Hoof help please!

[SR2]

First paragraph is fine.

I was hoping for some advice/suggestions for what I could do to improve these feet- I know they're pretty bad, and there's a lot to do! I just want to help them as best I can. I've been trying my best for the last six months, and believe it or not, these pictures are an improvement on what they were like to start with- when I started, there was little to no frog on all 4 feet, and the horse was quite footy a lot of the time. Footiness has definitely improved since I've been trying to sort them.

It's a bit of an awkward situation as the horse in question doesn't actually belong to me, I've just been looking after them as best I can, but it does mean I'm quite limited in what I can do management-wise. I have managed to get biotin included in feeds, but I don't think I'll manage to get them to adjust it any more than that.

I've been using Red Horse Sole Cleanse every day and Stockholm tar as this was recommended to me by a livery at the yard. Having read through a lot of 'foot' threads on here, I stopped this last week, and have started using Leovet Frog Medic spray, so will see how that goes.

Farrier visits are... intermittent. If anyone has any suggestions for what I could ask, or what could help to improve the foot, I might be able to speak to the farrier, but it really depends on if I'm there at the time.

Horse is EMS, on haylage and dry lot turnout.

Thanks in advance!

 

[SR2]

Oops! Can tell I’m new to this & had some help to write it! Ha!

the thread should read….

“Hi! I’m pretty new here as well as being pretty new to the horsey world in general, so I’d love some help please!”

 

[Reacher]

If you aren’t the owner, are you the official carer or are you trying to cover for absent / abandoning owner? Are you in the uk? The horse needs very regular visits from an expert farrier, taking a little off at a time, and probably the vet too.

 

[paddy555]

If you aren’t the owner, are you the official carer or are you trying to cover for absent / abandoning owner? Are you in the uk? The horse needs very regular visits from an expert farrier, taking a little off at a time, and probably the vet too.

this. I would give up on paying for Leovet, Red horse or anything else and use the money for a decent trimmer/farrier which is what the horse needs. `No one can tell you how to trim those feet on the internet. Pics can be deceiving especially where angles are concerned. Bear in mind that trimming those feet in one go is going to affect the stance of the horse. Which could well have an overall effect in his entire body.
To get good quality frogs on a horse the frogs have to work. Those don't.

I appreciate you are trying your best for this horse. I'm not sure you need to speak to either the farrier or trimmer. They should know how to go about correcting the feet..All that will help to improve the feet to start with is a trim.

 

[Landcruiser]

There is so much wrong with those poor feet. Is it possible to post a pic of the whole horse? If the horse isn't yours OP, I'm afraid you are on a hiding to nothing - this horse needs an entire management change, very regular footcare, vet attention, diet change... Well done for asking for help, but I suspect you are setting yourself up for a long thankless task.

 

[holeymoley]

Crumbs, these need a lot of tlc. I would start with x rays. You say the horse is EMs, there are ridges on these hooves that are evident of laminitic episodes and something not quite right metabolically whether that be feeding or management. They need a lot taken off and rebalanced, but I wouldn’t allow anyone to do this without seeing what’s going on inside. Not entirely sure but the white legged one looks to be club footed? Lots going on. Well done for making a start.

 

[Reacher]

PS I suspect the might well be laminitic so vet and X-rays are needed .
Cross posted with holeymoley

ETA - as others have said well done for trying to help but there may be significant long term internal damage , I think this horse is a welfare case (hence asking who is the official carer) and likely to be a money pit to turn around and sadly, potentially, not fixable.

 

[holeymoley]

Looking back, not sure about the club foot now, I’m thinking more quite a significant pedal bone rotation.

 

[PinkvSantaboots]

Agree looks like previous bouts of laminitis so x rays and trim from them is your only option really, I wouldn't want to try and trim those without as you could be doing more damage.

 

[Red-1]

I glanced at these when you first put them up and realised that they are far beyond anything I could help with. Yes, I think the shape of the feet has been affected by lami.

If I had contact with this horse, I would want X rays to see where I was at, then a great trimmer or farrier to assist.

For self-care, I would ensure feed was lami friendly, so no grass, soaked hay only, with whatever was needed as a vitamin carrier. I would swap the plain biotin for a good hoof support vitamin supplement, such as Progressive Earth Pro Hoof Platinum. I would ensure the feet were always scrupulously clean.

Without knowing the extent of possible lami damage, I would not work. I would perhaps turn on a soft surface, such as an arena, if the horse is not lame. It may well be that walking on a tarmac surface would improve the wear on these, I would not do that without X rays and vet/farrier approval.

I usually do my own feet when barefoot, but when my cob Rigsby came, he was just getting over a live lami episode. I had a trimmer do him for a year, as it was beyond my capability. Only once they were looking 'normal' and were functional did I take over the trimming again. Sometimes you have to admit when you need professional help, although not being the owner can obviously complicate matters.

If the horse were lame and looking like this, and the owner did not even provide regular trimming, I'm afraid I would report on welfare grounds.

 

[ycbm]

I am loathe to offer any advice on feet that bad, sorry. I just want to add my voice to the others saying how serious the situation is with that poor horse.
.

 

[PinkvSantaboots]

Sometimes EMS needs to be treated with drugs when it's very severe changing management alone is not enough, you need to get it under control or the horse will continue to have low grade laminitis and feet won't improve.

It's a vet job really.

 

[SR2]

Thank you to everyone who’s taken the time to reply to me with this one. I really appreciate it.

Completely get what people are saying about x rays for trimming, but unfortunately that isn't going to happen I'll try to catch the farrier next visit to see if I can get more regular small trims to at least keep them a bit tidier.

Horse is on medication for the EMS (possibly metaformin?) Not sure of the name or dose.

Laminitis-wise, horse has definitely had previous bouts, but nothing major recently, and has definitely seemed more comfortable since I've been trying to get on top of the thrush.

It's a difficult situation as my hands are a bit tied as to what I can do, and appreciate that what I can do will have only a little impact overall. I just want to try to make the horse as comfortable as I can.

 

[ycbm]

Laminitis-wise, horse has definitely had previous bouts, but nothing major recently,

I agree nothing major but the growth rings are a complete giveaway. This horse has ongoing chronic laminitic issues, or I'll eat my new hat. Good hooves have no big growth rings. This one also appears to have bleeding into the laminae from quite high up, which is bad news.

Your concern is to be credited, I hope you can help the horse.
.

 

[holeymoley]

I agree nothing major but the growth rings are a complete giveaway. This horse has ongoing chronic laminitic issues, or I'll eat my new hat. Good hooves have no big growth rings. This one also appears to have bleeding into the laminae from quite high up, which is bad news.

Your concern is to be credited, I hope you can help the horse.
.

This, plus the rings are wider at the heel which normally nine times out of ten signifies rotation to some degree. The top part of the hoof is also growing down at a different angle so I would be inclined to say that there is significant rotation, this can happen over various subtle inflammatory episodes, there doesn’t have to be a major episode for structural damages to occur.

 

[Reacher]

What involvement has the vet had? When did they last see the horse?

 

[Highmileagecob]

The farrier or the yard owner needs to step up and have strong words with the owners, if no one else is able to communicate effectively with them. This is bordering on a welfare issue. Hope you can make a difference.

 

[paddy555]

All the comments are correct of course but it is a case of what OP can actually do in the real world.

SR2 is the horse happy, relatively sound, coping? In which case you may be stuck unless you report it.

if not you are probably down to what the farrier can do to the feet and if there is anyone else with any influence.

you could do what I usually do to sort this sort of questionably welfare problem. ie buy the horse and get it sorted myself. I do appreciate everyone will scream that just rewards the owner for their cruelty.

 

[SR2]

All the comments are correct of course but it is a case of what OP can actually do in the real world.

SR2 is the horse happy, relatively sound, coping? In which case you may be stuck unless you report it.

if not you are probably down to what the farrier can do to the feet and if there is anyone else with any influence.

you could do what I usually do to sort this sort of questionably welfare problem. ie buy the horse and get it sorted myself. I do appreciate everyone will scream that just rewards the owner for their cruelty.

Really appreciate your reply, thank you.

Horse is happy & coping, they’re walking considerably better than 6 months ago since I started the journey so I am hopeful that I am making a small improvement to the horse, although I am not naive to the fact I might not be able to do much more than a small improvement without vet & regular farrier visits.