Hoof Advice - Please!

[Eggshells]

Looking for some advice please. I'm not happy with my lads feet and I would really like other peoples opinions.

When I got E in July he had really terrible feet (both quality and shape). He could barely keep shoes on, but too flat and not enough wall (according to farrier) to go barefoot. Fast forward 7 and a bit months and the quality of the hoof is much better, but the shape seems to me to be much the same, if not worse.

More pics in the album http://www.horseandhound.co.uk/forums/album.php?albumid=5927 but here is his left fore

Before:

Now:

He doesn't grow much hoof. He is shod every four weeks, and 2 or 3 shoeings ago was in the side clips to help build up his heal. Will more often than not pull a front off between shoeings. Is ridden and turned out in overreach boots at all times.

What I really want to know is, is this just an ugly phase before they get better, or do I need a new farrier?

I really don't know anything about reshaping hooves so any information would be much appreciated.

THANK YOU!

 

[NellRosk]

To my untrained eye his heels still look really underrun, have you thought about taking him bf for a bit to sort this issue out? He should last more than 4 weeks shoeing and if he's pulling shoes off this might be telling you something What is he fed on? Is he getting sufficient minerals to grow a good hoof capsule? Ps just noticed the kitty in the background, thought it was a tiger at first

 

[Eggshells]

Thank you NellRosk. Would love him to go BF (as would my bank balance!) but he has very flat feet and according to the farrier has very thin wall near the sole so he says it is not an option at the moment. He has Spillers Balancer and NAF Pro-Feet supplement.

Ps just noticed the kitty in the background, thought it was a tiger at first

Ah yes, the ferocious ginger rat trap. I was pig oiling Eggs legs and he wanted in on the action. However, he soon learnt the perils of sitting right under horses back ends when Eggs pooed on him!

 

[ester]

He does have very collapsed heels - you can tell from the direction of the hoof tubules. He does seem to have an event line on the now pic indicating that he has been trying to grow a shorter toe.

Having been there I would be tempted to have his shoes off so those heels can improve - with boots during the transition period. (mine had reverse rotation of pedal bones so very flat soles when we started) - Heels did look to improve balance wise through shoeing although the tubules still weren't straight and the pony still wasn't sound .

I used naf pro-feet previously and had good results IMO but most barefooters would suggest that was swapped out for prohoof/forageplus/equimins advanced balancers. What other grub does he get?

 

[Eggshells]

Hi Ester. Grub wise he gets pretty much ad-lib hay, Hi-Fi Lite and Baileys Cool Mix (not a lot of either as he is a very good doer) with a pinch of salt and a glug of soy/linseed/hemp oil along with the balancer and Pro-Feet morning and evening.

I think I will get a second opinion from a different farrier and take it from there.

 

[putasocinit]

A good foot supplement is essential and regular trimming keeping the toe short and leaving the heel, think of the foot as being tubular and when the toe grows long it takes the foot with it like a horn so the heels collapse and become underrun.

Your farrier has no doubt put a shoe on with a long bit past the heel for support which is where the horse is catching with his hind feet and pulling the shoe off. So make sure hind feet are kept short so they cant touch the front heels when moving. Mention all this to your farrier he should understand where i am coming from and be able to correct it

 

[ester]

I think a second opinion is probably a good idea.

I'd prob swap out the hifi and the coolmix because the the molasses (I have a good doer too ) to an unmolassed chaff/fast fibre/unmolassed beet etc.

dunno if it helps but we started with this (I have got better at taking photos since!)

 

[Eggshells]

Hi Putasocinit. Farrier did indeed put the side clips on so he could shift the shoe back to support the heal. Backs are fairly short, he just has a huge stride and t*ts around in the field (most lost shoes are found at the end on a long skid track :/ ).

I do like my farrier and do see where the farrier is coming from, it is just that I have seen a friends horse go from worse feet to fabulous feet in the time Eggs' have barely changed and I'm getting frustrated. He is a big horse and I really don't want him to be carrying all his weight on bad feet.

 

[ester]

I think sometimes farriers aren't aware of the various options there are with boots and pads so as far as they are concerned it can't be done. I booted for hacking for about 6 months and some on here have booted for turnout too.

 

[Meowy Catkin]

Long toes and under-run heels, the hooves look pretty shoe sick really. Shod short, so no heel support, which compounds the problem of the under-run heels. The shoe pulling is because of the long toes which change the breakover.

If he was mine, I'd have pulled the shoes already. Your Farrier is just plain wrong the BF isn't an option. You might need boots to start with, but your horse might surprise you and be sound on soft or flat surfaces right from the start.

Look at his diet. Don't let the farrier trim the frogs, bars or soles when the shoes come off. Really the horn could be left untrimmed too - just pull the shoes. You will need to stimulate the hooves by working (might need to be in-hand to start with) on surfaces which the horse is comfortable on. start with short sessions and build up as the horse becomes ready to do more.

I have changed to a pro-BF farrier and it makes a huge difference. Infact it was the new Farrier who wanted to take the shoes off my mare.

 

[NellRosk]

Ah yes, the ferocious ginger rat trap. I was pig oiling Eggs legs and he wanted in on the action. However, he soon learnt the perils of sitting right under horses back ends when Eggs pooed on him!

Haha that's hilarious!! On a more serious note your horse might surprise you. Even if you don't do it as a permanent fixture I would certainly let your horse spend some time without shoes so his feet recover otherwise his heels will become more and more underrun. You might want to swap your horses balancer to something more high spec like Forage Plus balancer or Progressive Earth pro balance. I noticed a massive difference in my horses' white line separation after feeding correct minerals!