Holding deposit on a pony

[horseyredhead]

I just wanted a little advice - I am fairly sure we may have done something a little foolish in good faith. We are looking for a lead rein pony for my daughter. My Mum is actually making the final purchase.

I went to view a pony with my daughter very locally at the weekend, it seemed ideal was really responsive on the lead rein trotted alongside and kept up with no requirement to pull to get him going and he went really well. Exactly what we were looking for.
As my Mum was the person actually making the purchase I wanted her to see the pony to make sure she was happy on what she was spending her money on but my Mum is not local to me. We put a £500 deposit down (20% of asking price) for the lady to hold the pony for 3 days until my Mum could attend the terms weren't really discussed only that she wouldn't accept any viewings in the meantime. I was genuinely convinced we would be buying the pony as he seemed perfect.

Sadly when we returned 3 days later with my Mum it was like I was viewing a different pony - it wouldn't trot and was napping to its friends in the field - certainly nothing like the pony I viewed 3 days prior. Really disappointing. I have asked if she will return the deposit to be told no.

I'm pretty sure I don't have a leg to stand on legally but just wondered what everyone's opinions are?

 

[Vodkagirly]

I think normally the only time a deposit is returned is if vetting is failed (really that should be agreed in advance as well)
Unfortunately I don't think have any legal rights but you might of had a lucky escape.

 

[Pearlsacarolsinger]

I should thank her for keeping the pony available for your mum to look at and walk away. £500 feels like a lot to lose but isn't really much to keep your child safe. I wouldn't leave a deposit of more than 10% in future.

 

[Polos Mum]

Without any discussion on what circumstances would result in the deposit being returned (most commonly vetting fail) then I think you'll struggle to prove the seller owes you the £500 back.

Next time I would get something in writing - even if only on a scrap of paper to say what situations you would expect the deposit to be returned.
Although sellers might resist taking a deposit that is subject to "my mum likes the pony" as that's really subjective and not something the sellers can have any idea about whether it is likely or not.
A deposit subject to vetting is most common as the vets assessment is (or should be!) independent and the seller can be reasonably sure the pony is sound so happy to proceed on that basis.

 

[ycbm]

I don't think you can have your deposit back because what you paid for actually happened, the pony was held from other viewings for you. But you haven't been stupid, you did exactly the right thing waiting and viewing again, and you've had a lucky escape from buying a pony that might have hurt your daughter.
.

 

[ihatework]

Sounds like the terms were to hold the pony for 3 days and not show it to anyone else. They kept up their end of the bargain so unfortunately I don’t think you will get your deposit back.

I have to say I think £500 is a hefty deposit for a 3 day hold FWIW.

 

[Merry neddy man]

Talk to them nicely and see if they will split the difference at £250 each, it wont hurt you as much and the owner is still in pocket, as others have said maybe a lucky if costly escape. Do you have a horse friend who could go with their daughter as a prospective purchaser (without you) and get feedback on how it goes for them, possibly videoed.

 

[Barton Bounty]

Like the others say I think you have had a lucky escape, but ponies can be naughty some days? Is there any chance of trying her out a couple more times! Youve really got nothing more to lose at this point

 

[Goldenstar]

They fulfilled their side of the contract so sadly I agree you have lost your money .

 

[Vodkagirly]

Did the seller say anything at the viewing about the ponies change in behaviour?

 

[Leandy]

We put a £500 deposit down (20% of asking price) for the lady to hold the pony for 3 days until my Mum could attend the terms weren't really discussed only that she wouldn't accept any viewings in the meantime.

Well if this was what the deposit was put down for then, as others have said, the sellers did what you paid the deposit for and held the pony for three days so I don't think you have a right to it back and will have to put it down to experience and be grateful that it is distinctly less painful than buying an unsuitable pony. There is no harm in requesting it though and pushing quite hard on the basis of the pony's apparent change in personality. Personally I would not have paid a deposit in those circumstances at all. I absolutely would have gone back the second time to view. As you found, it is necessary to see a horse, and in particular a child's pony, more than once in order to make a decision. I would not part with a deposit until I had made a firm decision I wanted to buy, and then it would be to hold the horse for the vetting and would be subject to vetting. Even then though, the terms aren't that clear and can easily lead to dispute as whether or not vet's findings are material to a buyer can be pretty subjective. I would have taken my chances of someone else buying the pony before we had made a decision following the second viewing but that is how life is and I would have taken that risk. FWIW, I have bought several horses and ponies over many years (both privately and from dealers and professionals) and never had to pay a deposit, even to hold for a vetting but certainly not to hold for a second viewing. Agree also that 20% was steep, a typical deposit to hold for a vetting is 10%. We seem to see an increasing number of stories of sellers asking for money from potential purchasers before they have even decided to purchase (and sometimes before any viewing at all). This is a big red flag and really it is not necessary to do this with honest sellers in my experience.

 

[horseyredhead]

Did the seller say anything at the viewing about the ponies change in behaviour?

She was visibly embarrassed and said she was getting cross with him as he'd never behaved that way before. It was all a bit awkward for everyone. My Mum was expecting to see the perfect pony I'd told her about, I was mortified at what I was seeing having got her to travel 100 miles to come and see him, and the seller was embarrassed the pony would not go into trot without her chasing after him and she had to drag him round trying too. He was napping to other ponies and would randomly just plant feet and do nothing. A very uncomfortable situation. More difficult is that she is extremely local to me and our paths are likely to cross in the future.

 

[horseyredhead]

Thank you for all of your opinions and I figured this would be the case. It seems the horse buying and selling world is a lot different to what I was used to when I was riding buying and selling horses several years ago. A lot less good will and trust. It is becoming a real struggle to find the right pony and even more difficult now with £500 less in the budget! I really appreciate all the time you have all spent replying!

 

[PeterNatt]

May I suggest that you contact your local Pony Clubs and ask them to let you know if anything suitable becomes available. I would try to split the £500 pounds with the seller and see if she is co-operative especially as your paths are likely to cross in the future.

 

[horseyredhead]

May I suggest that you contact your local Pony Clubs and ask them to let you know if anything suitable becomes available. I would try to split the £500 pounds with the seller and see if she is co-operative especially as your paths are likely to cross incondiderinh the future.

Thank you! I will certainly do that I was a pony clubber so still have some faith left. I have requested she return half of the deposit as a good will gesture considering the horses behaviour etc...... Will see what response I receive. She would still be keeping 10% of the sale price in that arrangement....

 

[AmyMay]

More difficult is that she is extremely local to me and our paths are likely to cross in the future.

It’s only difficult if either of you make it so. It seems as if the seller was genuinely surprised at the pony’s behaviour, so wouldn’t have been surprised at your backing out of the purchase. Equally you’ve not made a fuss about your deposit.

 

[Nasicus]

If I was the seller in this situation, I'd have probably given you the money back just from the sheer mortification of the ponies behaviour ? I wouldn't be able to sleep at night knowing that happened and I kept £500 off of you! But then I guess peoples principles vary.

 

[Melody Grey]

Perhaps a different slant here, but if I was the seller I’d be offering you back your deposit in full if the pony had behaved totally out of character and be looking into why that is. Or offering you the opportunity to come and view again if you wanted?

 

[Jenko109]

Deposit or not, the pony would surely now fall into the category of 'not as described' and I would be kicking up a stink if the full amount was not returned.

 

[horseyredhead]

If I was the seller in this situation, I'd have probably given you the money back just from the sheer mortification of the ponies behaviour ? I wouldn't be able to sleep at night knowing that happened and I kept £500 off of you! But then I guess peoples principles vary.

I would do exactly the same. If we had messed her around and pulled out of the sale for no real reason or due to our own circumstances changing then I would completely understand but we were ready to buy it was just a formality for my Mum to see the pony as it was her money paying for it. I had thought of it as a down payment really and possibly foolishly didnt query the amount because as far as I was concerned he was coming home but only to be greeted with a completely different pony to what I'd seen at the first viewing. As you say peoples principles are different. I have very politely requested half of the money back as a compromise but surprisingly enough received no reply. I wouldn't have even questioned the return of the deposit had the shoe been on the other foot and my pony had behaved in that way. I wouldn't be able to sleep knowing I'd taken advantage of a pensioner and a toddler!

 

[horseyredhead]

Perhaps a different slant here, but if I was the seller I’d be offering you back your deposit in full if the pony had behaved totally out of character and be looking into why that is. Or offering you the opportunity to come and view again if you wanted?

Either of these would have been acceptable to us but she has chosen to take our money and just ignore messages.....very disappointing. I had so much good will trying to not put her out or inconvenience her and was very trusting with the deposit but I guess that just isn't reciprocated in some cases. Horses for courses I guess.

 

[Melody Grey]

Either of these would have been acceptable to us but she has chosen to take our money and just ignore messages.....very disappointing. I had so much good will trying to not put her out or inconvenience her and was very trusting with the deposit but I guess that just isn't reciprocated in some cases. Horses for courses I guess.

I certainly wouldn’t be the one feeling awkward if you see them again socially if they haven’t even replied to you!

 

[Lois Lame]

I'm wondering if the owner put the pony in the paddock for the 3 days after you first viewed him/her, the pony didn't usually get such a wonderful time and was a bit put out to be pulled out and expected to do this, that and the other, so acted up.

I think the final decision was made in haste. (Understandably, because you were taken aback.)

 

[Cragrat]

Deposit or not, the pony would surely now fall into the category of 'not as described' and I would be kicking up a stink if the full amount was not returned.

I have absolutely no legal knowledge or experience of this situation, but this was my thought. How was the pony advertised? If you went ahead and bought it, would it match the description?

 

[gallopingby]

I'm wondering if the owner put the pony in the paddock for the 3 days after you first viewed him/her, the pony didn't usually get such a wonderful time and was a bit put out to be pulled out and expected to do this, that and the other, so acted up.

I think the final decision was made in haste. (Understandably, because you were taken aback.)

This could well be the case given the amount of grass at the moment. Change of feed affects horses in different ways. If the pony was 100% ok first time viewing ld be making enquiries from people who have known it for a while. Also it’s surprising what vibes ponies can pick up!

 

[maya2008]

Deposits are usually non-refundable. They’re payment, in essence, for them to hold the horse for you. I wouldn’t, in future, pay £500 though. £200 might have been a better amount.

That said, ponies have minds of their own. How old was the one you were looking at? If you want 100% saintly, you probably need an older pony that won’t change with weather/lack of exercise/because its favourite friend is in a different field. At 14, our Shetland still spooked occasionally and would have the odd moment. At nearly 20, those things don’t really happen any more!

 

[ycbm]

Either of these would have been acceptable to us but she has chosen to take our money and just ignore messages.....very disappointing. I had so much good will trying to not put her out or inconvenience her and was very trusting with the deposit but I guess that just isn't reciprocated in some cases. Horses for courses I guess.

I do think she's behaved dishonourably, it's just a shame it wasn't illegally so.
.

 

[marmalade76]

It’s only difficult if either of you make it so. It seems as if the seller was genuinely surprised at the pony’s behaviour, so wouldn’t have been surprised at your backing out of the purchase. Equally you’ve not made a fuss about your deposit.

Agreed. There's nothing to say a deposit is non-refundable unless it was put in writing. If it were me, I would refund, the alternative would just not be worth the hassle but perhaps I'm just soft.

 

[marmalade76]

Either of these would have been acceptable to us but she has chosen to take our money and just ignore messages.....very disappointing. I had so much good will trying to not put her out or inconvenience her and was very trusting with the deposit but I guess that just isn't reciprocated in some cases. Horses for courses I guess.

If this is the case and she's local, I'd make sure everyone heard about it

 

[MagicMelon]

Id certainly expect half back, pretty nasty of her considering it was the pony behaviour which ultimately ruined the sale...