Horse pulling back

[TheFarmIsFull]

I am currently working with a horse who has a terrible habit of pulling back under pressure and I’d really like to help her kick the habit.
It’s generally when she’s fresh but I have seen it when she’s had regular work. Examples we have had, lunging and suddenly pulled back throwing her head up until she got away. Horses were riding in the next paddock and she was fresh as a daisy so I wasn’t too concerned.
Another time hubby decide to be helpful and shift her through to the next paddock and had no lead so held her head collar and she ripped backwards at 100 miles an hour throwing her head up to get away. Nothing provoked this and I she has tried it before.
I loosely hang my lead through a ring while I saddle up and I have noticed she will suggestively put her head up to see if there’s any tension to pull back against. If I’m holding the lead with pressure I’ll get resistance and I’m sure if I held firmly she would rip backwards.
However sometimes she’s great, no issues whatsoever, better post workout standing with friends. A really quiet horse but quiet timid which doesn’t help.
Any tips and tricks or ideas to help reduce this? When I worked with some young “wilds” the trainer would tie them up with a bum rope and it worked really well stopping them from pulling back and getting them to give into pressure instead of resisting it but she’s a bit old and wise for that sort of thing I think and would do more harm than good.
Mare is 7 and has been a racehorse, well handled and not head shy or silly like that.

 

[LEC]

They have to get used to pressure. Warwick Schiller videos would be where I start on this.

 

[Flowerofthefen]

First of all, after all that pulling back I would get her poll etc checked. It must be sore and perhaps add to her reaction. I had one that pulled back so I never tied him to give him anything pull against. I always hung a lunge rein through a tie ring so when he pulled he could go back with no pressure and I was able to grab lunge line before he got away. I had to do this at shows as well for a while. Once he realised there was no pressure, he stopped. Its for this very reason, when I load my other horse, I never tie him up until I have done the ramp.

 

[Birker2020]

I am currently working with a horse who has a terrible habit of pulling back under pressure and I’d really like to help her kick the habit.
It’s generally when she’s fresh but I have seen it when she’s had regular work. Examples we have had, lunging and suddenly pulled back throwing her head up until she got away. Horses were riding in the next paddock and she was fresh as a daisy so I wasn’t too concerned.
Another time hubby decide to be helpful and shift her through to the next paddock and had no lead so held her head collar and she ripped backwards at 100 miles an hour throwing her head up to get away. Nothing provoked this and I she has tried it before.
I loosely hang my lead through a ring while I saddle up and I have noticed she will suggestively put her head up to see if there’s any tension to pull back against. If I’m holding the lead with pressure I’ll get resistance and I’m sure if I held firmly she would rip backwards.
However sometimes she’s great, no issues whatsoever, better post workout standing with friends. A really quiet horse but quiet timid which doesn’t help.
Any tips and tricks or ideas to help reduce this? When I worked with some young “wilds” the trainer would tie them up with a bum rope and it worked really well stopping them from pulling back and getting them to give into pressure instead of resisting it but she’s a bit old and wise for that sort of thing I think and would do more harm than good.
Mare is 7 and has been a racehorse, well handled and not head shy or silly like that.

There was a horse I used to know that had to be 'hard tied' to everything as she would consistently break bailing twine or leather headcollars. She got caught up on a stable door and ended up pulling it off the hinges but luckily emerged unscathed after pulling it across the yard. Her owner had tried everything from tying her to bailing twine to using leather headcollars but she just broke everything in sight.

After Lari's accident pulling back when the bailing twine I'd half stripped down failed to break I invested in some quick release ties but have to put his lead rope through two of them as he has learned the slightest pressure and they will give.

The only thing you can do is tie up with a haynet to occupy the horse but if this doesn't work I have no idea what you can do.

When I watch Animal Cops which is filmed in America they hard tie horses to solid objects all the time, its unbelievable.

 

[Flowerofthefen]

The last pony I saw hard tied broke its neck. It slipped on the front end then couldnt get up as it's head was tied. Heartbreaking.

 

[Birker2020]

The last pony I saw hard tied broke its neck. It slipped on the front end then couldnt get up as it's head was tied. Heartbreaking.

I know I cringe when I watch AC. I see them hard tie a struggling horse that is having some treatment or other done to it and its squirming around wringing its neck in an attempt to get free. I get that they have to protect themselves and horses with no or little handling are incredibly dangerous and two fold if they are in immense pain but surely a sedative would be a much better option?

On a previous yard some 20 plus years ago the farrier tied a mare to a rope slung between a couple of concrete posts with a tragic outcome when the horse got her head stuck under the rope and panicked. She pulled back and managed to rip the rope off one of the concrete posts but the other one she dragged around with her in her panic, down into the menage and crashed through the side of the fence, through another fence down a long track and straight through the middle of an old wooden five bar gate completely smashing it in two parts. If it wasn't so old and rotten it would have killed her as it wouldn't have yielded to her.

She ended up right over the field shaking with terror and a flap of skin from her chest hanging down by her knees. Everyone but the vet thought it was an instant put to sleep job but the vet stapled. After a few weeks you could barely see the outline of the scar. Vet said its incredible that something as large and dramatic as a chest opening up is no problem yet a tiny pin prick injury near a joint can be a death warrant.

 

[MuddyMonster]

When my native wasn't very good to tie up, I taught him to ground tie first of all.

Then when I was confident he could find his own calm stood still on his own, I used an Idalo to tie up (literally stood right next to him at first) as it would slip the rope.

I separately worked on making sure he understood yielding to pressure (he didn't) through groundwork.

This seemed to do the trick although I still tie to an Idalo, he stands quietly now tied up anywhere now.

 

[TheFarmIsFull]

Thanks all!
Body work has been done and surprisingly nothing sinister or relatable was found, fine around the poll and neck.
It seems like a bad habit especially with the head toss first to check if she is in fact tied up and if there’s no pressure at all she will be ok.
I have been working on pressure and release but I’ll have to get more consistent I think. I’ll take a look at Warwick I love his videos.
She has fairly good ground manners so loose tying is fine unless she’s in a ridiculous attached mood to everyone else but it’s the little things like leading her by a halter and she takes off backwards throwing her head to get away, happens sometimes with a lead too. Has happened while holding for the farrier and I have lunged her once since her taking off with all the gear on and she was ok but you can feel if she wanted to say no about something and take off backwards to get away she will.
I have had horse like this before and they have always come right with daily handling and work but she feels very determined about it all.
I wouldn’t dare tie her fixed to anything, not only do I not want my halters and leads broken I also don’t want her hurting herself and I don’t think she will stop once she starts trying to get away.
I will continue with the pressure and release as much as I can for now and hope we get some improvement. I do think half of it is also concentration related, if her minds not with you she doesn’t want to be with you. If she’s relaxed and concentrating she is much much better.

 

[GreyDot]

Out of interest, have you tried her being led in a cavesson lunging headcollar? Mine react very differently with the leadrope/lungeline attached above the nose. Otherwise, with time and effort, I would personally tackle it with longreining and a person at the head. Yes, it take longer (and 2 people) but if you have had her checked out physically, it sounds like a psychological/attitude issue and these are a bugger to fix but can be done by thinking a little outside the box.

 

[Cortez]

Tying, and following pressure is an absolute requisite for any horse, I can't have anything here that won't tie up. Using breakaway ties is the absolutely best way to teach a horse to pull until something breaks and it gets away. Horses that panic have not been properly trained to tie, something that should be done with foals.

It sounds as if your horse is just pulling away to be disobedient, a tap in the bum should send it forward.

 

[MagicMelon]

Id try a pressure release halter. Lead her round in it, get her to stand then ask her to move by pulling gently on it, when she moves forward immediately release the tension. So she learns to move into it to get away from the pressure. Might not work but if it were mine, Id be trying this a lot first. Id never tie up with a pressure halter obviously but just doing it in-hand.

 

[fredflop]

Get an idolo tie ring, or a blocker tie ring. Then train the horse to tie up, I’d use one of the NH type trainers on YouTube for help.