Hitting Horses

Is it acceptable to hit a horse?

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If it bites me/kicks me I'm sorry but it is getting a wallop. It is a damn site bigger than me after all.

If it is about to back into a ditch (sounds unlikely but I've had one do it to me) that would probably justify a proper stick inside out moment too.

Other wise just the usual tap with a schooling whip for me :)
 
I think it requires judgement and knowledge of the individual horse. If the horse is genuinely confused, no, if it refuses to obey, yes. If there is a dangerous situation, yes. If a horse offers to kick or bite yes... but possibly not if it's a colt because that can initiate a playfight, so it's better to chase the horse out of your space. So it's all context, I think.
 
Hmm. I'm very mixed about it. In general I would say its NEVER ok BUT then I have hit horses on occasion and firstly there has been a damn good reason and secondly it has ALWAYS had the desired affect. But here are the 'rules' and examples of when I have ignored them!

I would never hit a horse on the head:
Have smacked Frank on the nose numerous times when he's being annoying about dinner.
Have smacked Dotty on the nose when she has bitten me.

I would never use an object to hit a horse with:
Have hit my youngster on the butt with a bucket before because she was having a temper tantrum and was about to fly buck me in the face. Had desired effect, she shot off away from me!
I always ride with a whip and do give horses a smack if needed. But is a smack hitting??

I would never hit a horse because horses aren't badly behaved, its a reaction to something:
Anyone that thinks this has never met my OHs horse!!!!!!
 
I'm not averse to using a schooling whip sensibly when riding my horse (by this I mean a light tap to get her attention or to help what we are doing, nothing hard or painful for her and I don't do it very often at all).

I have given her a harder smack with the whip once when she was dancing about in the road and I needed her to move forward out of the way of traffic.

I will smack (with my hand) a pony or horse if they are doing something which they know is wrong and which is dangerous for me. Luckily none of mine properly bite or kick in a nasty way but just occasionally my older pony has tried to nip me, which stills hurts, and he will get a smack on the nose for that. Basically, I'd rather use another method such a patience or reassurance but would smack to defend myself if appropriate (rarely is in my opinion). Would certainly never 'beat' an animal of any kind.
 
So long as it's not excessive. I got hit as a kid for being naughty or rude so it's really only the same thing. You know when you've gone too far as horses do have a tendancy to get very jumpy so point driven home prior to this! But also, it is going to depend on the horse. There's a horse on our yard that is horrible - you could electrocute it whilst braying it with a ball and chain and it would still be just as rude and nasty!!
 
In dangerous situations, I have used my crop / hand if I didn't have a crop / rein ends to get the horse going forward again. These were not babies - they were grown-up horses that were endangering themselves and others and me by their actions, and the key thing was the get them forward before there was an accident.

Reschooling is often the answer, BUT in an emergency sometimes you have to do what you have to do.
 
I'd say in certain situations a well-timed sharp "telling-off" is not only justified but can also help improve the situation, but I think it should be really well-timed and one smack/slap is always enough. I can't imagine a situation when anyone would need to continuously keep beating a horse up :/
 
My trainer always says that "its not the whip its the hand that's holding it" ...... and I agree.

If I hit my boy with a normal schooling whip, he just goes ape, bucks and/or rears and gets himself into a real state; then I changed to one of those whips with the flippy leather flaps that make a noise as opposed to just being a hitting device, and it changed the whole situation.

Now, he knows that if he's being a silly boy he'll get a noise made at him by me flapping the whip on my boot, his backside or whatever, and he takes serious notice of that rather than being actually hit.

Result: horse doing what he's asked to do without any hassle and keeping chilled at the same time.

Its not that I'm opposed to (appropriate) use of the whip, its just that for us, we needed to look at alternative solutions and found something that worked.
 
When riding if a horse doesn't respond to my leg aid then I will give him/her a smack behind my leg as reinforcement of the aids, other then this I would never hit the horse whilst on his/her back.

On the ground I think there are sometimes better ways of dealing with the situation, I feel sometimes a elbow or a pinch works better then a slap and I would only do this if the horse was genuinly being naughty rather then scared or anxious.
 
reading body language would eliminate the need to smack/wrap it with a stick..but very few horse onwers recognise this..hence the getting bitten,kicked cycle continues.

you need to be Alpha, able to read body language and nip in the bud immediately any offensive behaviour.

if your pony lived in a herd/wild and was aggressive, it get far worse than a sharp smack!!
 
I agree with Nativeponies, however particularly with my youngster, sometimes she will test my body language and will go against me, therefore a smack is useful. xxxx
 
oh no, i'm not adverse to giving any pony a whack..its just so less stressful when they realise that its NOT a good idea.

never on the face/head though..;)
 
i dont expect a horse to cause me pain by kicking or biting me so why should i cause pain by hitting a horse - sorry no i never hit - i use my body language tone voice to reprimand and always will
 
I don't feel a couple/three smacks (with a crop/leadrope/hand) is abusive. Sometimes, they need a smack, especially if they're putting themselves or other people in danger.
 
I learnt something really interesting this year (to me). My colt (now gelded) thought it was okay, for a couple of weeks, to whip his head round without warning and nip me on the leg if he was getting bored (after 30 seconds). He would do this when I was taking him for walks in hand. My reaction was to give a quick smack or tap on the nose whenever he went to do this. But after a bit of research I found out that only lower ranking horses would strike back and that this could lead to a game, which inevitably ends up in tears!

The alpha horse would in fact just shift the colt out of its space without even indulging physical contact. Obviously I always lead on the lunge so I started driving him away every time he tried it, with my arms wide and lots of growling. Worked so quickly... much better than a smack. Soon I reduced it to just a jingle of the rope as a warning and he has thankfully grown out of that phase again now, anyway.

I found it interesting - it's probably obvious to others.
 
nativeponies said:
reading body language would eliminate the need to smack/wrap it with a stick..but very few horse onwers recognise this..hence the getting bitten,kicked cycle continues.

you need to be Alpha, able to read body language and nip in the bud immediately any offensive behaviour.

if your pony lived in a herd/wild and was aggressive, it get far worse than a sharp smack!!
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I am this person with my youngster. My poor OH is not. It's quite funny to see how she is with him. (I don't think he agrees of course) The brown horse doesn't consider anyone to be alpha. He is a thug. He does get smacks. From everyone. I've given up trying to boss him. He just sets his neck and runs off if I do.

Anyone want to suggest how to make him behave?
 
MiJodsR2BlinkinTite said:
My trainer always says that "its not the whip its the hand that's holding it" ...... and I agree.
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I couldnt agree more. I have an established riding horse, a weanling that was feral before I got him, and a yearling. The weanling gets big body language, but as it stands right now NEVER a smack, the mare gets big body language, but if she stepped too far over the line, ie kicking out or biting, then she would get a flat of the hand wallop on a fleshy part, the yearling gets a smack every now and again. Hes a rising 2 yr old colt and can be mouthy and pushy. The first time he gets 'scary lady' if he doesnt respond to that, or if I cant safely give him both barrels of 'scary lady' then he will get a flat of the hand smack or a leadrope thrown in his face etc. I would never EVER beat any horse, but I use my judgement about when and when not to 'smack'.

It works for me and my horses. People are always commenting on how well behaved they are, and everyone is shocked by how I took on a feral weanling 3 weeks ago who now leads, loads and picks his front feet up :) I am aware that there are people who dont have my judgement. Anyone found smacking my horse without permission would get short shrift!
 
I don't hit or slap any of my horses, in fact I don't own a crop or whip. Having said that I don't have a problem with them biting or kicking me. I do, however, move them out of my space, and never let them move me, no matter how subtle they try to do this.

For me it is a basic training issue, I believe that it is a mistake to get into 'tit for tat' slapping 'games' (thats how they see it). As far as punishing horses, they have no idea what that is about, so it's a waste of time.

Lots of folk will disagree, no doubt, but, at the end of the day, they will still be hitting their horses and I won't be hitting mine.
 
I have one instructor who says that a whip should never be used in anger, and should only ever be used to enhance an aid, if the horse does not listen the first time.

TBH I agree with that, rarely now do I carry a whip, I only take one if I sense I might need my leg aids backing up. I have hit horses in the past for other reasons, but would like to think that I don't need to anymore :)
 
sorry i really dont see what can be achieved by hitting a horse - i have been around horses many years - ok can i borrow someones toes and fingers to count ummm 3 ppl at least please - have worked for happa and though smacking might achieve short term respect- and use those words loosely - but long term you get nothin. my 2 esp my little mare have learnt what my voice an my body is saying how i feel - and baby is the result of hitting, smacking beating . I have been bitten many many times. kicked in guts, dragged, thrown etc and all those actions are a reaction to something be it fear pain frustration confusion - horses are not machines but animals that do not have the same concept as us - if a horse bites ask why ? hit it after the bite it means nothing to them other than your hand causing pain. better to take a breath step back and work at establishing your space and educating the horse to respect you - sorry would you respect something that hit you. saying that i carry a schooling whip with big lad but use it like a fly landing on him - tickling him and do you know he responds in a flash just to a tickle :) gets ready and braces to be jumped on he he he e he :)
 
It does depend on the horse - my horse is quite adept at ignoring the leg and napping, so I ride him with a whip, but when I tried to use a schooling whip (gently!) on my friend's horse he shot off like I'd stuck a rocket up his bum... friend just laughed at me suddenly having a surprise canter and reminded me that her horse is a lot more responsive than mine!

On the ground I very rarely smack horses - I would only smack them if I am in imminent danger of getting kicked in the face or something. For general bolshiness and bad manners, a firm NO and maybe an elbow in the ribs or gently pushing their head away (depending on which end is coming towards me) does the trick. Ridden, I am very light with the whip as a back-up to my leg aids - the only time I have ever been heavy-handed with it is when my horse and I are in real danger. He has a habit of running backwards into ditches, and spinning round in circles in the middle of the road (through naughtiness and nappy-ness, not fear, and I hasten to add that we have improved on these issues greatly since I've had him!) so I've occasionally had to give him a firm reminder to move forward so that we don't die.

Overall, I don't like hitting horses but sometimes it's the lesser of two evils.
 
I think most of mine have had a wollop at some time or other.. often when they have been stroppy gits, Freckles when im trimming her feet, and she starts being an idiot, I find one sharp smack and she stands good as gold....

and I carry a schooling whip when riding for if they start napping at nothing..

but I dont think should even be beaten....
 
AndySpooner said:
I believe that it is a mistake to get into 'tit for tat' slapping 'games' (thats how they see it).
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Mine dont see it as tit for tat though? I'm thinking about this mainly in terms of the colts. But they see it as taking the mickey out out the herd leader and then being told no! thats not acceptable! I'm referred to as the "pied piper of horses" as I am the only person who will go in the field with the colts when they are playing silly beggars. I go in, walk up to them, then shout "oi! no" and then I walk to the field gate with a line of them following me. They are allowed to continue 'playing silly beggars' behind me, but anything passing in front of me, or getting too close to me gets something waved in their face to get back. The majority of people wouldn't go in the field, but I have no qualms about it. They might get a bit pushy and try it on, but they know where the line is :)
 
Nothing wrong with hitting a horse when necessary but some people feel the need to continuously shout, hit their horse and then it has no effect. I rarely have to raise my voice or use the stick but I will if the situation requires it and because it is a rare occurance it has the desired response. There is a big difference between giving your horse a well deserved smack and beating a horse up. Some people seem to confuse the two things.
 
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