horse died at riding club hunter trial

So wagtail, tell me. Should I get my horses vetted every time they do fast work, every time they go out to a party? Every time they hoon round the field on their own? I would be having them vetted a few times a week!!!

Do you thing every amateur athlete gets a full health check every time he goes for a run?

Baggy, the photo is stunning, brings a tear to my eye.
 
Ladylina83 said:
You would have a 5 stage vetting done on a horse you have had for 4 years before popping to do your local riding club hunter trails over a bank holiday ??
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It depends on how big the course was. Personally, I would, yes. But that is because my horses are pets as well as just horses. They are never sold on. I accept that not everyone views their horses this way however.

My newest horse is being brought back into full work after a hock operation and is now 100% sound. He is an ex race horse, and I may want to event him in the future (if he can jump - I haven't tried him yet!). If I do decide to event him, he will have a 5 stage vetting to make sure he is up to the job. I would rather pay the money and be told he is not up to the job than find out the hard way. I can always lower my sights.
 
Wagtail said:
I am genuinely sorry for the loss of those horses. I stated to the owner of Tommy, that I did not think 15 was old at all, and how terrible she must feel.

As for Baggybreeches, she started off by saying I was talking 'shite' and by shouting in her posts. I still expressed I was sorry she had lost her horse.
a)Because your were talking shite. I did not shout. I appreciate your sorrow, but I am still annoyed at your insinuation that I should have had an otherwise fit, healthy and suitable for the job horse vetted.

The discussion then moved on to whether horses should be vetted before competing in strenuous competition such as P2P. I think it is an important thing to consider and something that may prevent heartache for others. In the case of the race horse on my yard with a heart murmur, she is only 5 years old. The vet said there is little doubt she would have collapsed and died had she continued racing. However, despite her decline in performance on the track, she had never been vetted! Thankfully, she is now happily able to compete at local level dressage and hack out with very little chance of it over taxing her heart.
b)A heart murmour is something detectable and is present in a fair few horses who have competed at high levels, most of these horses dropped a level or two and continue quite happily, again in any of Emerald's annual checks the vets have always commented on how fit he is. Having any horse vetted is only representative of the condition on that day.
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I would have changed the colour but I can't :$
 
Wagtail said:
If I do decide to event him, he will have a 5 stage vetting to make sure he is up to the job. I would rather pay the money and be told he is not up to the job than find out the hard way. I can always lower my sights.
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I would advise you not to bother, the only horse I had vetted is as sound as pound, but hates competing, go figure, a horses suitability relies on many different things.
 
Thistle said:
So wagtail, tell me. Should I get my horses vetted every time they do fast work, every time they go out to a party? Every time they hoon round the field on their own? I would be having them vetted a few times a week!!!

Do you thing every amateur athlete gets a full health check every time he goes for a run?

Baggy, the photo is stunning, brings a tear to my eye.
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Now you are being silly. You only need to get your horses vetted initially and then have a health check up once a year when they are vaccinated. :)
 
Baggybreeches said:
I would advise you not to bother, the only horse I had vetted is as sound as pound, but hates competing, go figure, a horses suitability relies on many different things.
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I do not understand the relevance of this post. :confused: Of course I wouldn't event him if he was unsuitable in other ways.
 
Wagtail said:
It depends on how big the course was. Personally, I would, yes. But that is because my horses are pets as well as just horses. They are never sold on. I accept that not everyone views their horses this way however.
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My horses are pets first and foremost, but they are bred to be athletes, and they are much happier in work and hard work at that, I would suggest you return to this thread in several years time when you have a little more world experience outside the strange little bubble in which you currently reside.
And FWIW if you dare suggest that my horse wasn't fit enough to jump 18 4ft6 fences over 3miles 4 furlongs, I would suggest you come and try to gallop 1 mile on my other one, because until you have done it you don't have the faintest idea.
 
So how often do you recommend that people have their horses vetted then? Every year, every month, every week? Because a lot of problems can arise during the years of ownership that won't be there at the initial vetting. For example, I had a horse that passed a full vetting, but developed a serious heart murmur a few years later.
 
I took my 24yr old out for a hack on Sunday - and he will be competing as a show hunter and a veteran horse in June - and without being boasty about it kicks the arse of those 5 times younger than him frequently :D !

Its absolute madness to suggest that he be vetted on a regular basis.

I do however have him blood tested every year to check vital organs and his heart is checked then - but lets be honest something could happen within minutes, hours, days, weeks of this being done so unless you are married to a vet (if only :D) and they follow you to every event to perform a vetting immediately prior to you competing I don't see how a vetting is going to help you very much!
 
Wagtail said:
Now you are being silly. You only need to get your horses vetted initially and then have a health check up once a year when they are vaccinated. :)
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That's not what you said. You said that horses should be vetted before strenous work.

My horses compete aff BE SJ and dressage, they have a heart check at vaccination and other vet treatment as necessary. I can't really see why a horse needs to have a 5 stage vetting which includes it's ID sketch etc repeated at yearly intervals.

Just because my horse passed a vet last year doesn't mean it can't catch a virus in the mean time.

Stop back tracking and go away and learn what the practices are that you are recommending that everyone does.
 
How immature some of you lot are being, someone has just lost a horse and your argueing about elderly horses :s? Please be more sympathetic?
 
I am very sorry for you loss, I was also at the hunter trial and will not be going back, it was very sad when we heard in the collecting ring.
 
TGM said:
So how often do you recommend that people have their horses vetted then? Every year, every month, every week? Because a lot of problems can arise during the years of ownership that won't be there at the initial vetting. For example, I had a horse that passed a full vetting, but developed a serious heart murmur a few years later.
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Blimey. What is wrong with wanting to make sure that your horses can cope with what you are asking of them? An initial vetting with a check up every year. Why are people so averse to that? Had the mare on my yard not had the vetting and instead continued to compete, she would most likely be dead now. Why do you think it is so wrong to have them vetted?

Of course a vetting will not pickup every single thing, and horses can develop heart murmurs at any time in their lives. But these can be picked up by an annual check up.

And for people worried that the same thing might happen to their horse, I think reccommending a vetting and annual check ups is hardly an evil thing to do. It may well prevent other tragedies.
 
Thistle said:
That's not what you said. You said that horses should be vetted before strenous work.
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You misunderstood. I did not mean before every piece of strenuous work. Why would anyone suggest that? I meant before deciding to work them at that level.
 
It would seem despite people telling the poster, Wagtail is determined to have all the subtlety of a breeze block.

You know some people go mad about this forum saying people are rude etc but this thread is the height of it. Not just rude but downright crass. I feel very sorry for the woman who lost her horse having to read this tripe.
 
Given the mare I'd owned for five years, and which had competed in all RC teams and upto PN eventing had never shown signs of a heart murmur until her sale vetting two months after her previous vet check I think that Wagtail should be less complacent and have her horses checked at least every two months and possibly every time they are worked at all strenuously. Otherwise how can she be the ultimately concerned owner that the rest of us are clearly not - in her eyes.

*spoken as someone who happily took a 20+yo round a Hunter Trial course sufficiently under the optimum time to come second rather than win it*
 
If I had just lost a horse I would be absolutely devastated reading this thread.

RIP Tommy and sincere sympathy to all his connections.
 
If only everything were so black and white Wagtail. If only.....
For what you propose, a horse would need a weekly vetting and even then something might rear its ugly head and suprise the pants off you.
Perhaps some lesson's in how not to put your foot firmly in your mouth? Or shall I pass you a spade so you can keep on digging?
Thoughts for the connections to both horses.
 
Wagtail said:
You misunderstood. I did not mean before every piece of strenuous work. Why would anyone suggest that? I meant before deciding to work them at that level.
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You suggested that I should have had my horse vetted before going point to point, then you you changed your mind and said no, when I first got him but with annual checks, like I said the relevance of having a 6yr old vetted that had been out of work for 3 months would be no relevance to his condition and fitness 3 days ago.
 
RebelRebel said:
If I had just lost a horse I would be absolutely devastated reading this thread.

RIP Tommy and sincere sympathy to all his connections.
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I am absolutely devastated, and I have a huge Emerald shaped hole in my life (as does my husband who thought he was the bees knees), but the tripe that Wagtail is posting is making me livid/astounded and increduled in equal measure!
 
Twist my words as much as you like.

I give in. You must be right. There is no need to check that horses are fit enough for competition at all. I will continue to do it however, and you will not.
 
Wagtail said:
Twist my words as much as you like.

I give in. You must be right. There is no need to check that horses are fit enough for competition at all. I will continue to do it however, and you will not.
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Wagtail, you are talking rubbish and upsetting vulnerable people. Perhaps its time to say the S word and move on. People are very forgiving if you put your hand in the air and admit you were talking out of the orifice normally seen resting in the saddle. I know because I've done it enough times.
 
Three 18yr olds completed Badminton at the weekend. And I have to say, Lenamore and Comanche were some of the best looking fitness-wise come the end of the course! And just look at Spring Along - as strong as an ox, but he just took either a heart attack or aortic tear most likely. He couldn't have been fitter. My Dad's friend, a marathon runner and keen cyclist, is one of the healthiest people I know and had a massive MI at the age of 43.

Still, no matter what the horses's age or fitness, it's a distressing sight to see, and devastating for the owners/riders. Thoughts to them.
 
Baggybreeches said:
I am absolutely devastated, and I have a huge Emerald shaped hole in my life (as does my husband who thought he was the bees knees), but the tripe that Wagtail is posting is making me livid/astounded and increduled in equal measure!
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Baggybreeches, I only just spotted this. I am SO, SO sorry about Emerald. You have my deepest sympathies :(
And Wagtail, you are as subtle as a flying brick.
 
Wagtail said:
Twist my words as much as you like.

I give in. You must be right. There is no need to check that horses are fit enough for competition at all. I will continue to do it however, and you will not.
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i suggest you read your own posts back then Wagtail- you've changed your mind and contradicted yourself the entire way through this thread.

Condolences to those who knew the horses which were lost, i hope this thread isn't too upsetting :mad:

and Baggybreaches- your horse looked beautiful, and so well in himself, such a waste
 
Wagtail said:
Obviously this 'elderly' horse was not fit enough or had a heart problem that meant that cross country was too much for him.
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I think that this was debated quite extensively in the Grand National Thread, Wagtail - where it became apparent quite quickly that you didn't really know what you were talking about............
 
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