilst they loaded and removed the bodies of the fallen.

if they had separated the 2 old ponies to do them individually the panic and stress would have been tremendous
 
Natch said:
The news report said Rspca would be INVESTIGATING, which doesn't give much away.

I have mixed feelings about Hillside, but
Click to expand...

As always the RSPCA take time off 'soft prosecutions' when something like this happens, to be shown as the good guys, if they were the good guys things like this would never have been allowed to happen in the first place it was a licenced abbatoir for heavens sake. Too many puppy cuddlers in the RSPCA rather than realistic down to earth animal people - shakes head and walks away.............
 
tweedette said:
As always the RSPCA take time off 'soft prosecutions' when something like this happens, to be shown as the good guys, if they were the good guys things like this would never have been allowed to happen in the first place it was a licenced abbatoir for heavens sake. Too many puppy cuddlers in the RSPCA rather than realistic down to earth animal people - shakes head and walks away.............
Click to expand...

FGS, so because the RSPCA are investigating it, they are in the wrong now too?!

The RSPCA cannot sit around in every single abbattoir every second of the day, just incase something goes wrong. It should be down to local authorities to be monitoring this sort of thing.
 
Last edited:
I'm afraid I don't understand tweedette's post at all :confused:

My post was merely to point out that the article says RSPCA are investigating it. For any charity to investigate any claim of cruelty, they need to have it drawn to their attention, and hillside have done just that. Rspca cannot and should not be poking around every abatoir just in case. Thats why I wonder why Hillside were there but again, mixed feelings. I don't feel comfortable about undercover footage being filmed, but they DID find stuff, so were they justified? Probably. But PETA has published similar footage, obtained deceitfully and published to shock, but the slaughterhouse involved was acting in line with the law. That might have been turners too? It was a few years ago now.
 
The local authority licences and should do spot checks on the abattoir. There should be a vet on site during killing days too. These people have obviously missed the signs that something is wrong. RSPCA have no right to enter an abattoir without a complaint ad who's to see what goes on other than the workers and the animals?
If abattoirs had glass walls there would be far more vegetarians
 
Jools1234 said:
Alec as another poster has stated you have experience with slaughter work, how do you feel about the horse being stunned/killed in front of the other? .......

.......
Click to expand...

I, like you, am in two minds, and would say that it would depend upon the condition of the horses, how they were coping with being contained, and the available facilities.

I once shot two elderly horses which had spent the last 20 years of their lives together without separation at any time, and the owner, a wise Lady, asked if it would be possible to send them both down, together. I dropped the first, the second turned around, looked at her chum, and she joined her. There was a 5-6 second delay between them, and the waiting horse hadn't a clue what was happening.

Wild or feral ponies would actually benefit from standing beside a companion. Putting a wild and panicking horse into a shooting box, alone, would be cruelty in the extreme, and despite what the laws tell us, the welfare of the animal should be at the forefront of our minds.

Horses which can be handled, should never go in to a shooting box, in my view. They should always be led, and held in a room, one set aside for the purpose.

When horses are contained in a shooting box, then it's academic how they're shot. When they stand in a room, then they should have a free bullet, and not a Captive Bolt. With a CB there is always the risk that the horse can plunge forwards, on top of the slaughterman. With an FB, they seem less likely to, or so it seems to me.

Within this section, but on the rspca thread, I've offered up a connection to The Humane Slaughter Association. Few of you will have even heard of them. Could I suggest that you study their website, view their quite remarkable list of achievements, and whilst bearing in mind that every single man who is part of the governing body, if not a practising, is a qualified slaughterman.

I can almost feel a campaign coming on!! It's high time that ALL the animal welfare bodies, the WHW, rspca, the BHS, Redwings and Hillside, all of them, grouped together to campaign for correct slaughter, a value for the horse carcass, and by so doing, this appalling and shambolic state of affairs should end.

It's do-able, I just don't know if I can be arsed.

Alec.
 
tweedette said:
As always the RSPCA take time off 'soft prosecutions' when something like this happens, to be shown as the good guys, if they were the good guys things like this would never have been allowed to happen in the first place it was a licenced abbatoir for heavens sake. Too many puppy cuddlers in the RSPCA rather than realistic down to earth animal people - shakes head and walks away.............
Click to expand...

Really? This is going to break down into a another RSPCA bashing, REALLY?
I do not understand this post at all. I cant be bothered to go through the obvious glaring errors because something tells me that if the RSPCA was doing the exact opposite and NOT investigating this poster would have something negative to say about that too.
 
Alec Swan said:
I, like you, am in two minds, and would say that it would depend upon the condition of the horses, how they were coping with being contained, and the available facilities.

I once shot two elderly horses which had spent the last 20 years of their lives together without separation at any time, and the owner, a wise Lady, asked if it would be possible to send them both down, together. I dropped the first, the second turned around, looked at her chum, and she joined her. There was a 5-6 second delay between them, and the waiting horse hadn't a clue what was happening.

Wild or feral ponies would actually benefit from standing beside a companion. Putting a wild and panicking horse into a shooting box, alone, would be cruelty in the extreme, and despite what the laws tell us, the welfare of the animal should be at the forefront of our minds.

Horses which can be handled, should never go in to a shooting box, in my view. They should always be led, and held in a room, one set aside for the purpose.

When horses are contained in a shooting box, then it's academic how they're shot. When they stand in a room, then they should have a free bullet, and not a Captive Bolt. With a CB there is always the risk that the horse can plunge forwards, on top of the slaughterman. With an FB, they seem less likely to, or so it seems to me.

Within this section, but on the rspca thread, I've offered up a connection to The Humane Slaughter Association. Few of you will have even heard of them. Could I suggest that you study their website, view their quite remarkable list of achievements, and whilst bearing in mind that every single man who is part of the governing body, if not a practising, is a qualified slaughterman.

I can almost feel a campaign coming on!! It's high time that ALL the animal welfare bodies, the WHW, rspca, the BHS, Redwings and Hillside, all of them, grouped together to campaign for correct slaughter, a value for the horse carcass, and by so doing, this appalling and shambolic state of affairs should end.

It's do-able, I just don't know if I can be arsed.

Alec.
Click to expand...
Hear! Hear! Please do it Alec Swan. ^^^
 
Alec Swan said:
I, like you, am in two minds, and would say that it would depend upon the condition of the horses, how they were coping with being contained, and the available facilities.

I once shot two elderly horses which had spent the last 20 years of their lives together without separation at any time, and the owner, a wise Lady, asked if it would be possible to send them both down, together. I dropped the first, the second turned around, looked at her chum, and she joined her. There was a 5-6 second delay between them, and the waiting horse hadn't a clue what was happening.

Wild or feral ponies would actually benefit from standing beside a companion. Putting a wild and panicking horse into a shooting box, alone, would be cruelty in the extreme, and despite what the laws tell us, the welfare of the animal should be at the forefront of our minds.

Horses which can be handled, should never go in to a shooting box, in my view. They should always be led, and held in a room, one set aside for the purpose.

When horses are contained in a shooting box, then it's academic how they're shot. When they stand in a room, then they should have a free bullet, and not a Captive Bolt. With a CB there is always the risk that the horse can plunge forwards, on top of the slaughterman. With an FB, they seem less likely to, or so it seems to me.

Within this section, but on the rspca thread, I've offered up a connection to The Humane Slaughter Association. Few of you will have even heard of them. Could I suggest that you study their website, view their quite remarkable list of achievements, and whilst bearing in mind that every single man who is part of the governing body, if not a practising, is a qualified slaughterman.

I can almost feel a campaign coming on!! It's high time that ALL the animal welfare bodies, the WHW, rspca, the BHS, Redwings and Hillside, all of them, grouped together to campaign for correct slaughter, a value for the horse carcass, and by so doing, this appalling and shambolic state of affairs should end.

It's do-able, I just don't know if I can be arsed.

Alec.
Click to expand...

Good post. Was not impressed with that video slaughter is a job that has to be done but there is good practise and thugs. This showed nothing but thugs as far as I am concerned.
 
Alec Swan said:
I, like you, am in two minds, and would say that it would depend upon the condition of the horses, how they were coping with being contained, and the available facilities.

I once shot two elderly horses which had spent the last 20 years of their lives together without separation at any time, and the owner, a wise Lady, asked if it would be possible to send them both down, together. I dropped the first, the second turned around, looked at her chum, and she joined her. There was a 5-6 second delay between them, and the waiting horse hadn't a clue what was happening.

Wild or feral ponies would actually benefit from standing beside a companion. Putting a wild and panicking horse into a shooting box, alone, would be cruelty in the extreme, and despite what the laws tell us, the welfare of the animal should be at the forefront of our minds.

Horses which can be handled, should never go in to a shooting box, in my view. They should always be led, and held in a room, one set aside for the purpose.

When horses are contained in a shooting box, then it's academic how they're shot. When they stand in a room, then they should have a free bullet, and not a Captive Bolt. With a CB there is always the risk that the horse can plunge forwards, on top of the slaughterman. With an FB, they seem less likely to, or so it seems to me.

Within this section, but on the rspca thread, I've offered up a connection to The Humane Slaughter Association. Few of you will have even heard of them. Could I suggest that you study their website, view their quite remarkable list of achievements, and whilst bearing in mind that every single man who is part of the governing body, if not a practising, is a qualified slaughterman.

I can almost feel a campaign coming on!! It's high time that ALL the animal welfare bodies, the WHW, rspca, the BHS, Redwings and Hillside, all of them, grouped together to campaign for correct slaughter, a value for the horse carcass, and by so doing, this appalling and shambolic state of affairs should end.

It's do-able, I just don't know if I can be arsed.

Alec.
Click to expand...

A really excellent post Alec. 100% agreement.

Plus although you will not like this because of your sustained RSPCA bashing and most recent post on the other thread. Far from being useless and inept a successful investigation and prosecution of this case by the RSPCA would only encourage this idea and add fuel to the fire.
 
MillieMoomie could you just clear something up for me please? Are you the same person as Moomin1? And if not, do you know Moomin1 outside of the forum? Just wondering, as your posts are incredibly alike.
 
Natch said:
MillieMoomie could you just clear something up for me please? Are you the same person as Moomin1? And if not, do you know Moomin1 outside of the forum? Just wondering, as your posts are incredibly alike.
Click to expand...

I will answer that, no, I am not MillieMoomie, and I have no idea who MillieMoomie is either. I have actually messaged MM previously to make sure he/she (assuming it's a she) makes it clear that we are not the same person, as my views on things are my own, and I don't want any confusion on that.

I certainly wouldn't feel the need to create a different profile to get my points across. I feel I do that pretty well already! ;)
 
Natch said:
MillieMoomie could you just clear something up for me please? Are you the same person as Moomin1? And if not, do you know Moomin1 outside of the forum? Just wondering, as your posts are incredibly alike.
Click to expand...

Hi Natch thanks for asking politely, i joined a few months ago to read, but only started posting this week and a few people have been incredibly rude in their accusations. Its like ive had to justify my existence!! The reason i started posting was that in light of recent bashings of a certain charity i just couldnt keep reading the quite frankly idiotic, inaccurate and stupid threads without saying something! To my surprise i'm finding i quite enjoy it!

No is the answer to all your questions, and i would like to publicly apologise to Moomin for causing trouble! When i was creating my username i just used the name of my favourite animal! Perhaps H&H should tell you if your username is similar and you have similar views!!

I would also dare to suggest that if Moomin or ANYONE wanted to create another username for themselves to use, wouldnt they purposefully create a totally different one to avoid suspicion?
 
Thanks both of you. I wasn't suggesting either of you were trolling because I credit you both with the intelligence to use totally different names if you wanted to do that ;) but a few of us have a different account for a mobile device for example, or because we have forgotton the password but it's still logged in on one of your devices, IYSWIM. In that case then there is every reason to make your username similar, and I had wondered if that was the case here. Another reason may be a friend joining to back the other poster up, it's happened before.

Anyhoo, pleased to know now that you are two entirely different people, thanks for clearing that up and millymoomie yes it is rather addictive around here! :p
 
Let's not digress from the thread in hand please, for me it lessens the respect we show these animals.

A good life and a good death is what we owe all livestock; I visited Potter's years ago and could never have imagined the professionalism and dignity present in all the staff there that I met.

No air of misery there, peaceful, calm surroundings, nothing upset when it was being unloaded, be it thoroughbred or shire. All were led through nearly immediately and despatched with the minimum of fuss.
I'm not sure of the answer to batch-stunning, surely for these unhandled hill ponies it's less stressful that they go together.
They don't know they're being stunned and then to be winched up and bled out.

People always say the less stress in the animal then the better the meat...

A shame footage of the correct procedures was not shown on SKY to give a balanced view to those who have not seen slaughtering.
Along with Alec, I have nothing but respect for those who do the job; it's necessary and shouldn't be viewed with disgust or distaste.
 
The RSPCA appear damned whatever they do. If they don't have the right to check on a premises without permission then their hands are effectively tied.

If local authorities are supposed to monitor what happens in abattoirs do they announce their visits? If they do then I'm sure everything will be very well run when their audits are conducted.

As Alec said it all needs to be joined up. It's too easy to pass the blame or responsibility onto another body when failures such as this happens.

With regards to the meat from the animals slaughtered, what degree of traceability is there? Could someone somewhere be consuming meat heavily laden with medicines?

Why is it that some people are always negative about a charities motives. Hillside acted as they thought fit and then get criticised for courting the media and fundraising ??

Read the article but could not watch. There is only so much my mind can erase after seeing unpleasant images :(
 
Alec Swan said:
I, like you, am in two minds, and would say that it would depend upon the condition of the horses, how they were coping with being contained, and the available facilities.

I once shot two elderly horses which had spent the last 20 years of their lives together without separation at any time, and the owner, a wise Lady, asked if it would be possible to send them both down, together. I dropped the first, the second turned around, looked at her chum, and she joined her. There was a 5-6 second delay between them, and the waiting horse hadn't a clue what was happening.

Wild or feral ponies would actually benefit from standing beside a companion. Putting a wild and panicking horse into a shooting box, alone, would be cruelty in the extreme, and despite what the laws tell us, the welfare of the animal should be at the forefront of our minds.

Horses which can be handled, should never go in to a shooting box, in my view. They should always be led, and held in a room, one set aside for the purpose.

When horses are contained in a shooting box, then it's academic how they're shot. When they stand in a room, then they should have a free bullet, and not a Captive Bolt. With a CB there is always the risk that the horse can plunge forwards, on top of the slaughterman. With an FB, they seem less likely to, or so it seems to me.

Within this section, but on the rspca thread, I've offered up a connection to The Humane Slaughter Association. Few of you will have even heard of them. Could I suggest that you study their website, view their quite remarkable list of achievements, and whilst bearing in mind that every single man who is part of the governing body, if not a practising, is a qualified slaughterman.

I can almost feel a campaign coming on!! It's high time that ALL the animal welfare bodies, the WHW, rspca, the BHS, Redwings and Hillside, all of them, grouped together to campaign for correct slaughter, a value for the horse carcass, and by so doing, this appalling and shambolic state of affairs should end.

It's do-able, I just don't know if I can be arsed.

Alec.
Click to expand...

Really interesting point about stress and separation for unhandled horses... however having viewed the Sky News report I'm pretty certain that those in the clip were not unhandled and the stunning should have been done separately..

Has anyone come across the work of Temple Grandin.. http://www.grandin.com/ particularly her chutes. ?
 
I agree, this is appalling, i cannot bring myself to watch the video either.
Owners send their beloved horses there in good faith thinking they will be humanely PTS to find out that this sort of thing goes on there is absolutely disgusting. I personally would always have a vet to put my horses to sleep if needed, but there are people out there that cant afford that and opt for the knacker man, this place i heard had always had a good reputation for the way they treated the horses they PTS there, now this comes out We desperately need a place where horses and ponies can be PTS with respect and dignity, god forbid if they ever have to be transported abroad for slaughter. Its really worrying
 
TrasaM said:
The RSPCA appear damned whatever they do.

....... It's too easy to pass the blame or responsibility onto another body when failures such as this happens.

.......
Click to expand...

I agree with you, and in reality, the frustration and the lack of respect that I have and display, towards most of our animal charities is that they all so often start out with all the right ideals, they do good work, funding becomes a major issue, the accountants and the fundraisers take over, and then their charges, their raison d'etre's, become of secondary importance.

There is also the problem that they are all now competing for a diminishing pot. Were they to group together, abandon the bunny huggers (some chance of that, they're the main source of income), and put on a united front, instead of considering the politics of their positions, then I would have some respect for them.

The reality is that we are in an impossible situation, and one to which I can't see any resolve.

I don't know of one charity or equine body that's prepared to stand up and point out the truth to the ~British~Horse~Owning~Public. When I find a charity that has the courage to face up to us all, then they will have my support, in total!

Alec.
 
I hope there is no knee jerk reaction to this video as there is a need to put down horses. The situation in the USA some years ago it was banned for horses to be slaughtered for human consumption and the slaughter houses closed. They opened up in Mexico and Canada and the horses were travelled long distances for slaughter. There is great concern about cost of ending a horses life now the buying of dead stock is banned and fears of more horses just being abandoned.
 
fizzer said:
I do not wish to look as too upsetting.

However, as soft as I am I have worked closely in the Meat Processing world before that included Cattle and Sheep and have always felt it was very humane and the animals welfare was always a first, from transport to the end. All regulations adhered to including daily attendance of Meat Inspectors and Vets accordingly. I know that Abattoirs need to keep their stock as stress free as possible, they have appropriate areas and a routine of how they are fed through the stages of stunning and killing.

I know many Slaughter men, and all do a grand job, not for the faint hearted but they make it as quick and stress free as possible for the animal. Disgusting that people can treat animals like this.
Click to expand...

Like fizzer I also have first hand personal experience of this industry, and not all slaughtermen are heartless, and not all abattoirs are badly run. I've met some really nice people who carry out this necessary job.

I've always shied away from being present when horses are being slaughtered, and if possible I always avoid being present during the actual despatch stage of any animal, but I have seen the before and immediately after, including everything that follows.

I simply cannot watch the video even though I am aware of the mechanics of the job. I can't bear to see cruelty and injustice.
 
ticobay831 said:
I agree, this is appalling, i cannot bring myself to watch the video either.
Owners send their beloved horses there in good faith thinking they will be humanely PTS to find out that this sort of thing goes on there is absolutely disgusting. I personally would always have a vet to put my horses to sleep if needed, but there are people out there that cant afford that and opt for the knacker man, this place i heard had always had a good reputation for the way they treated the horses they PTS there, now this comes out We desperately need a place where horses and ponies can be PTS with respect and dignity, god forbid if they ever have to be transported abroad for slaughter. Its really worrying
Click to expand...


People have their horses shot at home by the knackerman or the hunt for many reasons, NOT because of finances.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Top