Horse has reduced me to tears today

So frustrating isn;t it

Try doing this in hand only at first. With you walking beside him - then you can focus on his behavior without the worry of having to stay in the saddle.

When you do ride out - I have one rule no spinning. If you spin round, you get turned right back in the direction we are going. You can go forward or back if you want, but you can't turn around. Need to be quite firm about this.

We once walked backwards for almost 400 yards! Walking backwards is very hard work for them, but also tends to settle them because it's not easy to do.

Also think maybe about using a wip-*** rope with a popper instead of a stick or whip - it is much more visual, and you can swing it to either rump - it's much more effective than a stick, and a 12' rope will double as a lead rope if you need to get off.
 
i had this problem with my horse and the only thing that worked was a schooling whip.

i tried sitting it out, circles, kicking, short whip, spurs, making her go backwards etc etc

then i got a schooling whip and hit her continously until she walked forward - doesnt sound very nice but it only took her about 10-15 seconds to work this out, she moved forward i stopped, and i did this every time she planted herself. n.b i knew my horse was being naughty and i do not do this if she is genuinley scared of something.

other things to try is getting someone else to ride your horse out see if it makes a difference, if you end up going home make sure you work his socks off (lunge or ride) in the school/field then turn him out so that going home doesnt equal the easy life for him. use your anger/frustration to train your horse when you get home too like lots of ground work getting your horse to do what you want.

hope you manage to get it sorted - sounds like he's trying you out and winning
 
My horse did this and i tried everything, then a confident friend started riding him, and we hack out on our own quite happily. If he plants his feet i sit quietly wait a moment and ask gently for him to go forward, if he spins i turn him to face the way I was going and again just sit, as soon as he makes a forward movement I reward him with lots of praise and a scratch on his withers, at the beginning of the ride he can be quite sticky but as soon as he realises i am not going to give in he becomes forward going and enjoys the ride. If i put too much pressure or use a whip he resents it, squeals and starts bucking, every horse is different but this works for me, it can take a bit of time and patience but its worth a try? Good luck
 
just thinking as it got my mare moving for a while as she is a quick learner.. the 3 kick rule.
my trainer taught it me last year and it got my stubborn mare mmoving and is now one of the best leaders on the yard..
first you just have to kick and reallly mean it then 2nd time kick really hard and third time smack and kick..
1) kick
2) kick harder
3)smack and kick hard
4) if no movement start again
as soon as they take a step big praise and start again if they were to stop.
eventually they realise tht the slower they move the worse it gets.
 
Thinking from the Cobs view, Spring grass or hack no contest really. Not alot of help, but I think we have all been in your position at some time with our horses and know just how frustraiting it is.
 
If the horse goes out fine with another rider but tests you, I would recommend going back to ground work to improve your partnership/leadership. Personally I would double check that the ground work is excellent before moving on to riding. If necessary, get assistance from a good trainer (someone who is good at sorting behavioural issues) to back you up and for your confidence.

It can be useful to have a "dually" halter or quite thin rope halter, the idea being that you release pressure as soon as the horse responds. Use a lunge line or proper length lead rope, gloves, hat.

Work in the school at first, your horse should need only the slightest hint of pressure on the lead rope to follow you. Practice going over/through obstacles; tarpaulin, poles, etc. When this all goes smoothly, work outside the school. I find it helpful to avoid the horse planting by moving it slightly to the side every time you see it coming, it is easier to prevent them planting than move them once they are stuck.

Don't despair, if you feel really stuck there are people out there who can help. I reckon if you find a good behavioural trainer they can do one session with you doing ground work, give you some time to practice it, and then come back and support you for a ridden session.
 
You have loads of good advice so I wont repeat just add another little trick that worked on rearer/napper.If he had time in walk to plant rear spin or walk backwards then I trotted,if he was going forwards he was keen it worked nearly everytime .If in doubt send him forwards in trot you have to be quick and recognise signs but it did work.
 
Isn't ear twitching illegal? :confused: It concerns me that anyone would use such a method to try and make a horse go forward. :(
 
alicemary said:
Anyone got a good book for me to read while Im sitting it out ? I have sat here and composed a for sale ad so he is on notice. Make a good riding school horse probably.
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Take this week's H&H!!

I agree, sitting it out is probably the best way if you can't get someone to go out with you.

If you are running out of time then try hopping off and leading him for a 100yards or so then getting back on and trying again.

I know exactly how fustrating it can be. I schooled on a 17.3 IDxWB a few years ago and he'd just plant himself. You could flap and kick and smack all you liked and nothing would happen. Eventually he would just walk on like nothing had happened. My instructor said it was one of 3 things... Immature horse not really ready for riding, or Poorly schooled horse not respecting the aids, or just plain nappyness. It turned out to be a combination of the first 2. He had the next winter off, grew by another 3 inches, was rebacked and was a different horse.
 
cellie said:
You have loads of good advice so I wont repeat just add another little trick that worked on rearer/napper.If he had time in walk to plant rear spin or walk backwards then I trotted,if he was going forwards he was keen it worked nearly everytime .If in doubt send him forwards in trot you have to be quick and recognise signs but it did work.
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This is a very good suggestion.
My horse is a napping nightmare. Perfect with others he will go out in front, behind etc, but on his own its a no go! He stops, spins, rears (not right up), bucks, leaps, etc. If you try and turn him in circles he runs backwards and i mean RUNS backwards whether it up hill or downhill.
When he did it i would sit it out and let him tantrum for a while. If it carried on for a long time i would get off and lead him forwards for 100 yards and jump back on. When i get back on he will always spin etc and he ALWAYS spins right. So i push him right into the right hand hedge, keep my right rein really short and hop on, he spins left generally....but its never with much power so i keep him spinning and then push him straight into trot and then he goes forwards nicely.

He too started to get better but since going out 24/7 is just horrendous.

I have gone back to basics....i am now leading him out in hand everyday on his own. I am letting him look at everything that is scary and using tonnes of praise.
What i am going to do is lead him around all of the rides a couple of times, and thenlead him out tacked up, and then lead him out tacked up and start getting on him after we have been out for a while and then start getting on him closer to home.
You cant hit paddy.....he really gets evil if you do.....due to being passed around alot and we think not treated brilliantly in the past.
So i am trying to get a better bond with him whilst leading out in hand.

I am also doing lots of things like, leading away from the yard then after a mile turning back for home, going halfway back, and then truning round and carrying on away from the yard. Also doing lots of stopping, standing still and stoping, then circling and then carrying on, so that when you stop he doesnt turn for home and also a circle doesnt automatically mean home time.
Lots of halt, walk and trot transitions to keep him listening to me and tonnes of praise.
Its actually been quite nice this week....the evenings have been lovely and i have had an awfull week at work so its actually been very relaxing....not to mention doing wonders for my waistline!

Dont loose your temper and hit your horse on the ground...it will just make him loose all respect for you. It is the most frustrating thing ever....but as i have learnt.....getting cross or being in a bad mood really doesnt help.

Definately if you can try having someone ride a bike out with you, not only is it company for you....but it will also reassure the horse.

Really hope you resolve the issues soon. I know exactly how frustrating it is.
 
blazingsaddles said:
If you're confident the horse is just t@king the mich@el, then by @ll me@ns give him @ sm@ck, but, if he is @ stressy type & l@cks confidence, then @ny kind of physic@l punishment will only m@ke him worse. Don't sm@ck, whip. dig with spurs, twist e@r or @ny other sort of punishment, it won't work & you will end up with @ nightm@re. He needs to get his confidence from you - if th@t me@ns you h@ve to dismount & le@d, then do it. Lots of pr@ise when he does well & m@ke light of @ny 'moments' he h@s. His confidence needs building by you, not through violence.:)

Excuse the @'s - the key h@s bust!:mad:
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:eek::D:D Is there not a little raised bit? you can jab a pen on the 'hole' and it should give you the desired letter. (obviously you are not thick and have tried) just wanted to laugh at the @@@@ really :p:D:D
 
Puppy said:
Isn't ear twitching illegal? :confused: It concerns me that anyone would use such a method to try and make a horse go forward. :(
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I have no idea if it is illegal or not but i think if i tried it i would have several big chunks bitten out of my arms!!!!:D Also i dont think it would exactly help my horses headshyness!:confused:
 
Have you tried a whip whop rather than a whip? It's basically a lead rope (without the clip) folded in two and notted ( the not creates a loop/handle for you to hold) you can flick it and its more of a visual stimulus so different from a whip. Can be very effective.

Also when he plants are you just urging him to go straight forwards? If so have you tried just getting to move one foot, maybe sideways etc, when they lock if you can get one foot to move they unlock and some times you are then merrily on your way. You can encourage this by holding one rein shorter so horse has to face the side, it's not very comfy to stand like this for a long while so they'll usually move. You don't pull harder you just put their head there and wait.

Which brings me to another option, sit it out, sounds like when he plants you are quite comfy he's not dancing around in the middle of the road. So just wait it out, it did take me 2 hours to do a 30 minute hack once but we got there!

Finally do as you are doing, just get off and lead and hop back on again in a while. You can also if you suspect a little bit of micky taking is going on, lead past scarey thing lead back past scarey thing, stop and stare at scary thing, maybe sniff scary thing if going well, lead back past hop on and try to ride past use whip whop, if no joy rinse repeat the above or just lead past if time is running out.
There's nothing bad in it sometimes it's just a case of you two getting your confidence back in each other.

Try all the above tips and try them for a long while, pic your horses favourite route and stick with that for a while. Even if you horror of horrors end up leading him the whole way one day , well you made it round the route so don't beat yourself up.

You could also do a little clicker work so horse gets click and treat when he goes passed scarey thing, since it's a reward and food based system it can work wonders on motivating cobs.

Also hack out with others on reliable horses when you can as that will give you both a confidence boost.

Small steps and all that.
 
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Had two horrendous rides yesterday and today, got off three times and led first day then eventually had to turn round as absolutely worn out! (me) From not going round corner now he wont go out of yard and even if I lead him now wont go out of village. When I do finally get him going forward he will only turn in direction of home at each change of direction. Thought I had it licked yesterday as I poked him behind the saddle with my car key and he went forward , today it hasnt worked. I have arranged now to pay someone to ride him out for me a few times to see if fresh legs works, as I have really had enough now. If he had always been like this I could understand it to a point but after 9 months! I wonder if hes just decided that the yard is at last his home and was only visiting before! This is supposed to be my hobby and I am not enjoying it. Two or three posters have mentioned fresh grass time with their problem horses perhaps that is it
 
I have been starting a youngster with an extremely well know trainer (won't mention his name ) coming down to help.
I haven't had any problems but when we were talking about the possibilty of stopping his advice was to go forward in any direction hard left hard right and to carry a whip wob (rope)as advised by another poster.
I have found this invaluable advise the whip wob easily sends the horse forward without causing pain and i made mine out of sailing rope for pennies.
Can you ride in a school and get your gears sorted out also longlining can help but I would advise someone at the head to maintain forward motion .
Also riding wih a schoolmaster horse that is forward going could help.
 
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OP I wouldn't be getting off. Nor poking with keys or twisting ears. Or crying or getting angry for that matter.

I think you need to get a confident rider in who is willing to sit it out with this horse. He sounds stubborn as hell. He needs to meet an even more stubborn rider.

I wouldn't mind betting at the moment you are making it worse by expecting this behaviour subconsciously, Neddy is laughing as soon as you get on because he knows you are going to get in. The minute you loose your cool you have lost the fight.

Do the pair of you a favour and get some help before the situation deteriorates even more.
 
alicemary said:
Had two horrendous rides yesterday and today, got off three times and led first day then eventually had to turn round as absolutely worn out! (me) From not going round corner now he wont go out of yard and even if I lead him now wont go out of village. When I do finally get him going forward he will only turn in direction of home at each change of direction. Thought I had it licked yesterday as I poked him behind the saddle with my car key and he went forward , today it hasnt worked. I have arranged now to pay someone to ride him out for me a few times to see if fresh legs works, as I have really had enough now. If he had always been like this I could understand it to a point but after 9 months! I wonder if hes just decided that the yard is at last his home and was only visiting before! This is supposed to be my hobby and I am not enjoying it. Two or three posters have mentioned fresh grass time with their problem horses perhaps that is it
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So you've tried whip and spurs, presumably kicking and yelling, twisting his ear and now poking him with a car key.

If I were you I'd be very ashamed. Your horse goes for other people, and doesn't go for you. Ever thought the way you treat him might have something to do with that?????

Bullying him is not the answer. Getting some help to improve your relationship with this horse and to get him to see you as a cool clear leader, is.
 
Not read the replies, but im truely shocked that you think twisting your poor horses ear will make him go forwards - how would you like it is someone held on to your ear like that? Il be surprised if your horse isnt now afraid of letting you touch his ears.

As for the napping, you say you bought him as a confidence giver, im assuming this means you lack confidence? In which case you need to hack out with someone, or as others have suggested get someone to lead you.

ETA - agree with Naturally, seriously im not surprised your horse wont do anything for you if you poke him behind the saddle (sensitive area for a horse) with a car key AND twist his ear, poor thing.......
 
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Hang in there, don't give up. I think you've made a good decision a good to get someone else to have a go so you both can breathe a little away from each other.

My horse was terrible when we got him, all he knew before was his field and his Mum really. He would just stop/spin/bolt you name it. I would say it's taken over a year to get him to be relaxed and happy outside (er and inside sometimes - oh, the fun we've had with the hedge next to the riding school :rolleyes:). Saying that, he dumped me on the floor just last week, think he had the advantage of suprise coz I don't expect it anymore! :D

I used to have to get off all the time a go past fences/people/cows etc and get back on after. It's so annoying and sometimes you feel like nothing is going in but it does.

I am very lucky to have OH who just doesn't tolerate shenanagins and has the seat/experience/strength to push him through. Honestly, after a few hacks with OH my horsey was MUCH better. The horse just seems to understand that he means business and gains confidence from that.

He still reacts to things but not such a BIG reaction, more of a flinch really. I'm not a bunny hugger and I'm not against using Mr Hurty Stick but it is important to know when and where so he doesn't start hating the whole experience.

If you like your horse and you don't feel he's being aggressive, stick it out. Take your time and try to enjoy it, it's fantastic when they do finally come round :)
 
Thanks Persephone, actually in my post I have said I am now paying someone to come and
ride out. Having read various horsey books, some say get him going forward by any means. To my way of thinking a sharp poke with a key is no different from using a schooling whip, he was not expecting it and he did go forward. Others say give him a
bristle broom up the bum, same thing IMHO. Anyway I am off for a drink now! Please dont all now post saying well if your a drunk what do you expect !!!
 
Ah, sorry missed that!

Thing is a schooling whip is used to back up your leg aids, so makes sense to the horse, whereas poking him in a funny place might make him jump but it's not really making sense to him. He'll just learn to ignore that too!

Anyway good luck, nothing so frustrating as a nappy horse! I'm sure you'll be right again in no time.

Don't drink too much :) Oh go on then :p
 
Your horse has no respect for you, and has learned that he can do what he likes and there's nothing you can do about it.

He's a big boy. He's not afraid to be alone at night, and he's used to being out during the day, so what could possibly be causing him to be afraid when you are riding him.

As for twisting his ear...horses are often ear-twitched as a means of restraint, so twisting his ear is hardly likely to activate him. Have you written off all pressure and release techniques based on your findings with his ear? I hope not, because pressure and release is your saviour in this case.

This horse needs some intensive groundwork to help him understand that if he is asked to do something he has to do it, and right away, otherwise you'll turn into a dangerous predatory beast which may just eat him.

Horses like this need a handler who will be quick-thinking, nimble, and not averse to giving him a good fright right when he needs it.

A pressure halter, long rope, and determination is all you need to turn him into an attentive, immediately compliant horse who knows his place and yours.

Once he learns to yield to pressure, and you learn to release it as he does, your relationship will change to one where he seeks ways to relieve himself of the pressure as soon as you begin to apply it. In other words, his resistance will lessen and he will become easier to handle.

By applying pressure to cue some response, and allowing him to be pressure-free immediately he gives a response (even if, to begin with, it is not the one you wanted), you can teach him that you are a fair and gentle handler. By repeating the cue till you get the correct response, and praising him when he gives it, you teach him what the cues mean and help him to hone his reactions.

By using only enough pressure to get a response, and never using your voice negatively, you take away his need to resist, and so he becomes easier to handle.

Leaving him free of pressure unless actually asking him to do something, encourages him to stand at peace, and to want to be with you.

Then you longe him to increase his abilty and desire to work for you, and to listen for your voice, and to watch your movements and demeanour. He learns to change gaits and speed, and he knows that he must respond immediately or you will get after him; if he responds immediately, he will hear praise.

Then you ride him.
 
I would second Aengus OG, and would add longreining. Persistance without anger is the key, and I say this with experience. The more the punishment is upped, the worse things can get. You are the one with the bigger brain, use it without getting emotion involved.
All I can add is that groundwork is the key to gaining control without being nasty or being too soft.
 
AengusOg said:
Your horse has no respect for you, and has learned that he can do what he likes and there's nothing you can do about it.

He's a big boy. He's not afraid to be alone at night, and he's used to being out during the day, so what could possibly be causing him to be afraid when you are riding him.

How do you know he's not @fr@id @t night?

As for twisting his ear...horses are often ear-twitched as a means of restraint, so twisting his ear is hardly likely to activate him. Have you written off all pressure and release techniques based on your findings with his ear? I hope not, because pressure and release is your saviour in this case.

Horses @re twitched to rele@se endorphins which rel@x & bring feelins of wellbeing. @ he@dcoll@r. bit, hobbles restr@in.

This horse needs some intensive groundwork to help him understand that if he is asked to do something he has to do it, and right away, otherwise you'll turn into a dangerous predatory beast which may just eat him.

Theres one thing doing groundwork in the comfort of f@mili@r surroundings with @ horse th@t's prone to stressing & @nother thing t@king him out into the big wide world & expecting the s@me results.





Horses like this need a handler who will be quick-thinking, nimble, and not averse to giving him a good fright right when he needs it.

Gre@t - m@ke your horse pretrified of you.



A pressure halter, long rope, and determination is all you need to turn him into an attentive, immediately compliant horse who knows his place and yours.

Wh@t pl@net on you on?

Once he learns to yield to pressure, and you learn to release it as he does, your relationship will change to one where he seeks ways to relieve himself of the pressure as soon as you begin to apply it. In other words, his resistance will lessen and he will become easier to handle.

H@ve you just copied & p@sted?

By applying pressure to cue some response, and allowing him to be pressure-free immediately he gives a response (even if, to begin with, it is not the one you wanted), you can teach him that you are a fair and gentle handler. By repeating the cue till you get the correct response, and praising him when he gives it, you teach him what the cues mean and help him to hone his reactions.

By using only enough pressure to get a response, and never using your voice negatively, you take away his need to resist, and so he becomes easier to handle.

Leaving him free of pressure unless actually asking him to do something, encourages him to stand at peace, and to want to be with you.



Then you longe him to increase his abilty and desire to work for you, and to listen for your voice, and to watch your movements and demeanour. He learns to change gaits and speed, and he knows that he must respond immediately or you will get after him; if he responds immediately, he will hear praise.


Then you lunge him & get him re@lly fit, so the next time you venture out on your own he will be full of be@ns & even more @nxious.



Then you ride him.
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Good luck with th@t. you might need it:rolleyes:
 
My rogue used to do the same, and it drove me to tears all the time. A friend was there at one point, and said "he's taking the p**s out of you". And he was. 3 slaps, lots of leg and a serious amount of verbal commands and we were half a mile down the road. he did try to turn for home, but my confidence went up at getting him to leave by himself, so i didnt let him turn for home. He was fine after that, I just think he was more intelligent than I gave him credit for. Really hope you get sorted because it is so frustrating. Best of Luck. XX
 
I have read all your posts with interest. Many deal with getting horse moving forward by
putting off balance and getting him to move one foot forward. However, when he is reversing this is difficult! Also have tried reversing him in direction I want to go and turning, and bending him round my leg to get him facing right direction etc.all of the things that you have all recommended. I have not tried the water gun ! If I could find out why he has suddenly decided not to go out it would be a tremendous help. Hopefully the person who is coming out to me will be able to help although I am worried that if he does go forward for her then what am I going wrong. I am not afraid of him, nothing has happened to make me be unconfident on him. He has been reasonably happy going out alone since I have had him. The fact that he will follow another horse and even someone walking makes me think that it is not a tack/teeth etc problem (all of which have been checked) Anyway I will see what happens next week. So thankseveryone for your helpful suggestions.
 
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