Hoof Xrays - opinions please

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catherine22

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These are the xrays my horse has just had done, he had just been fitted with guraduated bar shoes when these were taken
Opinions please (they don't mean a great deal to me) and altho the vet has gone through everything with me I'd like some other opinions of them

Left
leftxray.jpg


Right
rightxray.jpg


Would offer wine, but unfortunately I've drunk it all, I do have some ben and jerrys ice cream left though
 
:( Oh dear! I dont want to comment on the x-rays but I hope you can find a way to get him (and keep him) comfortable for the foreseeable future.
 
His right Xray looks better than his left, but I dont really want to say more than that.

Ditto Glenruby-Hope you can find a way to get him comfy :)
 
Please do comment, I would like to hear other opinions (pm if you'd prefer). He is bi laterally lame (and probably always has been) he's also been diagnosed with hock spavins so has had to have wedges on the back as well.
If this doesnt work, he'll probably be turned away, shoes off and see what nature does (he's 11 btw)
 
I'm no expert - I am only in my 2nd year studying human radiography. I would say it was difficult to comment on whats going on as they are not very lateral so you can't see clear joint spaces. The left one looks like the navicular/coffin joint space is reduced but I'm not sure it is - think its just the angle the xray was taken from.

Has the vet given you any indication as to what is going on - assume they are thinking navicular?
 
I wouldn't really like to pass any detailed comments on the xrays other than the horse obviously has problems! Personally, if the horse were mine I would take all shoes off and turn out. I have never seen long lasting benefits from wedged shoes. Good luck with him though.
 
He has arthritis in his coffin joints which were injected about 4 years ago, he also had tildren. I think navicular is where they are going but they haven't actually confirmed diagnosis. Vet is back out next week now the shoes are all on, so it will be taking it from there I'm also going to speak to them about Rockley Farm
 
I am no expert, but have seen better X-rays, if I had doubts about my own vets interpretation I would send them to Newmarket to get a second opinion rather than asking for opinions on this forum, and remember, the full history has to be taken in to consideration.
As with all these diagnoses, one has to consider the options, and if they will vary with different problems.
In Ye Olden Days there were three options: remedial shoeing, shoes off and rest, or shoot it [I am not suggesting this!]
 
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looks like hes developing ring bone on his left short pastern and looks as though he has the latter stages of navicular, one foot worse than the other, wonder what state his deep flexor tendons are in :/ i think you should take his shoes off and turn him away but i am doubtful if he will come sound :( sorry
 
he's also been diagnosed with hock spavins so has had to have wedges on the back as well.
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No he does not. Wedges won't sort the spavin problem, it may provide a sticking plaster in the short term, but not a fix.

Navicular? Shoes are not going to help there either.

Do yourself and your horse a favour and go spend a couple of hours looking at Nic Barker's Rockley Farm blog and website. Look for Project Dexter. You'l learn a lot - you really will.

I have a horse that has all of the same radiographic changes, and has bilateral spavin. He's doing very well now, but didn't get there by special shoes. Quite the reverse - it's when the shoes went that we started to see light at the end of the tunnel.

Go look up Nic Barker's site please.
 
OP I have no idea if these xrays are "good or bad" though I can see changes and one is most definitely worse than the other.

My concern is that you are not happy with them. I may be barking up the wrong tree completely but years ago I had a horse diagnosed by xray with navicular. When he eventually saw Sue Dyson at the AHT she took one look at his xrays and said she did not know how anyone could diagnose anything from them as they were of poor quality and not very good views.

If this is what some people are hinting at then I would ask for a referal to a top specialist who will have staff who will take "true" views as well as looking at the soft tissues. If you are happy and others are convinced that these are good views then fine. As an A/E sister I do know that if you don't get clear xrays and the right views then you might as well not bother. My horse had a ruptured collateral ligament:(
 
you cannot see if a horse has navicular with one x-ray of each foot at this angle, i think mine had about 11 xrays ontop on the bone scan to be diagnosed. And as brucea said, i also didnt see an improvement untill the shoes came off, my supposed navicular and djd spavin horse is now sound... without remedial shoeing.....
 
It almost makes me weep China that there is so much infective and intrusive intervention for these horses, and the natural approach, working with the horse is left as a last resort.

All the time the horse is suffering from the unpleasant interventions, and side effects from the NASID's and steroids

Navicular, laminitis, DJD... there are great natural approaches to making the horse more comfortable and getting a better long term result - and they are cheaper too!

Time and nature - the most powerful tools in the box.
 
I dont doubt my vets at all, just wondered how these may compare to others who have similar problems with their horses. He did have more xrays taken I just havent been sent them yet.
I have already said I'd look up rockley farm and will email them when I get home as I am not sure the shoes will help long term
Amymay - yes he did trot up much sounder with his new shoes on but my concern is how much can shoes actually do and how long until he 'gets used' to them and the issues all flare back up
my gut feeling is to give these shoes a couple of months and see where we end up, chances are it will be shoeless in a field
 
Amymay - yes he did trot up much sounder with his new shoes on but my concern is how much can shoes actually do and how long until he 'gets used' to them and the issues all flare back up
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Brilliant - it doesn't always work, and some horses struggle with them from the word go.

It's not a question of the horse getting 'used' to them, and then reverting. They form part of his treatment. I suspect the advice is to have this type of shoe fitted for several months, and then go from there.

I'm glad he is more comfortable.
 
OP so pleased to hear your vets have your confidence:) Also sounds as if they did (unlike mine at the time) take the "right" xrays.

Every good wish for a good recovery for your horse which ever route you go down. I know how awful this feels and how helpless it makes you feel.
 
My horse has Ringbone and is being shod with natural balance shoes, for now! Because he insured and they are paying for his treatment, which is steroid injections & a good joint supplement. At the moment he is sound. Once the 12 months are up and I can no longer claim then I'm going to consider removing his shoes & seeing if he remains sound. Farrier say he has good feet, and the vet has agreed that I have nothing to lose if I remove them.
 
brucea said:
It almost makes me weep China that there is so much infective and intrusive intervention for these horses, and the natural approach, working with the horse is left as a last resort.

All the time the horse is suffering from the unpleasant interventions, and side effects from the NASID's and steroids

Navicular, laminitis, DJD... there are great natural approaches to making the horse more comfortable and getting a better long term result - and they are cheaper too!

Time and nature - the most powerful tools in the box.
Click to expand...
I wholeheartedly agree Brucea. I've just been passed a horse today, £4k sunk in vet costs, and bilaterally lame in front, needing degree wedge pads (obviously not) on his hinds. He's only 8, what a crime. I expect to have him sound in 3 months on soft surfaces, and in full work by 6 months. Without shoes of course.

OP, keep asking the vets, what will their recommendations cure, if you don't get the right answers, keep asking more questions until you do.
 
brucea said:
It almost makes me weep China that there is so much infective and intrusive intervention for these horses, and the natural approach, working with the horse is left as a last resort.

All the time the horse is suffering from the unpleasant interventions, and side effects from the NASID's and steroids

Navicular, laminitis, DJD... there are great natural approaches to making the horse more comfortable and getting a better long term result - and they are cheaper too!

Time and nature - the most powerful tools in the box.
Click to expand...
Hear, hear.
 
My mare has just been diagnosed with navicular changes in both fronts, bilateral spavin and an "irregular" proximal suspensory ligament on her near hind. I bought this horse, barefoot in April 2010 as she had been turned out from racing for at least six months. I hacked her everywhere and she was sound. I only put shoes on because I was told at a hospital which shall remain un-named that as she is a TB she should be shod as she was "footy". ( She was actually there to have a bone chip removed from her fetlock). So not knowing any better, I got her shod. Purely coincidental that shoes go on and a few weeks later horse goes lame and hasn't been right since? I'll let you make your own decision on that, but I know what I think. The shoes are coming off in a couple of weeks, at the end of the shoe cycle and they won't go on as long as I can help it. She will have winter off work and I will start from scratch with her again in Spring. I am going to let nature take it's course, and my new farrier is fully supportive of my decision. I totally believe that barefoot is the way to go for a lot of horses with problems -and my horse hasn't even got her shoes off yet!
 
I agree with everyone who said get the shoes off and let nature take its course.

I think your horse looks like it has ringbone, more substancially in its left fore, but I dont think you can comment on the navicular bone from those Xrays.

I am very pleased to hear the wedges are helping, getting them comfy is the first hurdle!
 
Black_Horse_White said:
My horse has Ringbone and is being shod with natural balance shoes, for now! Because he insured and they are paying for his treatment, which is steroid injections & a good joint supplement. At the moment he is sound. Once the 12 months are up and I can no longer claim then I'm going to consider removing his shoes & seeing if he remains sound. Farrier say he has good feet, and the vet has agreed that I have nothing to lose if I remove them.
Click to expand...
The vet hospital remedial farrier [he has a practice locally] shod my perfectly sound horse with natural balance shoes, it was obvious when I rode him that his ligaments were under stress, he never had them again, he has a perfect hoof pastern angle, all I am saying is, be careful and be prepared to use your own judgement if necessary.
 
i feel for you its awfull when you find out something like this but i also had same thing with my chap about two yrs ago diagnosed with "changes" to front feet ie djd and poss navicular he had a yr of various treatments and also massive wedges fitted he was slightly sounder for about two months then started going lame again also started kicking himself and tripping badly i had run out of insurance and didnt know what to do then about 7 months ago decided i would take his shoes off and go the barefoot route and i have to say i have never seen him look so good the difference in his feet are incredible!!!he is now in full work!:)
i echo the people who have said about looking at rockley site,my chap also is 8 and he looks so happy now,i would never shoe another horse again!!!good luck :)
 
There were more than 2 xrays taken I've just only posted 2 rather than loads
Jackessex-thats what worrys me, that the wedges will only be a short term fix then we will be back to square one
I have spoken to Nik at rockely farm and that will continue once i've spoken to my vet who is out on wednesday
 
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