horse I have for sale keeps failing vettings - what to do?

the horse has failed 3 vettings. it isnt sound. you need to decide what to do. maybe removing from sales livery, removing shoes and turning away in a field for 2 or 3 months would be an inexpensive start for you. After a rest of several weeks, bring horse back into work and readvertise. if he fails vetting again then either keep as a companion/pet or maybe PTS
 
[deleted user] said:
Because I think I had him up for too much to start with, and I need to sell him ASAP as I have a new horse that is more suited to me and he is on sales livery. So I want him moved on as soon as I can.

Also, the first vetting I kind of thought was a one off. He had back, shoes etc done, and then the second and third vettings happened in the same week.

I don't think investigating the issue will help. I would just spend a fortune on trying to diagnose an issue on a horse I'm not keeping. And then what? Either it's something that needs treating, which will cost more money and will render him unsaleable, or it's something untreatable, which would render him unsaleable.

He is only showing lame after flexion, and it's a very, very mild lameness, so I don't think warrants xrays etc. Flexion tests are notoriously odd anyway.
Click to expand...

OK, I would have had my vet check him after the first failed vetting but well, you didn't so..I think you need to have it investigated - it might well be something that could be easily sorted and then you can sell him with a clear conscience. Or it's not fixable but at least you and a potential buyer will know what you're dealing with.
I don't see the point in shelling out for sales livery when you know he's going to fail a vetting. Most owners buying a horse in that price range will want a vetting (or be required to have one for insurance purposes).
 
Downton Dame said:
the horse has failed 3 vettings. it isnt sound. you need to decide what to do. maybe removing from sales livery, removing shoes and turning away in a field for 2 or 3 months would be an inexpensive start for you. After a rest of several weeks, bring horse back into work and readvertise. if he fails vetting again then either keep as a companion/pet or maybe PTS
Click to expand...

Well, that's "straight down the middle", but any UK vetting reflects the purchasers demands/needs, therefore it may be sound for light hacking,but not for a 3 day eventer.
When I worked in racing we were sent some decent prospects, but when they were hard trained, they "failed".
 
Last edited:
OP is this horse the same one as in your thread about front leg lameness and ulcers, which you posted in Dec 15?
 
Well with 3 consistent failed vettings I would personally put some significance on there being a potential underlying issue.

So, you either cut your losses on the sale price to get rid and stop running up livery fees. Advertise cheap as chips as a disclosed vet failure and see if someone takes the gamble. You are obviously at a greater risk of him falling into unsuitable hands this way. Personally it's not something I'd do, but then it's not my horse.

Or you spend some money with the vet. I wouldn't be shipping it off for fancy diagnostics but I would run some nerve blocks and take some xrays. Then have the horse reshod by a very good farrier. Might cost you £500, which could be money down the drain, but this is what I'd do.
 
ihatework said:
Well with 3 consistent failed vettings I would personally put some significance on there being a potential underlying issue.

So, you either cut your losses on the sale price to get rid and stop running up livery fees. Advertise cheap as chips as a disclosed vet failure and see if someone takes the gamble. You are obviously at a greater risk of him falling into unsuitable hands this way. Personally it's not something I'd do, but then it's not my horse.

Or you spend some money with the vet. I wouldn't be shipping it off for fancy diagnostics but I would run some nerve blocks and take some xrays. Then have the horse reshod by a very good farrier. Might cost you £500, which could be money down the drain, but this is what I'd do.
Click to expand...

This ^^^.

For the sake of a few hundred pounds you could establish the issue and sort it out, and then have perfectly saleable horse, which once sold you could rest easy that you've done the right thing by him, and the right thing by the new owner.
 
I would want to investigate the issue regardless of price to ensure I was not passing on a problem to a new owner and to make sure my horse was not going to end up buted up and passed all over the country.

But maybe I'm too soft!
 
ihatework said:
Well with 3 consistent failed vettings I would personally put some significance on there being a potential underlying issue.

So, you either cut your losses on the sale price to get rid and stop running up livery fees. Advertise cheap as chips as a disclosed vet failure and see if someone takes the gamble. You are obviously at a greater risk of him falling into unsuitable hands this way. Personally it's not something I'd do, but then it's not my horse.

Or you spend some money with the vet. I wouldn't be shipping it off for fancy diagnostics but I would run some nerve blocks and take some xrays. Then have the horse reshod by a very good farrier. Might cost you £500, which could be money down the drain, but this is what I'd do.
Click to expand...

That's great advice.

Unless money is incredibly tight OP I don't understand why you are so resistant to calling your vet out and asking them for at least an initial investigation. Based on what they say, you should be able to plan a future course of action. Either that, or as ihatework says, you can drop the price, disclose the failed vettings and hope that someone takes a gamble. I wouldn't feel comfortable doing that, but if you're desperate to sell then that might well be your only option.
 
If you keep doing what you're doing now, you're going to keep getting the same result. If you won't /can't pay for investigations you've got no hope of putting it right or at least having a way of managing whatever it is he has to make him more saleable. I don't see the point paying to keep him on sales livery if they're going to struggle to sell him.

I'd take him away from there and spend the money you would have spent on sales livery on getting to the bottom of the problem. If you can't do that, the only other options are to turn him away at grass livery for a few months in the hope it sorts itself out and sell from the field for a reduced price or put him out on loan. While each represents a financial hit, all 3 are preferable (and probably cheaper in the long run) than continuing to go round and round in expensive sales livery circles.
 
FWIW, I do not place any emphasis on failed flexion tests, nor does my vet on a personal level (lameness specialist)... On a professional level, he will pass or fail on them as he has to do so. Would I still buy an all rounder who failed flexion tests? Yes I would but I would be offering you alot lower than you are asking. Saying this, I have yet to pay for a vetting on any of my horses.

I am afraid I would also be getting it investigated but would not be throwing a fortune at the horse. At the end of the day the horse could be in sales livery for another 6 weeks before another buyer comes along, so to me I would want to be getting this sorted asap rather than keep throwing money at a horse that isn't going to sell with failed vettings. Would a couple of x-rays be worth it to potential show up any changes to the joint? My gut would be saying low level DJD, if he is only slightly lame after it. I'm sorry OP, regardless of only slightly lame or hopping lame, there is something going on here and I do think (IMHO) It needs investigating.
 
I do a few few sales liveries and charge a fairly low livery rate plus commission in the hope of a quick sale, if a horse had failed once I may overlook it and continue to market it, if it failed for the same thing a second time I would be contacting the owner and asking for a vet to be involved, it is not in my interests to be a) wasting my time showing it to people, b) risk my reputation by continuing to market a horse that has failed twice c) it is not doing you, the owner, any favours to be running up the bills with no real chance of it going through a vetting d) I would be failing the horse and that does not sit well with me as a seller, yes some do fail but they should be investigated if it is not just a one off something on the day.

So after 3 fails I would stop actively marketing the horse on your behalf and would be sending it back by now unless you did allow some basic checks to be done, this would be more cost effective than having it sit at livery with the yard probably now giving up trying so hard to sell it, sales livery is useful but they are not going to waste much more time unless they are charging high enough basic rates to mean they are not that bothered whether it stays or sells.
 
Your advertising him a a RC all rounder and 3 different vets have failed him as such. Yet you say he is more than capable, but also admit potentially there could be a problem. but for how long? another week a month. So sorry but I wouldn't buy him if he was only £500
 
I can't see what there is to discuss. Three professionals have deemed the horse lame. It matters not if it is priced at £3.50 or £3,500 it is lame and if it is expected to lead a useful life it needs to be sound.

The answer is simple. Investigate and rectify.
 
Louby-Jay said:
3.5 K is a lot of money and I would expect a horse to pass a vetting if I was to part with this amount of money. an expensive horse in my area is £1500+. I sold my TB for this amount with a full vetting passed regardless of whether he rode well or not.

I would get this looked into so the horses care is put first as well as the potential new owners being fully aware of what they are taking on.
Click to expand...

I don't particularly agree that £3500 is that expensive, but then again where we live you don't tend to get much change out of £5k for true RC allrounders. That said, I would still expect the horse to be capable of passing a vetting for that money.

OP I think I may have missed the assumptions on horse's cost but do agree in your shoes I'd be getting my own vet out to assess.
 
I have been in your position

I had a horse in selling livery and although she wasn't being vetted she was being ridden one day when a vet was visiting the yard who commented to the yo that she thought she was fractionally lame behind

I booked her straight in for a lameness work up

Why? Because morally I couldn't have sold her on knowing there may potentially be something wrong with her. I wanted to know what I was dealing with so I could be upfront with the buyer

She was diagnosed with minor changes in the SI, was injected and the prognosis was guarded. She was only 1/10 lame under saddle.

For personal reasons I couldn't bring her back into work at the time, I certainly couldn't gamble paying for it to be done if there was a possibility it may not work. I could have sold her then and not said anything, but morally I couldn't do it. So I sold her for a £1 to someone who wanted to give it a go and long term could just turn her away if it didn't work out.

I lost a lot of money, but I know I did the right thing.
 
So rather than even get a basic work up that might throw up an issue you can disclose to owners you are going to carry on paying for sales livery in the hope that someone comes along who doesn't want a vetting? Or a fourth vet might pass him? Are the people doing the selling happy to carry on doing so and presenting him for vettings? - and potentially damage their reputation if he is sold and it is found out you knew about a possible issue.It seems a bit unfair on the horse and the potential purchaser as it stands but hey as long as you have got your replacement it seems you don't really care about either of them! 3.5k is also plenty for an RC all rounder and I would speculate those looking for such are the most likely demographic to vet.
 
Personally I would be investigating. I could not sell a horse not knowing why the horse is failing flexion's, it could be something or nothing. Have a good talk with your farrier or have a look into an alternate one at the VERY bare minimum.

However it doesn't seem you are wanting to spend ££ getting a diagnosis or rectifying it, in which case I think you have to lower the price to a happy hacker/light hack price, a vet will possibly deem the horse for for purpose then, but I would be letting the potential buyer know about the failed flexion's previously. Obviously the danger then is that new owners could think they have hit jackpot, getting a decent all rounder at a happy hacker price, and then the horse break down because there is an underlying issue. Or he might thrive and not break down. You just don't know without investigating.
 
ester said:
So rather than even get a basic work up that might throw up an issue you can disclose to owners you are going to carry on paying for sales livery in the hope that someone comes along who doesn't want a vetting? Or a fourth vet might pass him? Are the people doing the selling happy to carry on doing so and presenting him for vettings? - and potentially damage their reputation if he is sold and it is found out you knew about a possible issue.It seems a bit unfair on the horse and the potential purchaser as it stands but hey as long as you have got your replacement it seems you don't really care about either of them! 3.5k is also plenty for an RC all rounder and I would speculate those looking for such are the most likely demographic to vet.
Click to expand...

This is not what I have said at all. If this is what I was going to do I wouldn't have asked for thoughts/opinions, would I?!

I have disclosed to all potential purchasers that he has failed the vettings, and is unlikely to pass one, and they have decided to vet anyway. So what you have said is very unfair.

Of course I care. If I didn't I would just be sending him to an auction and wouldn't be paying for sales livery. Or I would have advertised him myself.

I am asking for opinions precisely because I don't want to decieve anybody or continue paying out. If I didn't have an issue I would just keep throwing money at the sales livery, hoping that someone didn't get the horse vetted, or that he randomly passed one.

Please read everything I have said before casting such judgements
 
I don't get too excited about a failed flexion test but I would have a chat with my vet (whom I know very well) whether she thought I should take a punt on the horse or not.

In the OP's shoes I Would remove the horse from sales livery and have my vet do a lameness work up.
 
AdorableAlice said:
I can't see what there is to discuss. Three professionals have deemed the horse lame. It matters not if it is priced at £3.50 or £3,500 it is lame and if it is expected to lead a useful life it needs to be sound.

The answer is simple. Investigate and rectify.
Click to expand...

This


The horse is lame....it need sorting regardless surely?
 
I'm not a fan of flexion tests either when it comes to stifles, however I have had a horse with a very, very mild lameness over the winter. When it didn't come sound after a couple of months rest we had the vet have a look. He noticed that he wasn't flexing as well in one fetlock (only v slightly) and we, therefore, X-rayed. This only cost a couple of hundred, but was worth it as it showed a tiny bone chip in his fetlock.

You need to know what you're dealing with, or your sales livery could end up higher than his value.
 
[deleted user] said:
This is not what I have said at all. If this is what I was going to do I wouldn't have asked for thoughts/opinions, would I?!

I have disclosed to all potential purchasers that he has failed the vettings, and is unlikely to pass one, and they have decided to vet anyway. So what you have said is very unfair.

Of course I care. If I didn't I would just be sending him to an auction and wouldn't be paying for sales livery. Or I would have advertised him myself.

I am asking for opinions precisely because I don't want to decieve anybody or continue paying out. If I didn't have an issue I would just keep throwing money at the sales livery, hoping that someone didn't get the horse vetted, or that he randomly passed one.

Please read everything I have said before casting such judgements
Click to expand...
Get your lame horse seen by a vet then. I have read all the comments as I posted earlier too but for some reason the very logical step of having your vet investigate seems to be a dreadful suggestion. THREE vets have identified an issue but you seem to want to keep your head in the sand and hope you get a sale. I note you didn't answer about what the livery thought about the situation? If you don't want to keep paying for sales livery get him looked at by your vet anyone that now pays for a vetting on a 3 time failed horse must be bonkers.

Im aware of the issues and subjectivity of flexions but with 3 different vets that is somewhat removed and I guess none have suggesting resting and testing again so they don't think it is too borderline and have advised their clients it isn't too borderline either?
 
Last edited:
Is the horse not insured?
3 different vets have deemed him to be unsound...it's not just going to go away.
I have read all of the replies and you just don't seem to want to get it looked into but want a quick sale? I think your options here are pretty limited.
 
I think you either need to investigate and rectify before continuing with the sale, turn away or loan as a companion/light hack to give the issue time to resolve or become more apparent. A horse showing as lame on a flexion test is not necessarily a 'lame' horse. They might be perfectly fine for your average joe, and you are obviously declaring issues up front. If you could provide potential purchasers with an accurate diagnosis and prognosis regarding future work he might sell- at a heavy discount of course- otherwise consider other options. I certainly wouldn't be looking to pts a horse who only shows up mildly lame on a flexion test! I think you've been treated a bit too harshly, you're clearly distressed by the situation and are being open and honest.
 
Last edited:
saddlesore said:
I think you either need to investigate and rectify before continuing with the sale, turn away or loan as a companion/light hack to give the issue time to resolve or become more apparent. A horse showing as lame on a flexion test is not necessarily a 'lame' horse. They might be perfectly fine for your average joe, and you are obviously declaring issues up front. If you could provide potential purchasers with an accurate diagnosis and prognosis regarding future work he might sell- at a heavy discount of course- otherwise consider other options. I certainly wouldn't be looking to pts a horse who only shows up mildly lame on a flexion test! I think you've been treated a bit too harshly, you're clearly distressed by the situation and are being open and honest.
Click to expand...

Really appreciate this thank you. I am very upset and stressed about the whole thing. He's a lovely person just not right for me. And I want him to go to a good home.

To all the other posters I haven't said anywhere that I don't want to get a vet out. I just wanted opinions to understand any options I may not have thought of.

As regards what the sales livery thinks, as we are being honest with all potential purchasers there is not much we can do to stop them having him vetted! I presume they are using their own vets to get an opinion they trust and to take a view on the risk.
 
[deleted user] said:
Because I think I had him up for too much to start with, and I need to sell him ASAP as I have a new horse that is more suited to me and he is on sales livery. So I want him moved on as soon as I can.

Also, the first vetting I kind of thought was a one off. He had back, shoes etc done, and then the second and third vettings happened in the same week.

I don't think investigating the issue will help. I would just spend a fortune on trying to diagnose an issue on a horse I'm not keeping. And then what? Either it's something that needs treating, which will cost more money and will render him unsaleable, or it's something untreatable, which would render him unsaleable.

He is only showing lame after flexion, and it's a very, very mild lameness, so I don't think warrants xrays etc. Flexion tests are notoriously odd anyway.
Click to expand...

[deleted user] said:
Really appreciate this thank you. I am very upset and stressed about the whole thing. He's a lovely person just not right for me. And I want him to go to a good home.

To all the other posters I haven't said anywhere that I don't want to get a vet out. I just wanted opinions to understand any options I may not have thought of.

As regards what the sales livery thinks, as we are being honest with all potential purchasers there is not much we can do to stop them having him vetted! I presume they are using their own vets to get an opinion they trust and to take a view on the risk.
Click to expand...

You clearly said in the earlier post that you don't think it worth investigating and that you don't think it warrants xrays, which to most of us translates as you don't want to get the vet involved.

I think you may consider you are being honest with potential purchasers but if you are telling them the horse has now failed 3 times on the same issue and that you have not looked into it you will find at anything other than a very low price most people will run away, you are prepared to chuck more money at livery yet not spend a few hundred on some basic xrays which seems very short sighted to me.
 
You need to get the lameness investigated and checked out. It may be serious or it may not be, but it needs to be identified.

My own homebred 5yo is currently on training livery, which will become sales livery very soon. We fully believe her to be sound, but if she is vetted and 'fails', I would be getting her checked out before re presenting her for sale, no mistake.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Top