Horse strong when hacking advice please.

[horses99]

My horse has recently become difficult to hack out off roads in fields woods etc. I find him worse in company when he has something to run with/ against. Previously he has been fine (only had 6 months) but during lockdown we have hacked a lot and now he gets rather excited.

Generally to walk and mainly trot he is fine but it’s difficult to canter in a controlled/ safe manner and feel I have breaks at the end. He’s fine in the school and on the roads only in fields etc. He was in a eggbut snaffle changed to ns hanging cheek as I it’s the only other I had that fit him and I found little change in his attitude.

Considering trying a universal or gag but I would rather just try to work it out as well and have how he used to be!
Any tips on a new bit or how to get out of this slump?

I have tried not cantering in same place circles and transitions. He does it in places he hasn’t even been before but is worse if it’s on our regular root. Transitions works best but it’s hard work perhaps just needs time, I will keep perisiting in the mean time. When he’s being a right tit sometimes circling is the only way I can stop!

be kind TIA

 

[Northern Hare]

I know I’m going to get shot down in flames here, but my personal view is that it is too dangerous (and not fun) to be unable to control your speed safely whilst hacking. I persevered and persevered but my horse who was perfect schooling etc was simply too strong for me out hacking. Not bolting, but I’d think to myself “ok, we’ll pull up at the next tree” and we’d sail on past! I tried various bits but what sorted it for me was a straight bar vulcanite Pelham with roundings. Sorted. Safe. Fun again ? Horse happy, not fighting. I could canter on a soft rein contact knowing I could stop when I wanted to.

 

[mini_b]

I agree with the sentiments above. I have a separate bit from what I school in as it’s not safe not being able to pull up.
we can do sensible-ish but he’s not perfect. If I tried to circle that would mean wazzing off in different direction.

You’re doing all the right things but loads of transitions can hot a horse up. I’d go back to spending a lot of time walking until it’s boring. Walk the whole route.
don’t let her power walk, sometimes stop for a bit, loose rein, lots of pats, have a treat.

no cantering in company until you have cracked it on your own.
Start of by going into canter then back to walk. Literally a couple of strides and that’s it for your hack. Then a bit longer each time.

I only canter if we can go at the front, no one is allowed to over take and it’s usually on a track never across open fields. Thems my rules ?

pick your battles x

 

[be positive]

I know I’m going to get shot down in flames here, but my personal view is that it is too dangerous (and not fun) to be unable to control your speed safely whilst hacking. I persevered and persevered but my horse who was perfect schooling etc was simply too strong for me out hacking. Not bolting, but I’d think to myself “ok, we’ll pull up at the next tree” and we’d sail on past! I tried various bits but what sorted it for me was a straight bar vulcanite Pelham with roundings. Sorted. Safe. Fun again ? Horse happy, not fighting. I could canter on a soft rein contact knowing I could stop when I wanted to.

You should not get shot down, this is a matter of safety and if a stronger bit gives the control needed then one should be used, it may be a short term fix to instill manners and brakes, a snaffle can still be used for schooling and many bits can be used with a bottom rein, rather than a rounding, that only really gets picked up when required if the rider can manage two reins, no harm in using a rounding if that is easier but it does restrict the rider a little from dropping down a level if they feel ready.

 

[Goldenstar]

To put it bluntly you need brakes and if that means a stronger bit so be it .
I use a Waterford on Sky on exciting hacks he’s usually fine but the reason he’s fine is that he know I have Waterford .
You can be out of control in public in this day and age it’s just not safe .

 

[MidChristmasCrisis]

Make hacking boring and stick to walk and the odd trot. Don’t go out in a group just one other sensible horse. Practise leg yielding collected walk etc make it work and not an exciting prospect. Use a stronger bit to help with walk initially. It will take patience and time.

 

[Auslander]

I'd far rather put a stronger bit in than get tanked off with. Alf is immensely strong in canter out hacking - so I stick a waterford in his gob if we're planning to go fast. I've never had to take a pull in it - he had a fiddle with it, figured out that he wouldn't really enjoy having it deployed, and has never tried to tank me when he's wearing it. His default is to stick his nose to his chest, which makes stopping extremely difficult - and he knows it.
Somehow, I don't think more schooling would be the answer with him...

 

[oldie48]

One of my previous horses could be extremely strong in canter. I used a stronger bit when hacking and a running martingale. In company he had to be in the lead and like someone else said, that was my rules, if he was leading I had control and he listened. He'd been a pc eventer and his previous teenage owner had clearly cantered on every blade of grass, I most definitely didn't and I chose my riding companions carefully and only rode with people who I knew had control over their horses

 

[mini_b]

I'd far rather put a stronger bit in than get tanked off with. Alf is immensely strong in canter out hacking - so I stick a waterford in his gob if we're planning to go fast. I've never had to take a pull in it - he had a fiddle with it, figured out that he wouldn't really enjoy having it deployed, and has never tried to tank me when he's wearing it. His default is to stick his nose to his chest, which makes stopping extremely difficult - and he knows it.
Somehow, I don't think more schooling would be the answer with him...

I agree i think if you’ve got a horse who’s older, whom you know well, you can decide if they are pretty much just set in their ways!

Thing is that irritates me, is mine is so unpredictable as to when he will decide he won’t stop. There’s no rhyme or reason. I can stop in a snaffle, I can stop from my voice. Or then there’s the times he’s like nah not stopping....ever.
Then it feels like that bloody shamrock video ?

 

[Pippity]

I felt guilty about popping Blue in a dutch gag for hacking, but it's made a world of difference.

Recs for a bit kind of depend on how his brakes fail - does he tuck his nose in, giraffe, or just set his neck and go?

 

[The Xmas Furry]

OP, as others have said there is no shame in bitting up.
My B Fuzzy has been a trifle of a twerp the last few days and is usually in a bomber snaffle. Today I popped on her complete show bridle with Pelham in, she was a sweetheart to ride and it was like sitting on a show hack for the whole time. Not once did I need the curb as she knew it was there, but I held it lightly just in case.
Please report back on how you get on x

 

[mini_b]

I think people argue about bitting up as a corner cutting method for bad/lack of schooling.

However in this case it sounds like you need to get brakes back whilst you work on making everything rather boring for a while.

 

[nikkimariet]

Fig is brutally strong generally. He’s safe to hack in that he will never do anything but I can’t canter him in open spaces with other horses because a couple of hours of cantering and piaffing sideways isn’t fun for anyone...

I always kept his bits for hacking totally separate. Myler low port short shank combo was good and I used a polo gag too. He’s the only horse I put draw reins on perversely.

I had to do quite a lot of walk only hacking for some time and it still never cured it truly.

 

[Pearlsacarolsinger]

I am with the others. I could school the Draft mare at home in the field in a NS Tranz but put her into a NS Universal for hacking. When I bought her I was told that she had run away with her novice owner and prior to that she had worked in a RS. She had very fixed ideas that when your hooves hit grass you increased the pace. Except not in my world! I even had to teach her that I chose the pace on the road. I like the Universal with 2 reins, so that I can ride on the snaffle rein most of the time but have the curb rein as back-up.

I also had a Clydesdale that I put into a PeeWee bit, which was good for her, as it has a slim mouthpiece that suited her conformation. Safety has to be paramount

 

[Trouper]

It sounds as if he has really settled down with you and is just enjoying life!! So give yourself a pat on the back for that at least. However, there is often a stage a few months in to a new relationship with a horse where they just think that they can start taking the mickey. I agree with other suggestions for a stronger bit but I would also be doing a fair bit of school work with him as he just has to knuckle down now and listen to you and understand who is boss.

 

[j1ffy]

I'm with the consensus here - go for a stronger hacking bit. My Medium dressage horse never pulled / got strong in the school but occasionally would ignore the bit entirely on a hack. I always hacked in a Kimblewick to ensure I could stay safe, and his loaner now hacks in a Waterford.

I think there's a bit of an obsession with snaffles in this country but it's much more pleasant for both horse and rider if you don't have to hang onto their mouth out hacking. A friend in Spain once took on a forward-going Selle Francais whose (French) owner insisted on using a snaffle - her mouth was full of bruises as a result. Friend used a Pelham which resulted in a happier horse, no bruising, and happy rider.

 

[horses99]

Thank you all for your comments feel much better about ‘biting up’ a bit and in response to some he typical tends to giraffe and even get his tongue out a bit and if I try to stop he just gets short in the pace rather than dropping to trot and will even bronc. Last time I cantered a week ago I had to start a wavy line him to get him to slow as pulling wasn’t enough in one direction. Going to try with a universal/ gag and see how it goes in the meantime I walked in a field and did a little trot today and was fine just a little giddy as I’m sue he wanted to go faster. Thank you again all il let you know how I get on!

 

[mini_b]

Thank you all for your comments feel much better about ‘biting up’ a bit and in response to some he typical tends to giraffe and even get his tongue out a bit and if I try to stop he just gets short in the pace rather than dropping to trot and will even bronc. Last time I cantered a week ago I had to start a wavy line him to get him to slow as pulling wasn’t enough in one direction. Going to try with a universal/ gag and see how it goes in the meantime I walked in a field and did a little trot today and was fine just a little giddy as I’m sue he wanted to go faster. Thank you again all il let you know how I get on!

there are posters more experienced/educated on bitting than me could expand on this..but I’ve found that those tend to giraffe and stick their tongues out are trying to evade pressure on the tongue. Just a point to consider when you are choosing your hacking brakes

 

[horses99]

there are posters more experienced/educated on bitting than me could expand on this..but I’ve found that those tend to giraffe and stick their tongues out are trying to evade pressure on the tongue. Just a point to consider when you are choosing your hacking brakes

Thank you he has a fleshy tongue and only takes a 5inch so isn’t the easiest he’s in a thin french link mouthpiece looking to keep that part the same which is hard as a lot of gags for example have large mouth pieces what mouth piece would you suggest?

 

[mini_b]

Thank you he has a fleshy tongue and only takes a 5inch so isn’t the easiest he’s in a thin french link mouthpiece looking to keep that part the same which is hard as a lot of gags for example have large mouth pieces what mouth piece would you suggest?

I can’t really make a suggestion to be honest but I will tell you that I had a head chucker, tongue sticker out with no brakes and it was actually the link that was the problem rather than the thickness of the bit itself.
big tongue and a low palate.
I phoned bit bank, had a chat with them, told them all the problems and they sent me bits on trial.

I did have to do lots of reschooling, desensitising, boring hacks but I needed brakes to be able to get to that point.

Generally speaking a gag will raise the head and a Pelham/kimblewick type bit will lower the head.

once you think you’ve got the bit sorted, you might then want to consider a different noseband ?
I ride with no noseband but I use a grackle to hack in, just so I don’t have to use a stronger bit than I need to.

lots of trial and error but you will get there!

 

[horses99]

I can’t really make a suggestion to be honest but I will tell you that I had a head chucker, tongue sticker out with no brakes and it was actually the link that was the problem rather than the thickness of the bit itself.
big tongue and a low palate.
I phoned bit bank, had a chat with them, told them all the problems and they sent me bits on trial.

I did have to do lots of reschooling, desensitising, boring hacks but I needed brakes to be able to get to that point.

Generally speaking a gag will raise the head and a Pelham/kimblewick type bit will lower the head.

once you think you’ve got the bit sorted, you might then want to consider a different noseband ?
I ride with no noseband but I use a grackle to hack in, just so I don’t have to use a stronger bit than I need to.

lots of trial and error but you will get there!

I’m going to speak to the bit bank tomorrow knew about the saddle bank but that’s great! I had a look and the bomber happy tongue could be a good option for him but yes I think you might be right just didn’t want to buy lots of bits and then have to sell them all so that’s a good idea! Thank you and god at this rate il have to get a whole new bridle! ?

 

[mini_b]

I’m going to speak to the bit bank tomorrow knew about the saddle bank but that’s great! I had a look and the bomber happy tongue could be a good option for him but yes I think you might be right just didn’t want to buy lots of bits and then have to sell them all so that’s a good idea! Thank you and god at this rate il have to get a whole new bridle! ?

bomber happy tongue are fantastic I have a snaffle (no noseband) and then a Pelham and grackle (not strictly correct but it works for us) after much trial and error.

we tried the NS universal amongst others but I had no brakes and he was very unhappy in it.
The bit bank are great, I did send a lot back but I saved a fortune in the long run!

 

[BronsonNutter]

I'd also recommend looking at what kind of noseband you use - if it's a plain cavesson and he opens his mouth/gets his tongue over it could be worth trying something like a grackle or a drop. My little TB can go anywhere in a snaffle, but if we're doing anything exciting then the drop noseband really needs to be on else there's a chance he might get away from me!

Also, a neckstrap can be useful as an extra brake! I tend to stand up and bridge my reins on my boy, but that's just what he's used to (that and I literally can't sit to the canter anymore) - still something to consider though, as if you get it right they only pull on themselves.

 

[Muddywellies]

I can't canter mine out hacking full stop. I've had pro's hack her for me and the general consensus is that it's just not safe. So whilst others go for glorious canters, we have to stick to walk and trot ?

 

[horses99]

Just an update for any interested I have been trialling some happy tongue bits and am have been using a combo of a universal on the bottom hole with happy tongue mouthpiece. Grackle noseband too seems happy in it and I can always stop he can still be excitable/ strong at times but I can safely stop and see both have fun and even the odd race thank you for all your help and comments wouldn’t have tried this / used the bit bank otherwise and come to this conclusion!