Hooves, Shoes and Farriers

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wiglet

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:( Where to start.
My TB has shocking hooves. Always has. I have tried lots of supplements, hoof gels/oils etc. Not much improvement.

Today she was shod. She's elderly now and due to arthritis, shoeing can be uncomfortable for her. I stand her on rubber matting, farrier is as gentle as possible, we get shoes on in the end. Not ideal.

So where do I go now? Glue on shoes? My farrier is old school and wouldn't do them - I'd have to use another farrier... but I wouldn't want to offend present farrier - anyone had glue ons? Are they any good? Do they stay on? My veteran isn't ridden anymore so am thinking they would surely stay on if she's just turned out? Comments?

Supplements - any recommendations for something to make the horn grow? I/She desparately needs more hoof growth.

There also appears to be some re-accuring infection in the hoof (and she has quite a few abscesses) - I hot tub but it's not shifting it and also the tubbing makes the horn softer.

All comments appreciated - am beginning to loose the will to go on with this - I just want her to be comfortable and enjoy her retirement.
 
Do you have any photos?

The foundation of good hooves is a good diet. All the lotions and potions or even mineral supplements won't fix bad feet if the horse is consuming too much sugar and starch. Hard feed is a big culprit, but you also need to consider grass intake.

Perhaps if the horse finds shoeing uncomfortable you could consider barefoot? This will also help her grow some healthy feet, as stimulation is also necessary to develop healthy structures.
 
I don't have lots of advice, but can I say glue on shoes in my experience are very expensive - have you investigated the cost? I think you may be shocked to find you would be looking at more than £100 for just a pair.

Have you tried any topical anti fungicidal spray for the infection? That would be my first plan of action. Bardsey Mills have brought out a seemingly great new anti fungicidal spray useful for all sorts of complaints.
Have you engaged the vet at all? Your vet should be able to assist with the infection.

My husband is a farrier and some clients have to give bute to their horses prior to shoeing if they are arthritic and uncomfortable. Maybe discuss this with your vet.
 
Goldenstar - Diet at the moment is TopSpec Feed balancer, Happy Hoof (the only chaff she will eat) and Dengie AlfaBeet. She is a fussy feeder and won't eat Alfalfa (too rough and stalky) When she's stabled at night she has haylage.

TwoStroke - She doesn't receive any hard feed but has access to good grass. Her feet are that bad I don't think barefoot would work - it would make her very sore although I appreciate what you're getting at.

YasandCrystal - I had no idea about the cost and am rather shocked... Will look into the fungicidal spray you mention. The vet sees her regularly - she is on long term bute - one sachet a day. On farrier day I give extra bute. Not mentioned about the infection yet - will ask when they next visit.
 
Is she a poor doer?

The good grass is likely to be an issue - are you able to reduce grass intake and replace it with haylage or soaked hay?

I would also stop the happyhoof (it's mollassed) and also the alfabeet (some horses don't get on with alfalfa). Instead I would feed fast fibre or speedibeet. I would also swap the TopSpec for a foot-friendly supplement such as one of these:

Pro Hoof

Pro Balance+

Forage Plus balancers

Alternatively you could have your forage analysed and feed balanced minerals, which usually helps a lot.

If she needs a conditioning feed, then micronised linseed is excellent. Oats are also very useful, and generally well tolerated foot-wise.
 
Is she being worked Wiglet? What about boots instead of shoes for work if she's finding being shod so hard? Obviously when they stand on 3 legs it compromises the blood supply to the other feet so can get uncomfy if its too long for them. Or is it the joints in her legs struggling with the positions?

The diet needs addressing as its high in sugar which is bad for feet. At her age she needs a biotin supp which the ones 2stroke recommended have :) Grumbling abscesses suggest diet problems, stretched white line allowing bacteria into the hooves.

Some pics of sole and side on with camera on the floor would be helpful :)
 
TwoStroke - She's a very poor doer :( I had no idea re: grass - thought good grass would be ok - can easily restrict grass and feed haylage instead though. Changing the feed might be a bit more difficult - she is fussy and won't have fast fibre and is not that keen on speedibeet (no sugar I guess!!) I will look into the foot supps you suggest and the balancer - not heard of that one before. She does have linseed in winter so will continue with that and might try the oats. Thanks for your advice :)

TigerTail - she is not worked, she is retired. Her joints are arthritic and she had problems lifting her legs up to be shod. Boots are something I was thinking about but her hoof quality is so poor I am sure it's only the shoe holding everything together... Was hoping to improve the hoof then think about boots? Will get some pics.

YasandCrystal - the fungicidal spray - did you mean the Vetericyn spray? I bought the Horseware one last week - Hypocare. Will try using that on it.

Thanks for all the advice so far - am getting new avenues to explore
 
If you can make those changes you should start to see a good improvement in the new hoof growth from the coronet band :). Then you may find that she would be comfortable enough manage a break from shoes which would allow her feet to recover. Most of her soreness now is likely due to thin and sensitive soles, which a reduction in sugar should help with.

Also, if you can get hold of some Coolstance Copra to try her on. It's very good for condition and is safe for feet. Some horses love it and some don't though, so it's best to try before buying a huge sack of it.
 
Amymay - I dare not take her shoes off atm - it would cause her much discomfort.

TwoStroke - thank you so much for the advice. I was so down this morning after having her shod - I can see a way forward now :)
 
wiglet said:
TwoStroke - thank you so much for the advice. I was so down this morning after having her shod - I can see a way forward now :)
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No problem :). For more foot info you could check out the Phoenixhorse forum. We are all barefooters, but a healthy hoof is a healthy hoof, regardless of whether you put a shoe on it or not. There's a wealth of information there on growing better hooves.
 
Wiglet dont forget to get us some pics!

Sometimes you just have to persist with the food, they get used to the sugary stuff like kids on crap diets and need weaning off it. Hay would be better than hay ledge ideally. The copra is apparently quite good for fussy ones, but def get off that happy hoof stuff drives me nuts they think its good for hooves :eek:
 
Guilty as charged!!... I thought HappyHoof was good for hooves DOH!!
If I can find good quality hay I will feed it - she does like good hay but I usually go for hage due to crap hay and the need for condition.

Will check out the Phoenixhorse forum.

Oooh.. will get some pic as well but might need some advice on how to post them on here!!
 
wiglet said:
Goldenstar - Diet at the moment is TopSpec Feed balancer, Happy Hoof (the only chaff she will eat) and Dengie AlfaBeet. She is a fussy feeder and won't eat Alfalfa (too rough and stalky) When she's stabled at night she has haylage.
Click to expand...

Ah TopSpec - the barefooter's nemesis :D And Happy Hoof - a contradiction in terms :o (did you know it is a mixture of alfalfa, straw and molasses)?

YOU NEED TO ADDRESS HER DIET.

Poor quality hooves, abscessing and discomfort are all dietary related problems.

The problems you have had before have likely been because the supplements you have been feeding don't contain the correct balance for your forage.

Someone has already listed supplements that do.

If you are happy to wanted to move away from the alfalfa based feed, then you could replace the Alfabeet with Fast Fibre and/or unmolassed beet as a calorie source.

Spiller's High Fibre Cubes have been found effective for even very sugar sensitive horses and are nice and tasty for a fussy eater.

You can also use old fashioned unmolassed hay chaff (£6 for a massive sack) either with the feed or in a separate bucket (which is how my old boy prefers it).

Coolstance copra is a high fat feed that works well for helping add weight (if the horse will eat it.

Oldies benefit from extra vitamin E in the diet. The listed supplements have added, but you can also squeeze in a 1000iu gelcap in the feed during winter. Also amino acids like lysine (in the supplements) and methionine (in linseed).

Micronised linseed is very beneficial for coat, gut mucualge, joints and maintaining the hoof moisture balance by repelling water.

Address the diet fist for a couple of months - and then review whether she still needs shoes.

You can email the pics to me, if you want me to put them on the forum for you (pm me for my addy)
 
hi wiglet,
get some Simple System horse feeds, we have TBs young & old some who had dreadful feet when we got them & all have vastly improved with Simple sytem feeds: forage based & linseed/seaweed, also used Formula for feet & farriers formula to good effect on some of the worst feet ( one came with wall dissection due to sandcrack supposedly but it was a mess: now completely grown out). Discuss shortening your shoeing interval to help with preserving horn & DeFINATELY get some bute to ease shoeing process unless horse has gastriculcer issues. Good luck x
 
Currently changing my horses feed to a more fert friendly diet. How do you feed micronised linseed and also roughly how much for a 16.2 tb weighing 600kg ? Does it need soaking i have no idea and the bag i have bought has no instuctions on :/
 
Do you mean foot friendly? :D

I give both horses a coffee mug full. Tank is 16.1 draft and Obi is 14.3 arab (but he is elderly and needs more).

Micronised linseed is already cooked, so just chuck it in the bucket.
A 20 kg sack from Charnwood will last me all winter.
 
Lol yes foot* friendly my spelling is so bad especially on my phone the keys are too close together. fab thanks i havent dared to feed it in case it needed to be soaked and i dont know anyone else who uses it haha :)
 
Have taken all the advice on board and will be changing her diet totally - however, due to her age (she's 25 - ancient for a TB!) and fussy ways, I need to do it very gradually.

The products I am thinking of are:
Dengie Unmolassed HiFi (is this unmollassed as stated or is it just a marketing ploy?)
Speedibeet (she's not keen on it but will have to get used to it)

Forageplus Hoof Health Equine Balancer (TwoStroke - the link you gave took me to Forageplus Summer Balancer - would the New Hoof Health one be more appropriate for my needs?)

Linseed - will get from Charnwood as normal
Spillers HiFibre cubes

If she doesn't hold her weight on this then I will replace the HiFibre cubes with Coolstance Copra

Would this diet be suitable?
 
wiglet said:
Have taken all the advice on board and will be changing her diet totally - however, due to her age (she's 25 - ancient for a TB!) and fussy ways, I need to do it very gradually.

The products I am thinking of are:
Dengie Unmolassed HiFi (is this unmollassed as stated or is it just a marketing ploy?)
Speedibeet (she's not keen on it but will have to get used to it)

Forageplus Hoof Health Equine Balancer (TwoStroke - the link you gave took me to Forageplus Summer Balancer - would the New Hoof Health one be more appropriate for my needs?)

Linseed - will get from Charnwood as normal
Spillers HiFibre cubes

If she doesn't hold her weight on this then I will replace the HiFibre cubes with Coolstance Copra

Would this diet be suitable?
Click to expand...

Looks good. The Dengie is unmolassed, so you should be ok with it (it does contain alfalfa, so if after 6 months you're not happy with progress then perhaps consider swapping, but many do fine on it).

The new Hoof Health forage plus balancer would fit your needs, and you're right in that the extra amino acids and B vits may be some help for an oldie. It doesn't have Vit E in, which as Sez mentioned is, helpful for older horses, but forage plus and Pro Earth (on ebay) sell a powdered form if you wanted to add it in.

This combined with reducing grass intake should help a great deal. :)

P.S if in future you want to consider trying a barefoot transition just give the Barefoot Taliban a call ;).
 
you can try to encourage some new hoof growth by rubbing cornucresine(sp!) into her coronet band every other day. it will take a while and wont be an instance fix but you should get faster hoof growth and so be able to either take her shoes off (once enough growth is through) or shoe her easily.
 
You can get gel pads in the boots to help cushion her feet it's what my lami is in now as he had a really bad abcess that came out of three exit holes and can't get a show on. He is turnt out in them too.
My boy has the cavallo simple boots wire gel pads.
 
My semi-retired mare had glue on heart bar shoes for about 6 months and they worked really well for her. She was stabled at night and out in a small woodchip paddock on her own during the day, and she went back to normal front shoes before going out to grass for the summer. They were very expensive - £120 for glue on heart bars and a hind trim :eek:
 
As promised, here are a few pics of the feet.
Her worst hoof is her off side hind - front view

Side view

Sole

There is lots of infection in the upper right area of the frog - it doesn't really show up on the pic but the sole and frog are virtually level with each other.

Comments?

Other hooves are a little better - this is her front - still a flat TB hoof...
 
still a flat TB hoof...
Click to expand...

No, no, no - don't believe the misconceptions. TB's can have fantastic hooves, they aren't born with long toes, flair and under-run heels. Being shod from a young age and diet causes a lot the problems (bad trimming/shoeing does happen too).
 
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