Horse on trial with view to buy - owner know wants a loan....

gnubee said:
Could be that she has genuinely changed her mind, but if so then she has still benefited from free schooling livery and should still be paying you for that.
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Let's try to look at this problem dispassionately and examine the legal issues involved. I am not a lawyer and I am sure their are better qualified people on here, but, what the heck, this is a discussion forum!:D I sympathise with the OP but I don't think she has a leg to stand on.

The agreement was that the OP should take the horse for a short period so she could decide whether to buy. There was no agreement that the OP should school the horse and, I assume, it was implied, if not stated, that she would pay all costs of the livery. How can the OP now expect to be paid for a service (schooling) that was not contracted for?

Both the seller and OP have a right to "change their minds" at any stage up to the point where the OP's offer is accepted. All the parties have agreed to is a period of assessment before a contract of sale has been made.

The seller has now decided to withdraw and the horse is no longer for sale. She has a perfect right to do this. A price has been discussed -- but not agreed to as it is subject to the OP's assessment of the SI problem.


Unless the contract gave her the right to change her mind, I would set out a reasonable invoice for the costs you have wasted through her breach of contract (including a reasonable allocation for your time) stating that from now on you are not schooling any further, and will be charging £x per day to cover your costs for keep.
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Where is it stated that the seller has made her mind up about anything except that the OP can assess whether the horse is suitable? Where has it been stated that the seller contracted with the OP for the schooling? She (OP) merely has the horse on loan so she can make an assessment about the SI. There is no need to school a horse to do that!

Don't let her remove the horse until she has settled the invoice.
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Then the OP should expect a writ for detinue (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Detinue), the illegal retention of another person property. The OP did work on the horse on her own initiative. If it was a mare and she (OP) had decided to get it covered without any reference to the seller, would the seller also be liable for the stud fee? No, she might rightly face an action for damages!

I wouldn't offer to buy it outright now unless you are prepared to live with the sweet itch as it may well be an opportunistic way of making you buy before you have witnessed the extent of the problem.
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I agree.

A written (or verbal) contract to buy *is* binding, regardless of whether money has changed hands, and although you would not be able to force her to go through with the sale in courts you would certainly be entitled to fair compensation for costs you have incurred acting in reliance on the contract.
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The contract is that she has the horse for assessment prior to making an offer. It is an agreement for the OP to have time to make an inspection of the horse, no more, no less. The fact that a price has been discussed is irrelevant as there is no contract of sale and either side may withdraw up until there is offer and acceptance. That is what the seller has now done and it sounds as if negotiations need to start afresh.
 
I agree with Dry Rot.

If the shoe was on the other foot, and the horse had turned out to have a major vice, the OP would be well within her rights to return it. Therefor the seller should also have the right to change her mind about the sale within the trial period. If for example, she turned up and found the horse was being badly treated, the advice given would all be 'go pick it up now' and no suggestion that any livery or costs should be paid.

I do think the seller sounds like she is taking the proverbial, but I don't think any sort of invoice for costs incurred will hold any water, as that is the risk of a trial rather than buying outright.

I'd either send the horse back, or state you'd like to purchase at the time originally agreed, but will not be agreeing to any loan arrangement. Let us know how you get on OP.
 
Well...
there is a contract for the trial period.
It states the price to be paid at the END of the trial period.
It states that the owner can only withdraw the horse if she is concerned about the care
the horse has had - given her reaction when visiting was witnessed by others I think that would be hard - also she hasn't removed the horse...
I am giving my self this weekend to think about it as being pressured by Owner to sign the loan agreement. (Also midges are now out!)

As to charging the owner for the costs in the trial period that isn't my way - I have chosen to have her schooled etc that is my cost not owners.

Like the bucking idea but not that cheeky though OH might be ...
I will either buy or hand back Will update later ...
 
In a way its good news that the midges are now out because although they have been honest about the sweet itch its now going to show a lot more and other prospective purchasers are less likely to be interested if she increases the price as a result of your schooling so she could well be shooting herself in the foot.
 
Vodkagirly said:
Seems wrong to say pleased the midges are out but hopefully you will find out what you need.
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The trouble is that Sweet itch can be pretty easily managed these days with the information we have about diets, rugs, lotions and potions and similar... letting it just happen seems a bit wrong to me... but thats a different matter altogether!
 
TommisMum said:
Well...
there is a contract for the trial period.
It states the price to be paid at the END of the trial period.
It states that the owner can only withdraw the horse if she is concerned about the care
the horse has had - given her reaction when visiting was witnessed by others I think that would be hard - also she hasn't removed the horse...
I am giving my self this weekend to think about it as being pressured by Owner to sign the loan agreement. (Also midges are now out!)

As to charging the owner for the costs in the trial period that isn't my way - I have chosen to have her schooled etc that is my cost not owners.

Like the bucking idea but not that cheeky though OH might be ...
I will either buy or hand back Will update later ...
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I must have missed the clause in red in which case you have the right to purchase within the trial period at the agreed price. Sounds as if you have been wise to get it in writing!:)
 
Coblover63 said:
Would definitely return the horse to the seller ASAP but would also reply to email stating that the terms were LWVTB and NOT a loan and if she is changing the terms of the agreement (verbal or otherwise) then you are rightly changing yours too and that she will now owe you £X amount for livery and schooling charges.

Damned cheek!
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This ^^
 
As to letting sweet itch happen - I am using deosect and a rambo sweetitch rug... if it is manageable with that - I am not going to let any animal suffer.
I have emailed owner and said that either I choose to buy or she takes the horse back as per our contract.

Will let you know a response.
 
What a cheeky woman!! :eek:
Offer her the price you agreed on and if she still refuses to sell, send horse back!!
 
At last I have a response ..................................... wait for it ...............

After much deliberation and whilst I do not want to sell the horse I bred I accept that the best position is for you to buy.

Please meet me on Friday with cash.
_______________________
I have said that yes I will buy but it will be bank transfer which I will do in her presence and that I want the passport and a receipt .....
________________

So come Friday I will post some piccies .....

phew ....
 
TommisMum said:
At last I have a response ..................................... wait for it ...............

After much deliberation and whilst I do not want to sell the horse I bred I accept that the best position is for you to buy.

Please meet me on Friday with cash.
_______________________
I have said that yes I will buy but it will be bank transfer which I will do in her presence and that I want the passport and a receipt .....
________________

So come Friday I will post some piccies .....

phew ....
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That's great news TommisMum! Keeping fingers crossed Friday goes smoothly :)
 
If this is what you want to do, please ensure you have the horse's passport when you hand over the cash and most importantly, a proper receipt!
 
Everyone is stating LWVTB - this horse was not on loan it was on trial! Which clearly shows that the horse was for sale. Regardless of any agreement verbal or written.

Tell her straight that you will not enter into a loan agreement with her for one year, that you are prepared to buy the horse at the agreed price.

If the owner now no longer wants to sell - that is her right, however she entered an agreement which has caused a cost to the person having the horse on trial. She must pay for the horses keep and schooling. Bill her immediately and advise that you will hold onto the horse until the bill is paid, give a time frame of one week to meet the bill. After that a sum each week will be added to the bill, work out an average that includes part of all basic bills, grazing feed, farrier, dentist, innoculations etc.

I've been in this situation myself - stated the above and it was amazing how quick the owner came to the party and a few days later the horse was mine.
 
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