Horse mutilation

[jonisaigon]

Can any one who has had any of the following things happen to them please reply.
I think there is a link between horses (and other animals) being mutilated, haylage bales being slashed, fencing being cut and livestock being let out and possibly incidents of arson.
It sounds really dramatic but my experience is that all these things happen overnight on clear full moon lit nights and the acts are the opposite of Christian festivals, I am of the opinion that these type of incidents are commonplace, widespread and very sinister.
people doing purely evil deeds. Does anyone have any examples.

 

[Tinsel Trouble]

Not horses but I manage a farm just to the north of the North York Moors and in the summer the tenant farmer has a lot of problems with fires being lit on the land, and the sheep being mutilated.

The fire and police's opinion (and the RSPCA's...) is fire is it by young people testing their boundaries- the animal mutilation is often the first step towards murder- this is why animal cruelty is so harshly prosecuted. It mainly happens in the summer because this is when the livestock are out and about in the fields, and are easier to get hold of.

ETA- I have never seen any link between the two- there is a massive leap from setting light to a non-sentient item to harming animals- that is a boundary very rarely crossed IMO.

 

[jonisaigon]

I have had three different things happen to me I have had a foal stabbed in its neck, a mare slashed around her genitalia, haylage bales slashed and fences cut. Personally I think it is linked to people interested in the occult

 

[Noodlebug]

Any plaits as well

 

[jonisaigon]

Dont understand , Any plaits as well , what does that mean

 

[Tinsel Trouble]

I have had three different things happen to me I have had a foal stabbed in its neck, a mare slashed around her genitalia, haylage bales slashed and fences cut. Personally I think it is linked to people interested in the occult

The Occult?! Seriously?!

I am from Norfolk- That county has the highest number of wicken and 'dark art' followers of any county due to the sheer number of abandonned churches and I have never known of anything like this happening. The little I have had to deal with involved coming across rabbits and pigeons on Thetford heath with their insides on the outside or suspended in a tree- both in a peculiar fashion, and obviously laid out in a 'symbol'

Wanten distruction of hayledge and fencing is likely to be young kids playing with knives. Damage to your horses is likely to be something more serious- I would guess mental health problems, and associated paranoia. If it is just one person doing this then it smacks of a personal vendetta against you-

But "The Occult"- highly unlikely, and incredibly laughable- sorry!!

 

[Jim Moriarty]

I have had three different things happen to me I have had a foal stabbed in its neck, a mare slashed around her genitalia, haylage bales slashed and fences cut. Personally I think it is linked to people interested in the occult

a broad accusation and one I'd be hard pressede to believe or accept.

The Occult?! Seriously?!

I am from Norfolk- That county has the highest number of wicken and 'dark art' followers of any county due to the sheer number of abandonned churches and I have never known of anything like this happening. The little I have had to deal with involved coming across rabbits and pigeons on Thetford heath with their insides on the outside or suspended in a tree- both in a peculiar fashion, and obviously laid out in a 'symbol'

Wanten distruction of hayledge and fencing is likely to be young kids playing with knives. Damage to your horses is likely to be something more serious- I would guess mental health problems, and associated paranoia. If it is just one person doing this then it smacks of a personal vendetta against you-

But "The Occult"- highly unlikely, and incredibly laughable- sorry!!

I'm inclined to agree, my wife and daughter are Wiccan (so they tell me) and I've yet to notice them butchering the animals.

 

[jonisaigon]

I know it may seem laughable but you wouldnt laugh if i showed you the pictures of my horse injured in a ritualistic way the foal as though they had tried to slaughter it and the mare carved around its genitalia, been through all the kids with knives theories etc, and it doesnt stack up. the fences get cut from top to bottom right next to gates that would be perfectly easy to open as thiough some hippy type doesnt agree with enclosure or land ownership, As for a vendetta against me , no , it happens to other peiople in the area and un beknown to me it was happening on the land before I bought it. I know it seems far fetched but 66 of my haylage bales were slashed open( an act that would have taken at least an hour and half ) on the harvest festival its as though they have to ruin the crops when the church is celebrating them,
By the way I am not a religous nut case I have no religion at all.

 

[JenJ]

I know it may seem laughable but you wouldnt laugh if i showed you the pictures of my horse injured in a ritualistic way the foal as though they had tried to slaughter it and the mare carved around its genitalia, been through all the kids with knives theories etc, and it doesnt stack up. the fences get cut from top to bottom right next to gates that would be perfectly easy to open as thiough some hippy type doesnt agree with enclosure or land ownership, As for a vendetta against me , no , it happens to other peiople in the area and un beknown to me it was happening on the land before I bought it. I know it seems far fetched but 66 of my haylage bales were slashed open( an act that would have taken at least an hour and half ) on the harvest festival its as though they have to ruin the crops when the church is celebrating them,
By the way I am not a religous nut case I have no religion at all.

Without commenting on the abuse side of your accusation, I think you'll find that celebrating the harvest dates back to before the church, and is probably celebrated more by the 'occult' types you are pointing the finger at...

 

[Snowy Celandine]

I think that just because something is not 'normal' or has never happened to you personally, it's easy to dismiss it as nonsense. I have no knowledge of, nor interest in, the occult but there are surely people who do find these things intriguing for some reason best known to themselves. Is it not within the bounds of possibility that some of these people might be mad/sad/bad enough to commit unpleasant and sometimes cruel acts?

I mean murders take place in this country despite (hopefully) none of us HHOers wanting to murder anyone, so animal cruelty and 'ritualistic' unpleasantness could well happen. There are quite a few HHO members who claim to be witches of one sort or another, most are cagey about what they do for some reason I would be horrified if I thought they were perpetrating cruel acts but some people clearly are unhinged and/or sadistic enough to do some quite revolting things or we wouldn't read about them from time to time in the press.

As Sherlock Holmes said, "... when you have eliminated the impossible, whatever remains, however improbable, must be the truth...".

 

[Jim Moriarty]

Who's laughing? I'm certainly not laughing at your apparent insistence of laying blame at, essentially, the most harmless religious fraternity on the planet.

Even those who, allegedly practice the 'dark arts' do so with bought/owned livestock, they don't go out into the wide black yonder and mutilate for the sake of it, there is purpose and ritual and it has to be in a more or less controlled and relatively private environment.

That's not to say there aren't idiots playing at being 'occultists' having read some trite novels (written with an eye on Hollywood) and ill-formed text books, but they're not, and your broad tar brush won't be welcomed by those who are.

I suspect you need to apply some intelligent, dispassionate rationality to your thinking if you're to move forward on this.

 

[Snowy Celandine]

Ha ha, I love it, Moriarty is on this very thread Watson

 

[jonisaigon]

Without commenting on the abuse side of your accusation, I think you'll find that celebrating the harvest dates back to before the church, and is probably celebrated more by the 'occult' types you are pointing the finger at...

Yes I know that but I have done a fair bit of reading on line and it seems that they simply do the opposite of the church , It might sound crazy but when these things happen and there have been 9 incidents in total , I always find evidence of drugs (pescription drug packets) and alcohol ,(always weird stuff like Old speckled hen and real ales) Kids dont drink that stuff do they? Hippy types do ?? I am only thinking out loud I dont know anything for certain

 

[Tinsel Trouble]

Ha ha, I love it, Moriarty is on this very thread Watson

I spotted that too!

OP If I were you I would put up CCTV cameras and paint anti-climb paint on your fences and gates. This will mark the people who try to touch them.

You need to remember that the 'occult' as you call them, has been followed since before christianity if dates tie in then it's pure chance, or someone who's a little unhinged and needs some help.

Noone in their right mind (druid/ Celt/ Witch/ pagan or just anti-Christian) would harm another living creature in the name of religion in this way. It's very much frowned upon in society and within those 'sects'. I have never heard of it happening.

(If your mare was slashed aound her vulva surely she'd run away after the first prick and break free from what ever she was held to... same with the foal- they are wriggley little things!)

 

[jonisaigon]

Who's laughing? I'm certainly not laughing at your apparent insistence of laying blame at, essentially, the most harmless religious fraternity on the planet.

Even those who, allegedly practice the 'dark arts' do so with bought/owned livestock, they don't go out into the wide black yonder and mutilate for the sake of it, there is purpose and ritual and it has to be in a more or less controlled and relatively private environment.

That's not to say there aren't idiots playing at being 'occultists' having read some trite novels (written with an eye on Hollywood) and ill-formed text books, but they're not, and your broad tar brush won't be welcomed by those who are.

I suspect you need to apply some intelligent, dispassionate rationality to your thinking if you're to move forward on this.

You 're probably right , I dont reall know about these things and I am not pretending to and I dont insist on laying blame on any individual or group of people , like you say it may be people playing the role. I dont know That is why I am asking people for imput. I am not trying to blame , I am just looking for explanations and believe me I have really explored the obvious.

 

[Orson Cart]

Personally I think it is linked to people interested in the occult

Complete rubbish. As a Pagan, I can assure you that animal sacrifice plays no part in any sort of modern paganism. I find that sweeping statement quite offensive.

 

[Snowy Celandine]

EmsHooper, what do Pagans believe in Were you brought up as one or did you convert to Paganism in later life?

 

[Orson Cart]

Yes I know that but I have done a fair bit of reading on line and it seems that they simply do the opposite of the church , It might sound crazy but when these things happen and there have been 9 incidents in total , I always find evidence of drugs (pescription drug packets) and alcohol ,(always weird stuff like Old speckled hen and real ales) Kids dont drink that stuff do they? Hippy types do ?? I am only thinking out loud I dont know anything for certain

We do not do the opposite of the church. We have our own religion and beliefs which pre-date those of the Christian church. In fact, the church stole many of our own festivals - christmas, easter bunny, hallows eve ...

In fact , the main ethos of pagan religions is the same as the Christian belief of ' do unto others as you would do have them do unto you'

I would suggest that you have been reading some poorly written articles online and may wish to research properly what the pagan religion truly is. Feel free to pm me for some proper reading material so that you may educate yourself properly.

 

[Orson Cart]

EmsHooper, what do Pagans believe in Were you brought up as one or did you convert to Paganism in later life?

I converted to paganism at the age of 16 - nearly 20 years ago now - after being raised a christian.

Pagans believe in the balance of humans and nature. We often have dual deities (female one and a male one) as well as sub deities - and there are many different branches to paganism just as there are in the Christian church - druids, witches, shamans, solitaries etc. Some people follow the Norse gods, some the native american spirits, some the celtic gods ... there really is a lot of different forms of worship out there.

We believe in respecting mother earth and all her creatures.

 

[Snowy Celandine]

Thank you I would never want to perform Druid rituals, for example, but I believe wholeheartedly in respecting Mother Earth and all her creatures. I am known in these parts as the mad animal lady I am sure because everyone brings their unwanted and injured animals to me

 

[Orson Cart]

Snowy: You are most welcome! It is the variety of life that makes it so wonderful.

 

[Snowy Celandine]

True enough EmsHooper, true enough

 

[Ibblebibble]

my friends FIL is ex police, i spent a very interesting evening chatting with him a few years ago when there had been a spate of animal mutilations in the area, this is what i learnt. Horses are an easy target as they are the most domesticated breed to be found unattended in fields (cows have been targeted but not so often), the majority of the attacks have sexual reasons rather than religious.

 

[Queenbee]

I have had three different things happen to me I have had a foal stabbed in its neck, a mare slashed around her genitalia, haylage bales slashed and fences cut. Personally I think it is linked to people interested in the occult

It has been my understanding and from what I know of attacks on local people in cornwall and in devon it has had far far more to do with vendetta and bad blood than the occult. Of course this takes part at night, and on a full moon. No one would go out in the middle of the day and do this, and the full moon gives enough visibility combined with the cover of darkness. Vile people comiting vile acts. I have never seen any reason to believe this is 'occult' linked, but I have seen evidence that it is linked to personal grudge issues between the horse owners and the perpetrator.

Not saying that you have annoyed people, not saying that anyone deserves this, or any horse should ever have to suffer this, indeed no matter what the issue I would like to see the same done to the evil gits who carry such acts out, but no, not 'sinister' in the form of occult, and why do people think occult = sinister anyway?

 

[Queenbee]

I know it may seem laughable but you wouldnt laugh if i showed you the pictures of my horse injured in a ritualistic way the foal as though they had tried to slaughter it and the mare carved around its genitalia, been through all the kids with knives theories etc, and it doesnt stack up. the fences get cut from top to bottom right next to gates that would be perfectly easy to open as thiough some hippy type doesnt agree with enclosure or land ownership, As for a vendetta against me , no , it happens to other peiople in the area and un beknown to me it was happening on the land before I bought it. I know it seems far fetched but 66 of my haylage bales were slashed open( an act that would have taken at least an hour and half ) on the harvest festival its as though they have to ruin the crops when the church is celebrating them,
By the way I am not a religous nut case I have no religion at all.

sounds far more sadistic than ritualistic to me

 

[Queenbee]

Yes I know that but I have done a fair bit of reading on line and it seems that they simply do the opposite of the church , It might sound crazy but when these things happen and there have been 9 incidents in total , I always find evidence of drugs (pescription drug packets) and alcohol ,(always weird stuff like Old speckled hen and real ales) Kids dont drink that stuff do they? Hippy types do ?? I am only thinking out loud I dont know anything for certain

Oh my god, with your sweeping generalisations some may think you are the danger to society

 

[Silvermiyazawa]

I wouldn't read too much into "weird stuff like Old Speckled Hen and real ale etc". I'm off to our local folk music club shortly, real ale and beards all round.

 

[Queenbee]

I wouldn't read too much into "weird stuff like Old Speckled Hen and real ale etc". I'm off to our local folk music club shortly, real ale and beards all round.

Oh my god! pack your broom, candles and sage! Oh, and you need to pack your sacraficial mutilation knife

 

[Silvermiyazawa]

Oh my god! pack your broom, candles and sage! Oh, and you need to pack your sacraficial mutilation knife

Oh, I was only planning on taking my flute!

 

[patchypony]

Yes I know that but I have done a fair bit of reading on line and it seems that they simply do the opposite of the church , It might sound crazy but when these things happen and there have been 9 incidents in total , I always find evidence of drugs (pescription drug packets) and alcohol ,(always weird stuff like Old speckled hen and real ales) Kids dont drink that stuff do they? Hippy types do ?? I am only thinking out loud I dont know anything for certain

Not stereotyping there or anything are you?? Sorry but I'm inclined to agree with the other posters. I think you may have answered your own question there. If these individuals are high on drugs and alcohol, then this could be something they could have done under the influence. Rather than acting on behalf of the occult.
I can understand these events are distressing, but involve the relevant authorities or ramp up the security around your horses.