Horse turned violently aggressive. Worried

Perfect_Pirouette

Perfect_Pirouette

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Got a phone call last week from G's owner to inform me that he was being 'expelled' from the equestrian college he's at for bad behaivour.

He is notorious for being Jeckle and Hyde. Dope on a rope dobbin in Spring/Summer and horrible in the winter. He gets these winter moods and is aggressive when being groomed, rugged etc. Owner has had him 7 years and he has always been like it. Anyway, we've always coped fine, you just have to be firm and let him know you won't take any shi%e and he backs down. He's all talk, filthy looks, lays ears back, threatens to barge you, bite you etc but never actually DOES IT.

Anyway, owner and I just thought college obviously couldn't cope with him, fair enough. Owner went to pick him up yesterday morning, I got a phone call from her yesterday lunchtime and she was pretty upset. Apparently it's MUCH, MUCH worse than we thought. He was like a wild animal apparently. She managed to get him home (back to old yard) but once he was home, a member of staff went to go into his stable to give him a haynet and he attacked them, bit them very badly. Owner then went to go into stable and he pinned her up against the wall.

I agreed to go and see him yesterday afternoon and when I did it broke my heart :( He has signs all around his stable saying warning this horse is dangerous, no people allowed to go in except staff. There were then 2 members of staff attempting to give him some more water, carrying a whip. He looked really, seriously angry and looked like he was about to lunge for them, they quickly put the bucket in and slammed door shut.

I then went over to his stable, he pricked his ears and was looking at me whilst munching his hay. He came over to the door and I was stroking him and he was fine.

After I left, my friend texted me about an hour or 2 later to say she'd walked past his stable with a wheelbarrow and he lunged at her over the door, grabbed her arm and bit her.

Owner is getting vet out. I am just so sad and worried. This is not my G. He isn't like this and I'm really worried it'll turn out to be a brain tumour or something :( He is my best friend in the entire world, I love him so much and just want him to be okay. He doesn't deserve to be quarantined off :( But he IS being dangerous and I know they need to do what they need to do to protect themselves.

I left G officially 6 months ago and am now loaning this dressage mare, but I think I am going to have to put her on hold over the couple of weeks and make him my priority, at least until we find out what's going on :(

Has anyone else known a horse to suddenly just become aggressive like this??

Owner is getting vet out early this week, who will hopefully find something physical. I should add that he is FINE ridden, absolutely 100% as normal. It just seems to be around the stable he's become aggressive.
 
Poor boy, it sounds like he has not been treated very well at the college, the people were probably scared of him and his behaviour has become worse due to this. Many horses will become this way if they do not have consistent care and knowledgeable people handling them they just spiral out of control.
He has probably not been turned out much, could he be turned away for the rest of the winter and see how he is when he comes back in the spring, hopefully some careful handling will see the old character return.
 
I don't know any horse that has done that, but am in a somewhat similar situation. We recently brought our mare home from a college because she just wasn't happy, and was having a lot of people off. She's been okay so far, but I haven't got on her yet. When we went to see her she was quite grumpy while she was there. Some horses like one on one, and can't handle many people doing everything with them. They told us of another horse they were selling because he had just become so sick of it that he was starting to kick students and be very agressive. I don't know your horse or what his past management has been like but maybe he just needs that one on one. From the sound of when you went to see him it certainly seems like that may be a part of it as he was so pleased to see you.
 
My first thoughts would be to turn him out. Horses do get cross and grumpy when in for so long, fresh air and space will probably do him good.
Horses in a college environment often get narky, lets face it, X,Y and Z do them, there is little consistancey, they get ridden daily, and are not allowed to just chill. Everyone comes and goes day in day out. I'd get pissed if people kept walking up and down past my front door!!

But, hope you can get to the bottom of the problem. Sounds like he just needs you and you only!?
 
be positive said:
Poor boy, it sounds like he has not been treated very well at the college, the people were probably scared of him and his behaviour has become worse due to this. Many horses will become this way if they do not have consistent care and knowledgeable people handling them they just spiral out of control.
He has probably not been turned out much, could he be turned away for the rest of the winter and see how he is when he comes back in the spring, hopefully some careful handling will see the old character return.
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The college is wonderful, people very competent etc. But no, they are not allowed to discipline (i.e hit) the horses for obvious reasons so it COULD be that he has just gotten used to taking the P and has got worse?

I'm not condoning hitting horses btw, but with G he does need a slap and firm word if he starts getting out of line.

I personally think this change is too big for it to be purely behaivoural. I do think something physical could be wrong. Someone has suggested ulcers, which would be worse in the winter??
 
If he has always had a tendency to be like this I would think it's more likely to have been exaggerated by being at College.
He would have been in 24/7, handled by lots of different people and maybe he started to feel really insecure and worried, away from home, shut in, none of his familiar people around, strange routine ect ect.
Can he not be turned out more now he's home! I think he needs to get back into a good routine with lots of turnout and the same person handling him until he starts to settle again :).
 
Ulcers are worse in winter if he is out in the summer because he would have food in his stomach all the time in summer, but not when he is stabled in winter.

I would also scope for ulcers, but I would also try Vitamin D. Deficiency causes SAD depression in humans. It will only take one day for it to show - give him 10 human's vitamin D tablets and see if it helps.
 
I would bet he is in pain! Has he ever been scoped for ulcers? My WB was EXACTLY like this when I got him. He would lunge at you over the door he always tried to bite you when handling or kick you. Then he started striking with his front legs. He was so dangerous he was nearly pts.
This is NOT normal horse behaviour, do not let anyone tell you otherwise. My horse was scoped with low grade ulcers, but we know there had to be more to this. He became better humoured when turned out on grass in May - I now know he is sugar and cereal intolerant so he was probably very gutty all winter and in discomfort. Mine was then diagnosed woth chronic sacro illiac dysfunction which meant he had been in constant pain hence the aggressive temperament. He is so much nicer now. I get the very occasional ears shot back, but no biting lunging, threatening or kicking.

Look for a cause - I personally would change his diet first to exclude cereal sugar and feed hay no haylage. ALso feed some magnesium oxide which he could be lacking - that is cheap to buy online as a straight supplement. My horse is fed Allen & Page sugar and cereal inolerant feed and carob (locust bean, which is sweet but contains no sugar) and micronized linseed and adlib hay - that is all good for gut health. My horse hated rugs with a passion and was always girthy. Is this horse like that? This would point to ulcers and a sore gut. Good luck hope this helps :)
 
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festivefirewell said:
If he has always had a tendency to be like this I would think it's more likely to have been exaggerated by being at College.
He would have been in 24/7, handled by lots of different people and maybe he started to feel really insecure and worried, away from home, shut in, none of his familiar people around, strange routine ect ect.
Can he not be turned out more now he's home! I think he needs to get back into a good routine with lots of turnout and the same person handling him until he starts to settle again :).
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Yes, he will now be back to 7 hours turnout a day etc. As far as familiarity and consistency goes, yes that is what he needs. We will try and provide it as much as possible but owner will now be looking for someone to full loan him at present yard or a sharer for him as she has another horse now too and just does not have time for 2. I will help out until the new year (which means between him and dressage mare I will have no life, but it can't be helped) and hopefully in a few weeks he'll have settled back down again and a sharer would be able to cope.

Whatever happens, he is now back home for good so hopefully he'll settle again.
 
You know him well and it could be a sign of ulcers, limited turnout and possibly restricted forage would obviously contribute to this, however if he is a bit inclined to be grumpy someone rushing in and having to throw food at him etc can certainly make things worse.

He needs, I would think one to one with a confident but firm person, possibly a headcollar left on and ready tied rope so that every time you need to do anything he can be clipped onto a rope before you really enter his box, this will help keep him feeling secure and those dealing with him safer.

He will hopefully come round with some help.
 
SummerxStarsx said:
YES!! THIS THIS THIS ^^^
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I would get him scoped in that case. Scoping is not the expensive part - it's the Gastrogard that follows at £30 a tube! BUT there is no other way to get rid of ulcers. If you do go ahead and he is treated, do PM me for a follow up herbal treatment my holistic vet recommended. This is because Gastrogard is so harsh - it stops the stomach acid pumps allowing the ulcers to heal (should be fed with sucralfrate at the same time too) and so it allows undigested food to pass through the hindgut - this in turn kills off the hindgut fauna/bacteria so to reestablish that you have to intervene afterward and she gave me the herbal remedy to use to fix this. :)
 
Agree with others.... get him scoped.

I would like to say that not all colleges keep horses locked up 24 / 7, starve them, make them work 5 hours a day and have them poked and prodded all day long.
 
G DID get turned out at the college, albeit just not as much as he gets at home. He certainly wasn't beaten or starved I must stress!

This post is NOT about the college, its asking for help re this horses behaviour. The college is brilliant, experienced, competent people, fantastic facilities. G was treated like a king but maybe the college environment isn't the right one for him I don't know, I'm not worried about that at this moment and neither is the owner. We just want to get to the bottom of this behaivour
 
SummerxStarsx said:
G DID get turned out at the college, albeit just not as much as he gets at home. He certainly wasn't beaten or starved I must stress!

This post is NOT about the college, its asking for help re this horses behaviour. The college is brilliant, experienced, competent people, fantastic facilities. G was treated like a king but maybe the college environment isn't the right one for him I don't know, I'm not worried about that at this moment and neither is the owner. We just want to get to the bottom of this behaivour
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I didn't read your OP as an attack on the college, I'm sure others don't either. Some responses seemed to blame the college.
I work on a college yard and our horses want for nothing, each horse have their individual needs met and are cared for like they are our own.
Some horses do not take well to the environment and prefer one to one contact. Some horses also take the pee because they can with students:rolleyes:

I got a bit defensive sorry for de - railing the thread. It must be horrible for you to see G as he is at the moment. IMO it must be pain related, combined with the fact that he has got away with it at the college.
 
When I had the physio out to my horse, she suspected he may have ulcers and suggested that I try a weeks treatment of coligone and see if I notice any change in him. It's not for long term use but a weeks course would have made him feel better *if* he had ulcers and if I'd noticed a change I would have had him scoped.

But I would give your horse a couple of weeks to settle in before you did this so you'd be able to differentiate the effect of him being back home from the effects of the coligone (if any).

To add: I did this as he was a stressy horse and I didn't want to put him through the ordeal of being scoped (fasting and transport to vets) so soon after I'd bought him without good reason. As it turns out, the coligone made no difference and when I raised the issue with the vet she didn't think his behaviour was consistent with ulcers anyway.
 
I would say def have him scoped for ulcers.

I know the college where G was, the horses are treated very well, they have ad lib forage, some turnout and are not overworked. The yard has some very knowlegable and competant yard staff as well as the students. They have a number of 'quirky' horses there, including one of mine. The horses have an excellent routine and want for nothing.

It may just be that G needs a little more 'discipline' than he was getting but I would eliminate all pain issues first.
 
Would definitely turnout as much as possible, put on forage diet and get him checked for pain. You can get omeprazole online (main ingredient of gastrogard), have known this to be helpful in a few cases where vets were unwilling to scope. Improvement = ulcers present.

Also there may be a behavioural element, I'd work on his manners outside the stable first, so he realises he gets lots of praise for doing things right, then work on the manners in the stable. Woudl help if only 1-2 people are handling him. Ideal would be to have him turned out full time and gradually reintroduce him to the stable, but you'll have to do what is practical and "normal" for him.

Hope you get to the bottom of it, good luck.

EMMC
 
I have just taken on a 'quirky' mare. Known to bit and kick people and horses (and yes I did still take it on knowing this :) ) I wasn't quite filled in fully as to the extent of her behavour but soon found out when she kicked my farrier in the head with her front legs which was enough to cut his head open!
I of course gave her a clout and then worried with bahavour like that she would be better off PTS.
I tracked down her previous owner that new her for 10yrs he said she was a lovely mare, sweet natured, kind and loving. He didn't recognise the horse I was describing. The fact I found out what Maggie use to be like made me persever. She had been with a lovely lady for the last year (iv had her about 3 weeks) so I have no idea why she has turned nasty as I couldn't see a reason for it. However my point is, she is a different horse, she is very affectionate and a lovely horse to handle in just 3 weeks! She is now acting as her previous long term owner described her. I think sometimes just certain circumstances don't suit certain horses. I was very careful and did stop anyone other than me handling or entering maggies stable but now my mum and dad have started doing little bits.

If I went to tell Maggie off she ran to the back of the stable in panic so instead I used just a firm voice and lots and lots of praise when she was behaving. It's still very early days for us but we are making huge progress and I really hope you have the same luck. Give him time. You may just find he settles in again being back home.
 
Christmas Crackers said:
My first thoughts would be to turn him out. Horses do get cross and grumpy when in for so long, fresh air and space will probably do him good.
Horses in a college environment often get narky, lets face it, X,Y and Z do them, there is little consistancey, they get ridden daily, and are not allowed to just chill. Everyone comes and goes day in day out. I'd get pissed if people kept walking up and down past my front door!!

But, hope you can get to the bottom of the problem. Sounds like he just needs you and you only!?
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Ditto this. I'd definately turn him out for a few days and see if his behaviour improves. Certainly worth a shot anyway. Am pretty certain my lovely horse would turn pretty mean if he was kept in a lot.
 
Reference ulcers - they may be the end result but its also interesting to look at the cause

Big yards are busy, there is always something going on and lots of noise. Some horses thrive in this environment, and need lots to keep them occupied. Others hate this type of environment and will manifest stable vices as a result, and the vices are often the cause of the ulcers

A polo pony I took on apparently weaves, but as she is not stabled and now lives in a quiet herd with nothing going on externally (they see humans twice a day!!) absolutely no vices are shown.

However it also means my homebreds have lead a sheltered live and simply aren't used to seeing lots of people and horse. I'm sure some will cope, whilst others will find it too much of a culture shock.

I would turn this horse out and move to the quietest stable with least traffic (horse or human) going past and see if they chill out.
 
I would throw him out in a field - preferably 24/7 - with a big bale of haylage and just let him chill. I did this with a problem mare who I believed had ulcers (but owners did't want to spend any more money on her). Within 6 weeks she was a different horse! Constant tricle feeding with a forage only diet is THE best treastment for ulcers (and relatively cheap!) If there's no change in 6 weeks, then I'd start looking for other causes.
 
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