Horse tax - have your say

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We already have to pay for passports which seem to be naff all use! Now there is a tax proposed on horses. We are the absolute enemy as far as this government is concerned. How about putting a tax on people with more than 2 kids. They are costing this country a fortune and are responsible for climate change - too many people on the planet. I am sick of being crucified financially for my lifestyle choices.
 




The new consultation on Bio Security which is entitled Funding Structure for tackling animal diseases is open until the 30th of June.
The concept is to set up a new body along the lines of Natural England with 3500 civil servants and raise £22 million from the Livestock and Equestrian industries to pay for disease prevention for exotic diseases. The Equine contribution would be in the order of £8-10 million.
A levy on all animals would be collected by the keeper of the holding from £10 for a horse to 4 pence for a chicken. Holdings and keepers of agricultural livestock have been recorded since the beginning of the second world war and are fairly straightforward as the livestock moves two or three times a year. When SANCO proposed the microchipping of horses which becomes effective on 1/7/09 they originally wanted to have a register of keepers and holdings but it quickly became apparent that horses can move countries two or three times a day going from a competition in Solihull to Hertogenbosch and the idea was not progressed with.
The document has been thought out very well for livestock and now says should horses be included. The answer from the Industry as Bluetongue has arrived in the UK and West Nile Disease and African Horse Sickness are with climate change likely to arrive we need a well thought out series of protection measures from vaccines to control of movements of all goods from areas where the disease is known to be. Both these are not horse to horse or zebra to horse but a transmitted by a contaminated vector in the form of a small midge.
There is one fundamental problem and this is that generally in the E.U. horses are treated as livestock but in the U.K. they are treated as pets or pleasure horses. The tax concessions on rates for livestock has allowed our continental sports horse breeding competitors to invest and build up a highly successful industry but in the U.K. we have had our hands tied behind our backs with rates and planning regulations.
The levy on livestock may be fair but through the betting levy and rates on stables,indoor schools and livery yards the industry already pays substantial amounts of tax and to set up a regulatory body just to raise £8-10 million seems an unfair burden on the Equine Industry and a very expensive way of collection.
The control measures envisaged by DEFRA are the setting up of a control zone and slaughter all horses in that zone. The livestock industry is paid an agreed industry price for each animal but Equines will only receive £1 of which the E.U. will pay 50 pence. DEFRA seems to think that the new scheme will include compulsory insurance arranged through commercial insures. This has two problems will any underwriter want to know and secondly the price of horse insurance is already too high for most keepers and that excludes exotic diseases.



Issues raised by farming community.
Welfare is not covered by the new body but it is directly related to disease control. As an example if a movement order is put on an area as happened in the last foot and mouth and a livestock feeder needs to get food or oil in to control temperature in the houses ,movement orders stopped this and animals suffered. In the case quoted ,the local DEFRA office knowing the producer was on the edge of the zone supported the movement but Nobel House overruled them.
When a pig out break occurs will wild boar in Thetford Forest be slaughtered asked one farmer as wild life does not come under this new body. The DEFRA response was yes. The pigman then asked would the minister be able to overrule the advice on wild life slaughter. The DEFRA response that it was most unlikely. Why then he was asked had the minister overruled the Advice of the Chief Veterinary Officer that badgers should be slaughtered in TB hotspots?. Blank stare from DEFRA officer.
A chicken farmer raised two points. There would be an exemption from the levy for small chicken flocks of less than 50 birds how did they provide a low level of risk as free range chickens? His indoor flock poses less risk than a free range flock? DEFRA was naive to think that supermarkets would accept the increase in price of his birds with the levy and the increased insurance cost.
DEFRA has a problem with the devolved powers as it is responsible to the E.U. in these issues but cannot override the decisions of the devolved powers.
DEFRA seems to be confused as to its responsibilities it talks about imports and imports are where things come into the E.U. from third countries and from Denmark to England is a movement not an import. The port of entry into the E.U. is primarily responsible for imports.
Where someone is failing in carrying out the legal requirements of bio security and is responsible for the outbreak should he be made to pay the costs of that outbreak to other livestock producers. This question was asked as DEFRA was responsible for the last foot and mouth outbreak.
Clear examples of the unlevel playing field in the E.U.
In Ireland and there is no VAT on the sale of a horse in the UK the full rate is paid. In France,Hungary and Germany there are substantially lower rates
Under the “Under minimis” rule the Belgium studbooks get a total one million Euros in government support to studbooks.
Conclusion
This is for the Equine Industry a move with little benefits that could EASILY be achieved by a more focused approach.
 
I would support a horse tax which was linked with licensing provisions to prevent indescriminate breeding of horrible useless horses and ponies. If the sale of animals produced by a breeder without a license (not to be unreasonably priced or witheld - not wanting to prevent private breeders having a foal out of a decent per mare) was banned perhaps we would see less cruelty cases like the recent Spindles Farm. Just taxing ordinary horse owners seems unpoliceable and silly.
 
This is yet another government ploy to increase taxes. It is also symptomatic of the government's continuing attack on rural life.

Perhaps the government should consider increasing the tax on cigarettes, confectionary or dvd rentals. These pursuits do not encourage healthy living and fresh air.

Horseriding and agriculture are fundamental to our very society.

It is a fallacy to consider that all horseowners have money to burn. Many of us continue to save native breeds and maintain our heritage.

No government should be voted in if it discourages natural, rural life.
 
write to your MP and MEP
This is yet another attack by the goverment on rural life.

Also, do we want DEFRA to mess up yet another project.

Remember Willy Bach and Margaret Beckets debacle regarding farmers? They were heavily criticised but continue to flourish.

Why does the goverment reward loyal incompetents?
 
I've written to several Ministers, DEFRA, Shadow Cabinet Members and so far only had three replies - all of whom passed on my concerns to DEFRA who I've already written to!!!!!!! Fat lot of good it did putting in all that effort!!!!!!!!!
 
Seems like yet another complete cock up. Do we not already pay through the nose - insurance, vaccinations etc. Everyone seems to think because we own horses we are well off, not true as we all know. Many of us own one horse and work damned hard to keep it.

The comments above have plainly raised some extremely valid points and shown how little it has been thought through. We could really do with a body that argued with 'clout' for horse owners in this country!
 
I'm afraid I just think its yet another tax. I cannot imagine any Government department being anything other than an overhead and hindrance. We are so over regulated in general that it just makes me sigh when I hear that he Government wants to meddle even further in our lives. What next a Cat tax or a Dog tax? Or do they not get sick....
 
I think we as horse owners pay quite enough tax! We pay tax on wages, fuel, vehicles, clothes and the list goes on. I wont be paying it thats for sure. I paid out for passports for all of mine, had 3 pts since the passport ruling came out- no one asked for passport. Vet has been loads of times- again not asked for them. Also, drove hundreds of miles with horses in trailer- and to shows- never been asked for passports. Its a money making racket.
 
Please note the small print, the £10.50 per year is only the start, there will also be a payment for "insurance". Who will check that we have paid the tax? Won't the admin cost more than the tax? More money to be wrung from people already scrimping and doing without to keep their horse. We appear to be an easy target especially as the horse is not considered to be "livestock" and does not have the rights of livestock.
 
This is yet another regulation that it will be impossible to police and, like passports, only those who are law-abiding will end up paying this levy. Horses are changing hands all the time and there will be no way to track them all, just as the traceability of farm animals for the food chain is a myth.
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I echo what Janet George has said above.

This tax is a total farce and just another way of getting money out of horse owners.
 
The Lead Body for Performance and Sport Horses and Ponies (PSHP) has submitted a full response (using the format required by DEFRA and answering the questions posed) to the 'consultation on a new independent body for animal health' (the so-called erroneously nicknamed Horse Tax) and the PSHP steering group has agreed that anyone who wishes to have a copy should PM me with their name and e-mail address so that I can send it to them.

Obviously, by its very nature as the Lead Body for breeding Performance and Sport Horses and Ponies, the PSHP naturally takes a rather longer and wider-based view than most organisations (and individuals) responding to the consultation would currently appear to be doing, but becuase of this the document itself it fairly lengthy which is why I have not posted it here. However, I would encourage you all to read it as there has been much discussion of what various phrases and options mean and we have spent a considerable amount of time researching and trying to define these, and several members of the steering group have also been to the local consultation meetings to raise the points in person -- and on request also suggested points that needed to be raised at these meetings by other attendees.

So hopefully our response is both insightful and informed and now it has been submitted we are happy to let people have access to what we have written and sent to DEFRA.

Please pass this message on to any other forums or people you think may be interested too.
 
I was speaking to an animal welfare officer yesterday. Figures muted (nothing definite) at the mo are £10.50 per horse, £4 to £6 per head for meat and dairy cattle, 6p per sheep and 9p per pig. Now I keep horses, sheep and pigs and can't understand where they get these figures from. Surely it costs as much to shoot and dispose of a horse as it does a sheep or pig. Think I'll get a rocking horse instead will be much cheaper to keep!!!!
 
Totally agree its a stealth tax. Recently saw article where Cheshire rider (employed by NFU) went to Montana ranch riding. At both airports in the States, she was asked about her contact with animals. If she had been in contact with cattle she would have been fully sprayed with disinfectant. In the UK, she came back with Montana mud on her boots and asked at both Heathrow and Manchester about declaring that she had been working with 1200 head of cattle- and the airport staff looked at her blankly. Until the Government starts to properly control our borders to lessen animal health risks and restrict imports of food from countries where there are known animal disease problems, there should be no Defra levy. Other countries like Australia and US do it, so why can't UK?
 
Trouble with these surveys is the questions they ask do not have yes or no answers.

The only one I can answer is ' no horse keepers should have to pay a levy'.

Answering any of the others assumes I have an opinion about them! I only have opinions about getting rid of the tidal wave of regulations that they have already showered on me!

J
 
Remember this is not a one off £10. It is £10+ per horse per annum, so again it will be the breeders who are hit for a start. Everyone should write to their MP's - also you should write to any breed societies you may be a member of and/or the BHS asking them to protest too.

There is an online petition you can all sign. Deadline to sign this petition is December 09 http://petitions.number10.gov.uk/ntht09/
 
What a ridiculous, unenforceable, money-grabbing scheme this is!

As it was with passports (I got one because it was the law then wondered why because it seems loads of people are getting away with not having one) so it shall be with a tax. I would guess only those who have passports will be taxed as they're the only ones on record anywhere. Naffing typical - only the law abiding get stuffed by these things.

Also, even when it comes to the actual and real agricultural animals, why are the farmers getting lumped with it? Does no-one in the country eat meat? Drink milk? Wear leather? Anyone who does is just as responsible for aiding animals when disease breaks out as the farmers / owners.

I'm sick of the finger-pointing, bullying attitude this government has towards anything they don't like or think they can make money from!
 
This badly thought up proposal is typical of Labour governments, (&amp; the EU), that love to indulge in state contrived &amp; controlled interference, &amp; more &amp; more taxation.
I know this, as unfortunately, i am old enough to remember previous labour governments.
It is up to the people of this country to Stop voting for the same Stupid, Wastefull, Incompetant Politicians, &amp; We Need to get back Control of Our Country from the Corrupt EU Control Freaks, Please Everyone bear this in mind at the next general election, thanks.
 
Typical Britain - coming up with a scam to make taxpayers pay twice for the same service. We already pay tax to cover this sort of thing, just like we pay tax for the NHS and then often have to go private to get a decent service, or pay tax for schools and then have the highest private school usage in the world.

The tax is really to pay for more government departments and more civil servants, because our country's economy is a mess and badly managed and there are'nt enough "real jobs". And of course civil servants paid out of the public purse are more likely to vote Labour.


Ciss makes a good point. The way things work in this country is that a Government minister or department comes up with what they think is a bright idea (usually a way of scamming money out of people by charging them twice for the same thing). They don't have the brains to work out for themselves the necessary detail so they put it out to consulatation. Various interested bodies prepare a response which is then ignored by the Government department except in any aspects which might be useful to them. Then they can say that they have been democratic and consulted with interested bodies.

The legislation is then usually passed as secondary legislation ie as a set of Regulations, rather than an Act of Parliament. Therefore it is never even voted upon by our democractically elected representatives in Parliament but is passed by a committee of a few MPs who probably won't even look at the detail but will leave that up to a civil servant who probably doesn't have a lot of expertise in the relevant field.

Its a scam.
 
should work as well as horse passports, chip, freezemarks etc , only be used by a few poor suckers while the rest just swan around taking no notice at all.
All government idea and policies are so short sighted and just another tax anyway.
Goes with the quaint idea that all horse owners are wealthy so should pay...more like the other way round...horse keep us poor!
 
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