Horse that has a extreme reaction to a spoke anxiety or bad manners?

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EMcC44

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Hi,
Was wondering if anyone has ever heard of this and knows what to to to teach the horse not to do this, or know where i can go for advice on this matter.

My Horse will spoke at anything a noise outside the school seeing someone walk past, another horse entering the school a cat a dog anything that makes a sound or moves or anything that he cannot see. He wont do a normal spoke he will take off buck twist charge leap in the air everything at once then once he is in that frame of mind he will keep doing that with anything that moves or make a noise. When this all started he did do this while pulling his head down and it was impossible to sit to. I have now got him to stop pulling his head down but i have had no luck with this at all.

I Have had his back, teeth, saddle and health checked.

Any one any ideas?

Thanks
 
Just a thought as you have had all the other normal checks have you had his eyesight checked? My horse can be very jumpy when tied up outside his stable (he is on the end of the row). Because of this I had his eyesight checked and he has 2 x 1mm blind spots in his right eye which is the outside eye when he is tied up. The only other time this can affect him is if we meet something unusual on a hack (portaloo for example!) on the right when he will stop but will prance past with reassurance from me.
 
once you had there eyes checked is there any treatment , or do you just have to get on with it? if its not his eyes have you any other ideas? Going to get his eyes checked ASAP
 
My horse's blind spots are just degeneration (?) due to his age (he is rising 15) and the vet said it may or may not get worse she has just suggested I get him checked annually when he has his jabs if he does get worse but I don't really think there is a lot they can do. I know 2 horses that only have one functioning eye and they have both adapted really well :)
 
Sorry that should say get him checked annually if he doesn't get worse obviously get him checked straight away if it does get worse!
 
EMcC44 said:
once you had there eyes checked is there any treatment , or do you just have to get on with it? if its not his eyes have you any other ideas? Going to get his eyes checked ASAP
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There was no treatment possible for my 4 year old. He was an extremely rare case, but his retinas just died and left him blind. He was so spooky in the end that it was dangerous to be in a stable with him, he would jump so badly that he would fall over. I had him put down, sorry :(


I meant to say also that the reason I had his sight checked was because he became completely unrideable due to rodeo bucking, but at that stage he had only lost his peripheral vision slightly and was nowhere near actually being blind.
 
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he isnt unrideable he does have his really good days and is 110% in his stable. If it is his eyes at least then i would know why. Im concerned about my course of action if it isnt his eyes and how i go about preventing this.
 
My first thing would be to get his eyes checked, but then also look at his feed. It may not seem obvious, but I worked with a gelding once that was changed from pasture mix to cool mix. He became like a wild animal. He would full on do the bambi splits at just a normal sound or movement on the yard. To be ridden was a joke and hacking was downright dangerous. We all thought eyes first as he was changed onto cool mix very slowly, but he had a full bill of health.

I advised the owner to take him off his hard feed while not being ridden and within 3 days he was back to normal. We put him back on pasture mix and no problems. Tested the theory by using cool mix again and BAM...deranged animal again.

The smallest changes can have massive effects on some horses.

Whatever it is, good luck.
 
He gets fed cool mix half a scoop twice a day but he has been fed this for over two years and I could hack ride in the field paddock anywhere and within this last year he has started doing this, I was thinking about taking the fed of him completely has he doesn't really get that much anyway I just don't no what to do with him
 
I think eyes as a first point of call, then take him off hard feed and see if that makes a difference. I guess the other thing that can make them very spooky is ulcers what is he like to girth up etc..?
 
He used to be a bit funny with his girth but when I got his back done I was told he has quiet sore around his girth area and this had came from when he got an operation on his mouth and was lying on his sides for a long time and he got loads of work done on them and then time off and now he seems grand has the odd day he doesn't like it but I think that's more to do with him being lazy , one thing I forgot to mention is he is only 4
 
So is he 4 and been in work for a year?

Was he turned away or has he been in work since he was broken? How big is he? What breed is he?

Babies, which is really what he is can exhibit all sorts of behaviours and can change very quickly if they perceive that something is wrong. It could be that he feels a bit confused or under pressure when ridden, so he is anticipating that and acting out...but when in the stable and free of that anxiety...is normal again because he can relax.

What kind of work have you done with him over the last year and what experience do you have bringing on youngsters? I am not in any way saying that you are doing anything wrong, but a bigger picture could be useful.
 
I got the idea its been on the feed 2yrs & was fine, its just in the last year its started spooking at everything. So if its only 4 now that means it was backed & being hacked & ridden at two. Nice.
Babies take confidence from those around them, so it could just be a case of you tensing in anticipation. And either/or pain or rider then being responsible for the bucking etc after. Get somebody experienced to come & ride it, like a trainer. If its fine for them, then its your riding. If its just as bad for them, go down the route of checking teeth, back, saddle etc.
 
Along with the other suggestions, it might be worth trying magnesium oxide in his feed. Start at 10gms daily and increase up to 20gms if he's 15hh +. Plain table salt (not lo salt) is another thing to add to his feed (rather than a lick) that might help and is cheap to try. About a tablespoon a day for a big horse, start with a small amount and increase over a week or so.

ps. It sounds to me like he is functioning in a permanent state of stress and is therefore easily spooked. A bit like we get when we're stressed/anxious, we jump at noises and things. I agree with the others it's worth trying to rule out physical causes which might be more than one. Good luck with him.
 
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Purely because of his age I think it is very likely that he is having a stressed phase and a bit overwhelmed if he has not been turned away since backing, so that might be a good idea and also to drop his feed to something as plain and boring as you can get away with. I have known so many horses be silly on feeds named 'calm' or 'cool' with 'non heating' written on the back! It could be the eyes though, you never know. It just sounds like he is in a heightened state of anxiety for one reason or another and you need to try and wind him down a bit and improve his confidence :-)
 
Saddle? Is it's young it will be changing shape all the time? Teeth? etc etc
Mine would go silly on even a bit of cool mix, why not try cutting that out? Or feeding a token unmolassed chaff?
Also mine goes daft and spooky on haylage - always has done in the 5 years I have had him. Turns out it actually disagrees with his tummy. Are you feeding haylage? You could swap it for hay?
 
He was turned away for six months and he is going out again at the end of feb just trying to get some progress before he goes out, he isn't a very good hacker so I've been trying to work on that he has done a few showjumping training shows a we prelim 4 dressage test but that's about it , he is my third young horse and he is the only one I've came across this problem with , I've had I few trainers ride him and watch me ride they just keep telling me to stay on for as long as possible and ignore him he will grow out of it. The sate of anxiety that a few of your have mentioned have you any hints or tips to over come this? Vet it coming out today to check his eyes for me thank you very much for all your replies you have been very helpful :)
 
Oo his operation was because he got kicked in the face as a two year old out in the field and his tooth broke down and went infected and caused a huge growth in his mouth and he had to have it removed with part of his gums and the stress of laying down for that long caused his sides to be sore, but I've had that treated and he is fine now
 
EMcC44 said:
The sate of anxiety that a few of your have mentioned have you any hints or tips to over come this? Vet it coming out today to check his eyes for me thank you very much for all your replies you have been very helpful :)
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Yes, the poster after me (sorry forgot who atm) put it better than I did. I think it can come from a grumbling physical cause such as gut upset, ulcers, pain somewhere for example so running through the physical stuff, ensuring his diet is high in forage and as low in sugars as is possible is a good start. Then it's a case of taking the pressure off him, looking carefully at when he seems most stressed/jumpy and seeing if there are ways to help him... a friend with him, a different area etc. Is the yard really noisy? Consistent, calm, quiet handling and if possible consistent herd mates so he gets security from knowing his field mates and doesn't have to met new/less well known ones each day. Really just thinking of ways to help him feel safer and more relaxed.

Magnesium deficiency can cause some horses to be hyper aware and jumpy so supplementing it is worth a try along with some sort of gut support such as yea sacc. The vet exam (and dental/mouth check up) is definitely worth it, especially for checking his sight as suggested. If you suspect ulcers deep down and the vet doesn't concur then there are products such as Egusin you could try... none of them are cheap though.
It may be a bit of a detective mission with a few factors involved, observing him closely and trying to think of all possible factors he sees as worrying might reveal some pointers.

HTH a bit.
 
That's great thanks tho I but short on arenas now as I stopped riding him in the out door cause he got so stressed and wound up it just wasn't worth it and started riding him in the indoor now I have to say it did work and he was starting to get a lot better but this spooking has started again, I used to give him the magnesium I think I might start that again, the yard is busy but not nosey just the normal nosies stable doors being closed wheel barrows being emptied car doors that sort of thing . He is always with the sane horses in his stable block , while being ridden and summer turnout , turnout in the winter is a different matter as the ground at my yard can become very wet we can't turn them out so I have a field I take him to but one of his stable mates always goes to so he isn't on his own , ulsers and gut upsets are there any other signs for these apart from anxiety ?
 
I spent last year getting my 4yo out and about to shows and clinics, hiring schools etc to let him see a bit and 'grow up'.
I appreciate that yours is probably not ready for this, but once you have clarified that his sight is not a problem, you might find the 'safety routine' that I drew up with my trainer useful - we deployed this at home if he was feeling fresh or spooky, or if the scenery had changed (it's a new yard so we have had pretty much constant building work going on around the school for the past two years!)

I would lunge or round pen him before riding if he'd had a day off or had only done quiet work the day before so that he wasn't too fresh.

When mounted, we'd move off pretty quickly into trot and just work in the centre of the school on a smallish circle until he settled - not asking anything of him, no outline etc, just a steady rhythmic trot going where he was asked to. I'd use a figure of eight if he was especially sharp. Once settled, we'd go onto bigger circles, gradually moving closer to anything scary (which could range from a load of blocks delivered the night before to a digger stationary or moving!) and then large round the school. Then he was ready for a canter, a little rest, and then a tiny bit of work on something specific before finishing.

Hacking was always reserved as a 'treat' after doing some work in the school - hacking a fresh, spooky baby is not my idea of fun!

They can get a bit anxious, especially if you are teaching them something new, and you have to accept that they will have bad and good days.

Some horses are naturally spookier than others, but making him feel safe and that he trusts you will definitely help. Good luck!
 
If you decide it is a confidence thing, then there are several approaches around that can help and some courses which teach this. They are all based on getting you horse more confident - and more curious than scared about new things. I think strong riders naturally give their horses this confidence, but if you are having problems then it may help to analyse how this happens and how you can change to help your horses confidence.

Where are you based? PM me if you want details of people I know who teach this approach!
 
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That's great thank you ill try that :) hacking Oscar is not my idea of fun either charging down a hill because I fly is near him is not good. One thing I never mentioned was when Oscar was at his worst nervous wise he did a spook so bad he got me of and crushed every bone in my knee and I now have a lot of metal holding it all together which makes it very difficult to use that leg properly
 
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