Horse on three tracks

Birker2020

Birker2020

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Hi. I competed on Saturday, a Prelim and a Novice at a local comp centre. On both test sheets the judge noted the horse was on three tracks, both on the centre line and between markers on the outside track. Is this another way of saying he is not going straight? My comments were that his free walk was lovely, but need to ride him more into a contact.

It was my first outing since my new saddle has be refitted to my horse, and I have never competed in this saddle before having only properly started riding in it about three weeks ago. I know the horse was sound as the judge pulled up someone whose horse was lame. My vet was in agreement about me competing - horse had inflammation in top hock joint caused by complication of ethanol fusion which has now been sorted with a short course of anti inflammatories, physio and lateral shoein although its very much a case of see how you get on type of thing.

I got placed with 64% with an error of course in the prelim and 63% in the Novice and came 3rd out of seven and 2nd respectively although there was only two of us in the Novice!

Anyone know the reasons for a horse being on three tracks and how to you prevent this?

Thanks :)
 
It is simply that the horse is not straight. The cause could be a variety of things, you are not sitting centrally and balanced, the horse is stiff, the horse is unsound, (don't think because the judge dealt with one lame horse means others were not lame).

Big, old and stiff horses struggle in small arena's.
 
AdorableAlice said:
It is simply that the horse is not straight. The cause could be a variety of things, you are not sitting centrally and balanced, the horse is stiff, the horse is unsound, (don't think because the judge dealt with one lame horse means others were not lame).

Big, old and stiff horses struggle in small arena's.
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Completely sound, partner and friend who also ride him commented on the fact he looked sound as they are keeping a watchful eye on him on my request as I am slightly paranoid about the whole thing!
 
applecart14 said:
Completely sound, partner and friend who also ride him commented on the fact he looked sound as we are keeping a watchful eye on him.
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So the horse is sound and capable of going straight, fit enough and schooled to understand the aids for straight you can only look to the rider as being at fault. Maybe a lesson or two would help you.
 
I would have understood it the same, I.e. horse is not straight. There are plenty of us with perfectly sound horses who have the same problem, so if you're happy there's not an underlying cause then just crack on and deal with it as a training issue. Have you got schooling mirrors and a trainer who can help you with your position, suppling exercises etc.?
 
AdorableAlice said:
So the horse is sound and capable of going straight, fit enough and schooled to understand the aids for straight you can only look to the rider as being at fault. Maybe a lesson or two would help you.
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That's okay, there is every chance it is me at fault. I don't feel like I sit straight sometimes so I am thinking of getting my back checked at the chiropractors. I do have two slipped discs and take 17 tablets a day so that may have something to do with it.

When all I have ever ridden in for dressage is a GP it takes some getting used to a dressage saddle :)
 
What AdorableAlice said :)

Ride a square in canter, and don't cheat - on the straight bits of the square make sure you aren't trying to do too much, he has to go straight by himself.

Have the feeling of riding shoulder in, have someone on the ground to tell you when you are straight and when you are crooked so you get to know what it should feel like.
 
Micropony said:
I would have understood it the same, I.e. horse is not straight. There are plenty of us with perfectly sound horses who have the same problem, so if you're happy there's not an underlying cause then just crack on and deal with it as a training issue. Have you got schooling mirrors and a trainer who can help you with your position, suppling exercises etc.?
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Thank you Micropony. No we don't have mirrors in the school, bizzarely the horse at home refuses to go straight on the one side of the school, off the one corner, I have always put this down to spooking (sheep hide next to the fence under the trees). He is fine on the other side. I do need to get an instructor, I was talking to someone at the competition about finding someone to teach me - i have never had lessons (apart from the odd one or two) as I have always preferred to crack on with things and go out and compete. It would be interesting to have someone on the ground to offer support or criticism.
 
Thank you Prancer. I must admit I don't do many schooling exercises with him, probably because I don't have instruction so don't really have much idea about dressage movements, just a vague idea that works sometimes and not others.

I do think the way forward might be to have some lessons when the horse is a bit fitter - at the moment we are only doing 30 mins of basic schooling, no lateral movements or collection allowed at present.
 
applecart14 said:
Thank you Micropony. No we don't have mirrors in the school, bizzarely the horse at home refuses to go straight on the one side of the school, off the one corner, I have always put this down to spooking (sheep hide next to the fence under the trees). He is fine on the other side. I do need to get an instructor, I was talking to someone at the competition about finding someone to teach me - i have never had lessons (apart from the odd one or two) as I have always preferred to crack on with things and go out and compete. It would be interesting to have someone on the ground to offer support or criticism.
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You are near a very good teacher, but I am not sure if she still teaches. Jenny Key in Wootten Wawen.
 
applecart14 said:
Thank you Prancer. I must admit I don't do many schooling exercises with him, probably because I don't have instruction so don't really have much idea about dressage movements, just a vague idea that works sometimes and not others.

I do think the way forward might be to have some lessons when the horse is a bit fitter - at the moment we are only doing 30 mins of basic schooling, no lateral movements or collection allowed at present.
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There is your answer to horse on three tracks. If they are not laterally supple they cannot go straight.
 
Do you know if he was consistently wonky in one direction ie quarters to the left or the right? I don't think it is that unusual to have to make some minor corrections at times to keep a horse straight so if it is something consistent you can just be aware of it and say think shoulder fore (and by just thinking it you will actually then be straight).
 
ester said:
Do you know if he was consistently wonky in one direction ie quarters to the left or the right? I don't think it is that unusual to have to make some minor corrections at times to keep a horse straight so if it is something consistent you can just be aware of it and say think shoulder fore (and by just thinking it you will actually then be straight).
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Hi Ester, shutting my eyes and trying to remember what he does on the corner at the school at home, I believe he is shoulder in and quarters out on the right rein, and I correct him by bringing my inside leg back and move my inside hand across slightly onto his neck (without crossing hands which is a BIG SIN I know) whilst moving my outside hand to the left. this is probably all wrong, I admit I am ignorant in such matters. I don't ever go out competing to win, I only ever go for a fun day out, and some time with just me and my boy. Probably the wrong attitude entirely, and he probably gets away with murder, but I am really lacking in schooling knowledge.

With the aids I give him we can leg yield, and do something resembling a half pass in canter. We know each other inside out, so if I am giving him the aids wrong, he only knows them as he and I have built the partnership over the years. They may be wrong but they are right for him (if you understand). He can do changes (now he has the new saddle he is having no problems at all, not long ago he was struggling on the one rein) although I'm not doing them at present, when I noticed his leg problem I stopped doing them. The vets asked me to bring in lateral work /collection gradually again whilst he is getting used to the lateral extensions on his shoes, maybe he will become straighter in time.

I think I tend to push him forwards to much on the centre line, in an effort to make him straight, and maybe this is why he ends up on three tracks if he is a bit unbalanced on the turn up the centre line to start with.

Dressage always has been and always will be a mystery to me. We used to get good marks in our elementary tests in the long arena more so, and I once did a novice affilated and came 11th out of 22 in our class which I was pleased about so we get by so to speak.

I bet these die hard dressage fans reading this are throwing their hands in the air now in desperation! LOL :)

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It is very common for the quarters to come slightly in - this is particularly noticeable on the centre line and on the long sides. Think of riding shoulder fore (rather than full blown shoulder in) and this should help. Usually trying to push the quarters back in line with the shoulders causes the horse to go more crooked than before.
 
Agree, I understand it to mean horse not straight, generally quarters in. Check if it's the same rein that seems to come up in the comments as it could be indicative of horse's weak side. My and my horse have a weakness on the left rein, it's a bit of both of us not being straight. I find it hard to correct on my own tbh. Been advised to do lateral work, work off the fence line and stay focussed through the transitions. Shoulder in/fore would help but we've not really cracked that yet !
 
When a horse going on three tracks when you have asked it to be straight you need first to be clear what the horse is doing when he goes on three tracks .
By that I mean what leg is he taking out of line into the third track .
Is it inside hindleg in or out or the outside hind leg ? Or is the horse taking a foreleg off the line .
If it where me I would ride my horse for my physio to watch .
What you do to straighten the horse will depend on exactly what the horse is doing to avoid being straight and if you can truly discount discomfort .
 
It's interesting that he is on 3 tracks in halt in your picture. He looks like he wants that right hind under his body, rather than standing square. It may be worth getting a good physio/chiro to hep you straighten him out aongside your instructor.

We have an identical problem with my sons horse, who likes to bring his left hind under his body and wil work on 3 tracks all the time if he can. We improve it massively with correct work & of course it makes him far more rideabe and even in the hand.
 
I think you may have answered your own question on the New Riders board

"My moving lower leg is the bane of my life, it still moves now and this time of year starts to gradually wear out a little bald patch on my unclipped horses side! Its only ever on the one side so I think i must sit funny in the saddle."
Read more at http://www.horseandhound.co.uk/forums/showthread.php?715768-Leg-problem#5Bk7EsZTx0mLEOu5.99

Btw, I wasn't stalking you, I just happened to read the 2 threads, one after the other!
 
siennamum said:
It's interesting that he is on 3 tracks in halt in your picture. He looks like he wants that right hind under his body, rather than standing square. It may be worth getting a good physio/chiro to hep you straighten him out aongside your instructor.

We have an identical problem with my sons horse, who likes to bring his left hind under his body and wil work on 3 tracks all the time if he can. We improve it massively with correct work & of course it makes him far more rideabe and even in the hand.
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That photo was taken about three years ago!

He just stood randomly and the photo was taken. But that was the spavin leg he had more problems with although he had received ethanol fusion months before so I don't think he was in pain with it, more a learned foot placement. He has regular physio treatment and always has done. The physio had to be cancelled the other week as I had no means of paying (I had to stop my bank cards!) and I don't think she will be able to squeeze me in before the New Year now.
 
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Pearlsacarolsinger said:
I think you may have answered your own question on the New Riders board

"My moving lower leg is the bane of my life, it still moves now and this time of year starts to gradually wear out a little bald patch on my unclipped horses side! Its only ever on the one side so I think i must sit funny in the saddle."
Read more at http://www.horseandhound.co.uk/forums/showthread.php?715768-Leg-problem#5Bk7EsZTx0mLEOu5.99

Btw, I wasn't stalking you, I just happened to read the 2 threads, one after the other!
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Yes you might be right! My left leg sometimes feels like its coming upwards and my right leg does and has always moved to the point that my horse always gets a little bit of hair loss on his right side at this time of year. I will book a chiro appointment for myself in the New Year. I must admit my back has started twinging, I think my dressage saddle really makes me sit up and the back is not used to such a position.
 
Could you not feel that the horse was not straight? Maybe this is why you feel you are sitting off centre, the horse is not straight he will shove you off one seat bone, maybe over time he has made you crooked or maybe you being crooked has over time made him crooked :)

How long do you think he has been like this?

It is quite common for younger horses to be very one sided like this and bent in a particular direction, this is why we school, to try and straighten them out. With an older horse capable of doing flying changes, this level of lack of straightness would worry me that something more is going on. Not necessarily making him show up as but possibly described as unlevel in some way.
 
Wheels said:
Could you not feel that the horse was not straight? Maybe this is why you feel you are sitting off centre, the horse is not straight he will shove you off one seat bone, maybe over time he has made you crooked or maybe you being crooked has over time made him crooked :)

How long do you think he has been like this?

It is quite common for younger horses to be very one sided like this and bent in a particular direction, this is why we school, to try and straighten them out. With an older horse capable of doing flying changes, this level of lack of straightness would worry me that something more is going on. Not necessarily making him show up as but possibly described as unlevel in some way.
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He has been treated for inflammatory problems as a result of an issue in his hock and I have been told to crack on with him. He is not lame, but he is moving his leg in a compensatory way (midline) for which he has received lateral extensions in a bid to 'retrain' his footfall. He is doing well at present, I am just monitoring him to see how he goes. The vet said that as it was caught early there is a good prognosis for full return to work and to continue working him less lateral work and collection at present. He's had spavin since 2009, long story, various treatments ending in ethanol fusion which after three years has caused the top hock joint to become slightly inflammed, which is evident in 5-8% of all cases treated some 3-4 yrs later following ethanol fusion. As I say its been treated, and its a case of continuing and regularly assessing in concjunction with my vet and physio.

These were taken two months ago, which was when I decided to film him as I felt there was a very slight difference with his normal stride on his off hind that wasn't consistent with his usual way of going. So I consulted the physio and subsequently the vet when the physio agreed that the horse had an issue with the hock which brought us to the diagnosis we are at today.

.https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uSJdyQQtWrg

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BV0YvouNeA0
 
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ester said:
the one thing I ponder on the videos A14 is the quantity of surface he kicks up behind.
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He has always done this for about the last five or six years. The vet is aware of this and isn't worried. My partner has said that sometimes when I work him correctly from behind in the school he notices an improvement but it is always present. If you look at the video you will see that he is not doing it all the time, there are some strides when it is not apparent at all. I admit its not a very clear video. When trotted on the roads he clips his toes and sparks show, but I rarely trot him, and again if you 'get after him' it does improve so I do wonder if he is being a bit lazy. He doesn't wear out his toes on his shoes, although it was noticed at one point when he was first diagnosed, and the farrier has made no reference to it for a long while now. The physio suggested a curb chain around his fetlock at one point for proprioception purposes, and raised walk poles in hand but I doubt given his age it will make much difference now.

Its easy to be over critical about horses when watching from the ground, especially when you know there is a problem already. I wonder how many people watching this video will have horses just as bad or maybe worse than my horse and who wouldn't even have noticed a problem in the first place.

At the end of the day he is what he is. An 18 year old horse with high mileage and a multitude of problems that have been addressed over the years. He is not crippled, he is not in pain, he is happy to work and the vet is happy with him. And I am happy with that. When I want to start jumping again I am to take a video and send it to the vet and then come up with a training programme to get him back into work again. The last two injuries were treated very well and managed with the same programme which I plan to use again.
 
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I suppose the issue you have is to what degree you want to change the way he goes & whether it may cause more problems than it solves. He goes the way he does possibly to compensate cause his hock was sore.
It's why I'm obsessively straightening my sons horse, I can't help worrying about wear and tear on his joints when he is so crooked.
I try to even up my sons horse, with lateral work, turns on the forehand and getting him to stretch on each side. It makes a real difference, but he is a young horse.
 
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