hmm... advice please

[only_me]

Hi
I am *trying* at the moment to teach merlin rein back, problem is, i have never ridden one really - i know that i lighten my seat and never to pull hard on the reins back, but in the german dressage book i was reading it said "dont allow the horse forwards" so question is, how much are you meant to hold?

I was on my own, so i did a halt, waited for him to relax and release the tension in his jaw, and lightened my seat, and squeezed with my legs and held, but it took a while for him to react, and i started to get very frustrated at myself for not being able to get him to react, so i walked him and then trotted etc. to get him forwards and then tried it again, and when i got a tiny step backwards i patted him and walked him on again, and stopped the schooling when he took 2 steps backwards without tension.

I think tommorrow i will use spurs to get a sharper reaction.
but i am worried that i will ruin his rein-back for good if i dont get it correct the first time, and what i dont want is him sticking his head in the air and running backwards.

any suggestions?! I want to get it sorted before the eventing season starts if possible.

also tips on getting him to relax his jaw?

 

[Nats_uk]

I may not explain it well but....
My instructor got me to walk then halt and close my eyes and close my legs around my horse to feel that moment just before my horse took a step forward (kinda like the biteing point of a clutch in a car).

I then had to walk on, halt, move my legs back slightly, close my legs around til that "biteing point" and then close my hands around the reins and give a slight half halt to encourage him back. If he took a couple of steps back I would stop, praise, walk on and repeat somewhere else.

It might help to start with if you have someone with you who can ask him to back up from the ground as you give your aids on top.

Practise makes perfect though I'm afraid

 

[MillbrookSong]

The cest way i found with song was to halt take you legs off from the hip (make sense?) then to move your legs back behinf the girth - light feel on the rein and fingers crossed go backwards!

Be carful not to always rein back when you halt as it will always happen so alternate!! and if you are having difficulty going straight back put some poles out and do it inbetween the poles!

 

[kerilli]

the first few times i start to teach them i have someone on the floor to push them gently backwards to give them the idea, along with the voice aid. then you can gradually dispense with the person on the floor, and the voice aid, in that order.
i was taught (by very correct German dressage trainer) that the halt has to be a really good square active halt (i know that sounds daft!), i.e. perfectly balanced, and arrived at immediately. if you've had to prod a few times to get it square, abandon that as the halt to rein back from... it's worth waiting for the halt where the horse comes immediately square in front, and then squares up behind, one, two. this makes a big difference to their willingness to go back - if they're in a ragged or unbalanced halt, it is much much harder for them to rein-back in good 2-time, which is what you want. the first few times i'm happy with a few backward steps, keep it all very relaxed.
i exaggerate the legs sliding lightly back well behind the girth (no pressure, just sliding back) and keep the hands light but just enough to prevent the horse stepping forward. eventually i like the horse to be light enough on the aids that i don't need to use my hands at all, just halt, wait, slide legs back with no change in rein contact at all, allow horse to step back with light accepting seat for requisite number of steps, slide legs softly forward, proceed.
sorry, a bit long-winded, hope it helps a bit!

 

[UncleJr]

[ QUOTE ]
... in the german dressage book i was reading it said "dont allow the horse forwards" so question is, how much are you meant to hold?

[/ QUOTE ]
That's the way I teach my horses rein back. I always begin with impulsion, any exercise. Then I just hold with my hands enough so that horse doesn’t go forward. Horse will let that impulsion go somewhere; =>back.

[ QUOTE ]
... and when i got a tiny step backwards i patted him and walked him on again, and stopped the schooling when he took 2 steps backwards without tension.

[/ QUOTE ]
Yes!! Well done for the reward!! Your horse knows how to do it.
Tomorrow it will be much easier; you can do 3 steps. Reward him again.
The day after tomorrow he will do 4 steps without problems.

That way has worked for me, and hope I helped

 

[only_me]

no thats great all of you, will try that tomorrow. one of the biggest problems i have is that merlin is slow to respond to leg aids, although that is improving.

will try and visualise myself riding rein back

also hopefully teaching rein back will improve the quality of our halt as well

thanks very very much nats_uk, millbrooksong and kerilli

 

[only_me]

thanks UnJr! I wasnt really sure if i was doing it correctly, and got annoyed with myself for not getting a quicker response

but hopefully i will try and get a better quality 2 steps back before i move onto 3 steps

 

[kit279]

Definitely get someone on the ground first few times, it makes it much more obvious for the horse what he's supposed to do. I taught mine with OH on the ground and they got Polos straight away from him when they did it correctly and they both picked it up surprisingly quickly. Amazing what the toads can do when 'properly motivated'..