Horse shivering

MurphysMinder said:
Hopefully the horse is ok this morning. As I read it they are in a pen rather than a stable, so no roof at the moment, and on pea shingle so no grazing. You don't mention hay OP but presume they have that rather than just soaked nuts ?
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He’s on restricted grazing - so he’s eating as much as normal. He eats restricted grazing in intervals throughout the day. When he’s done with a section he comes in for a while and then goes out a few hours later for another strip. The vet has supported this routine for both weight management and the management of a sycamore tree nearby. Soon he will go out full time to a new pasture. Grazing 2x a day is much better for him than 2x hay nets. Hes asthmatic and the grazing lasts longer than a hay net for the same caloric intake.
 
MurphysMinder said:
So what does he eat when shut in the pen overnight ?
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He’s always been on restricted grazing where the fence is moved in intervals to prevent him from become an absolute porker (as has occurred previously). This is literally no different to normal restricted grazing practices, only he is removed from the pasture overnight. Most people give 2x haynets a day, so surely they are aware these horses are done munching in a few hours and stand without food for 8 or more hours? Genuinely no different. This practice has been supported by my vet
 
Mango_goose said:
He’s always been on restricted grazing where the fence is moved in intervals to prevent him from become an absolute porker (as has occurred previously). This is literally no different to normal restricted grazing practices, only he is removed from the pasture overnight. Most people give 2x haynets a day, so surely they are aware these horses are done munching in a few hours and stand without food for 8 or more hours? Genuinely no different. This practice has been supported by my vet
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I would change my vet. No.horse should be standing for 8 hours without access to any kind of food.
 
Amymay Again said:
So what does he 'graze' on when he's in his pen?

Cross posted with @MurphysMinder
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I hate to break it to you but you are aware that the majority of the horses who come in over night eat for an hour and then have nothing left for the remaining ten hours in? He cannot graze continuously or he will become obese - how is this literally any different from him having a restricted portion of a pasture over night? The fields were bald from the hot summer and nothing grew.
 
Mango_goose said:
I hate to break it to you but you are aware that the majority of the horses who come in over night eat for an hour and then have nothing left for the remaining ten hours in? He cannot graze continuously or he will become obese - how is this literally any different from him having a restricted portion of a pasture over night? The fields were bald from the hot summer and nothing grew.
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I hate to break it back to you, but my horses have never run out of hay and then stood for 10 hours without anything.
 
Pearlsasinger said:
I would change my vet. No.horse should be standing for 8 hours without access to any kind of food.
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He has trickle feeders annd other edible enrichment and I’ve spoken to multiple vets thanks!

It’s either he stays in for eight hours without hay but with trickle feeders, or has access to sycamore leaves and possibly gets AM, or he gets given hay, soaked or unsoaked and goes into an asthmatic crisis.

I’m happy with where I’m placing my bets thanks. This is for a matter of weeks until I can get him onto a pasture which doesn’t have a toxic tree present.

Also… are you getting up and feeding your horse overnight? Of course you’re not. Get off your high horse ffs!

Of course you’re dropping in a Hay net which is empty in a matter of hours and prentending to yourself your horse has hay all night. They dont. No one is able to give a hay net 7x a day to keep them constantly munching! Unless you’re fortunate to have 24 hr turnout (which I will in a few weeks).
 
Amymay Again said:
I hate to break it back to you, but my horses have never run out of hay and then stood for 10 hours without anything.
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Oh look we’re being delusional!

You do understand that some natives hold onto weight and cannot be given that much hay or they’d be at risk of health complications….?

This has been the routine for years. These horses are fine, without ulcers, and generally very very happy. I’ve been through probably 10 + vets (due to a closure in the local practices) and they’ve all said that this is completely fine. One gave me a hard talk where she told me if gave my horse Hay I’d run the risk of him having another asthma episode… which would kill him
 
Mango_goose said:
He has trickle feeders annd other edible enrichment and I’ve spoken to multiple vets thanks!

It’s either he stays in for eight hours without hay but with trickle feeders, or has access to sycamore leaves and possibly gets AM, or he gets given hay, soaked or unsoaked and goes into an asthmatic crisis.

I’m happy with where I’m placing my bets thanks. This is for a matter of weeks until I can get him onto a pasture which doesn’t have a toxic tree present.

Also… are you getting up and feeding your horse overnight? Of course you’re not. Get off your high horse ffs!

Of course you’re dropping in a Hay net which is empty in a matter of hours and prentending to yourself your horse has hay all night. They dont. No one is able to give a hay net 7x a day to keep them constantly munching! Unless you’re fortunate to have 24 hr turnout (which I will in a few weeks).
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I think you're making assumptions on people's management that may or may not exist. And there's absolutely no need to become aggressive, rude or swear.

I've had one horse (a native) who had to be restricted, and yes it's tough. However she was never stood in for eight hours without hay. It was portioned out throughout the day and mixed with straw (I realise from your posts this isn't possible for you due to asthma).

My other horses have always had access to adlib hay, and always had some left in the morning. This was assisted by late checks and topping up if needed.

I'm sure your horse is beautifully cared for and people's concerns are unnecessary. However it's well recognised that withholding fibre for lengthy periods of time is not good equine management.
 
Mango_goose said:
He’s always been on restricted grazing where the fence is moved in intervals to prevent him from become an absolute porker (as has occurred previously). This is literally no different to normal restricted grazing practices, only he is removed from the pasture overnight. Most people give 2x haynets a day, so surely they are aware these horses are done munching in a few hours and stand without food for 8 or more hours? Genuinely no different. This practice has been supported by my vet
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I'm so sorry but that vet wouldn't be attending my horses.

If you had been able to feed a fibre based forage such as hay or haylage when the horse was cold then that also helps to warm them, as does rubbing down with towels and then rugging / thatching.

I would not leave any horse without forage overnight, and in my humble opinion that is cruel, as was bathing in the evening for no reason.
 
Ohh no op! You can’t leave a horse over night with nothing! I have a Shetland/welsh A who’s always tough to manage weight wise but even he doesn’t get left with nothing.
When I read the few posts above about what he eats if no hay or straw because of asthma I figured haylage. I was shocked you said nothing.
You could soak and small new hay. At least he’d have something to pick at and that won’t cause weight gain.
 
TBH, I'm failing to understand why it's a good idea to with hold food for such a long period of time. Then also when the horse has had the ability to regulate body temperature reduced by the restriction of forage why it's a good idea to soak him through with cold water, leave him to shiver, immobile with no shelter from the rain and to refuse to provide rugs. Is this something that the vet has recommended also?

Very hungry horses can end up eating stuff they wouldn't normally, like laurel for example :rolleyes:.
 
doodle said:
Surely this is a windup?
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just looked at this thread. It rained, old horse was cold and shivering because owner didn't rug it. Is it really necessary to tell the world about it, just make sure you take better care of him.. Seems to be someone that wants to argue about anything,
 
Mango_goose said:
I hate to break it to you but you are aware that the majority of the horses who come in over night eat for an hour and then have nothing left for the remaining ten hours in? He cannot graze continuously or he will become obese - how is this literally any different from him having a restricted portion of a pasture over night? The fields were bald from the hot summer and nothing grew.
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Horses’ guts aren’t designed for long periods without anything going through (even starving them overnight before veterinary procedures can lead to colic), therefore many, many horses are stabled with ad lib hay precisely to prevent this, or ulcers, or stress or compulsive vices. These are all-too-possible risks.
An empty gut undermines ability to generate warmth - please, at least invest in and use some decent rugs for these horses if this is how they are kept.
Understandably you don’t want the health issues from obesity, nor to trigger asthma, nor sycamore poisoning, but it does sound as though life could be managed more kindly and less riskily for them both.
If your field has been grazed bare, why can’t they go in that overnight? there’d probably be at least some pickings, and at least they’d be moving around looking for them.
If your grass has started shooting up again, and this is your own place, run the lawnmower very short over a smaller section they could stay out on - again, they’d both have to move and ‘work’ to graze it, but at least would be something going in.
The idea of compromised horses shut in a small gravel pen, exposed to the elements with nothing to eat all night, heading towards winter (hopefully you’ll stop bathing them) - it’s far from ideal, whatever your vet might think.
Good luck.
 
I’m hoping this is a troll….

I too have an asthmatic porker, his hay is soaked thoroughly and rinsed, I leave top chop zero trugs for if he does run out of hay so he’s not standing for hours with nothing.
 
Yes, the six hour sycamore thing makes no sense. Can you explain OP?

Can the horse not even have haylage? My pony has EMS and even he has some hay left in the morning.

Horses are not designed to go long periods without eating. They’re grazers; there is a multitude of reasons as to why they shouldn’t go so long without eating.
 
Peglo said:
What got me was that the sycamore’s aren’t a problem until he’s been out for 6 hours and then the horse must come in because of them. What do they do past the 6 hour mark to all of a sudden become a problem?
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The majority of vets recommend that horses are removed from sycamore pasture after 6 hours. I believe some research has gone into this, suggesting horses with access to grazing longer than this are more likely to suffer from sycamore poisoning.

Like other posters my porky overweight natives never go without forage though. Although we dont deal with equine asthma, I have a hay allergy so have to feed haylage. They also get chopped straw overnight to prevent them going without. They have multiple small holed nets so there is always forage left by the morning.
 
follysienna said:
The majority of vets recommend that horses are removed from sycamore pasture after 6 hours. I believe some research has gone into this, suggesting horses with access to grazing longer than this are more likely to suffer from sycamore poisoning.

Like other posters my porky overweight natives never go without forage though. Although we dont deal with equine asthma, I have a hay allergy so have to feed haylage. They also get chopped straw overnight to prevent them going without. They have multiple small holed nets so there is always forage left by the morning.
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Thanks for explaining re: the sycamore thing.
 
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