Horsebox Shopping - what do you think of these boxes?

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dressage_diva

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I'm looking to buy my first horsebox and have come across two boxes I like the look of, but wondered if I could get some more experienced people on here to give me their thoughts on them? If I do decide to proceed with either of them I'll be going to view it with a reputable mechanic and will give it a good going over, but I don't want to be going to see boxes that are definitely going to be no-go's. So here are the two I've found

1. http://www.horsedeals.co.uk/horsebo...ale/Ascot-Supreme-2-Horsebox__17-11-10-483832
Am tempted by this one as it's not far from where I live. My only concern is it looks quite small? The seller says that it can take two large horses comfortable and still be under weight (but they couldn't confirm the dimensions, the max laden or unladen weight of the box and doesn't have a weight certificate which I was a bit concerned with). The horse area looks in good condition though and I can get the full service history of the lorry which is good. Do you think it's worth taking a look at?

2. http://www.kshorseboxes.co.uk/index.php?pID=13&cID=300
I *really* like this box. The owner (who's selling it via K&S horseboxes) has sent me lots more photos, information and a copy of the weight certificate. The living is nothing fancy but the horse stalls look really light and airy (no tack lockers taking up space). I don't know much about sizes though, so would appreciate people's thoughts on the dimensions:
Overall length 6.8 metres
Light and airy horse area 2.4 x 2.8
Unladen Weight is 5.4t and it's a 7.5t lorry so that should give me plenty of payload to carry two horses, passengers and equipments right? Would appreciate your thoughts on this box as unfortunately it's currently in North Wales and I live in South England so only want to go and look at it if I think it's a good move.

Ooo just seen another 2 possibilities, but not done any research into these two:
http://www.horsedeals.co.uk/horsebo...s-3-Horse-Solitaire-Horsebox__23-11-10-275874

http://www.horsedeals.co.uk/horsebo...Iveco-Box-Only--21-00-NO-VAT__24-11-10-212946 (but have heard bad things about Ivecos and it's more than I wanted to pay?)

If anyone else is bored in the snow and fancies looking around online for more boxes for me then feel free to post ideas! Am looking for minimum 2stalls, sideways/herringbone, around £15k (max £20k really), must have enough payload (driver has HGV licence). Oh and I'm based in Oxfordshire, so any that are vaguely near there/South of England are best! Thanks
 
Based simply on the reputation of the builders (as far as I am aware, apologies if I am considered to be wrong) I would go for the Ascot or the Solitaire. As long as the latter comes in under weight you are getting a lot more box for your money and even though you don't want to carry three having a third partition to carry hay etc is always handy. A box like that would be easier to sell than one over 3.5t but that can't carry 3 ponies or two horses and a bit of kit. All with the caveat that it needs to come in under weight.

The second box in Wales is not what I would consider coachbuilt and "appears" to be a conversion as you can see where the luton joins on. Boxes of that type, ie containers that have not been purpose built and adapted instead are always worth less and some people (me included) steer clear of them.
 
I've got an identical Solitaire horsebox, unladen but with full water and diesel it comes in at 6.1tonnes, which is fine for me as I only ever take one horse to shows (I 'upgraded' as I wanted better living for weekends away at shows). So if you're wanting to carry 2 large horses and kit you may be a bit close to max weight??
Apart from that I'm really pleased with my lorry, and its been very comfortable to stay away in!!!
 
Have had a quick peek at horsemart, and have come across LOADS that seem to vaiguely fit your bill. Sorry, didnt take into account where they are, so may be wrong end of the country, but here are a few (or maybe more than a few!)

http://www.horsemart.co.uk/horsebox_carries_1_stall_2003_reg_with_living_essex/advert/134800
http://www.horsemart.co.uk/horsebox_carries_2_stalls_2002_reg_with_living_essex/advert/100550
http://www.horsemart.co.uk/horsebox_carries_3_stalls_2002_reg_with_living_essex/advert/100543
http://www.horsemart.co.uk/horsebox_carries_3_stalls_with_living_suffolk/advert/118785
http://www.horsemart.co.uk/horsebox_carries_3_stalls_s_reg_with_living_avon/advert/131282
http://www.horsemart.co.uk/horsebox_carries_3_stalls_p_reg_with_living_worcestershire/advert/131038
http://www.horsemart.co.uk/horsebox_carries_3_stalls_y_reg_with_living_worcestershire/advert/131032
http://www.horsemart.co.uk/horsebox_carries_3_stalls_1999_reg_with_living_essex/advert/110705
http://www.horsemart.co.uk/horsebox_carries_3_stalls_v_reg_with_living_suffolk/advert/134577
http://www.horsemart.co.uk/horsebox_carries_3_stalls_s_reg_with_living_staffordshire/advert/134994
http://www.horsemart.co.uk/horsebox_carries_3_stalls_1998_reg_with_living_essex/advert/125318
http://www.horsemart.co.uk/horsebox_carries_3_stalls_k_reg_with_living_nottinghamshire/advert/131062
http://www.horsemart.co.uk/horsebox_carries_3_stalls_p_reg_with_living_worcestershire/advert/131034
http://www.horsemart.co.uk/horsebox_carries_2_stalls_j_reg_with_living_nottinghamshire/advert/131852
http://www.horsemart.co.uk/horsebox_carries_3_stalls_m_reg_with_living_devon/advert/135554
http://www.horsemart.co.uk/horsebox_carries_3_stalls_j_reg_with_living_cleveland/advert/137185

Sorry for the humungous list - i love looking for lorries/horses with a healthy budget :D
 
The solitaire sounds and looks horribly heavy,stalled for 3 but probably can only carry an anorexic shetland. The last one sounds way over priced. Till a mechanic looks at what lies beneath the glitter ,it is impossible to say which looks good. So go and see which you like ,then send a really good mechanic along.
 
As the ascot one is close to you and you seem to like it go and have a look. Take your tape measure and find out where the nearest weighbridge is. If you still like the lorry when you see it take a test drive to the weighbridge, that way you know how much fuel was onboard, that all the partitions etc were in it and that the driver and/or passengers remained on board when it was weighed.

I would imagine that as it is a compact lorry on a 7.5t chassis it should be within weight and have capacity to carry the number of horses it is stalled for, the only fool proof way to check though is weigh it.

It is only much more recently that people have become (and rightly so) concerned and far far more aware of weights of lorries etc hence many those built a few years ago were never put on a weigh bridge hence no certificates. It is not expensive at all to get a weight certificate, I think it cost me under £10 earlier this year. My lorry has a 20' container stalled for 3.5, pretty basic living and was weighed with a full tank of fuel, full tank of water (180 ltrs!), me and the generator, I will be able to carry two horses and their gear but would be very very close if not over the 7.5t with three on even if I ditched the generator, water and had minimum fuel. Most of the older built (and still many of the new builds) whilst being stalled for 3 or 4 could not legally carry that number of horses.
 
measles said:
Based simply on the reputation of the builders (as far as I am aware, apologies if I am considered to be wrong) I would go for the Ascot or the Solitaire. As long as the latter comes in under weight you are getting a lot more box for your money and even though you don't want to carry three having a third partition to carry hay etc is always handy. A box like that would be easier to sell than one over 3.5t but that can't carry 3 ponies or two horses and a bit of kit. All with the caveat that it needs to come in under weight.

The second box in Wales is not what I would consider coachbuilt and "appears" to be a conversion as you can see where the luton joins on. Boxes of that type, ie containers that have not been purpose built and adapted instead are always worth less and some people (me included) steer clear of them.
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Its funny what people think and the I would say the box in wales is the best of the bunch as it is a recent build and has a tilt cab, isnt long so should be a sensible weight.. the others look like nice boxes but I would'nt touch anything without a tilt cab its too much of a risk,as any problem costs much more for labour and people who build non tilt 7.5 ton lorrys are rogues as are selling something that cannot easly be maintained and or repaired so you would wonder
what other corners they have cut...
 
Having had a Solitaire I personnally wouldn't touch with the proverbial barge pole as ours caused nothing but trouble. It is fairly lightweight but this can then cause other issues as the build is not as strong!
 
perfect11s said:
Its funny what people think and the I would say the box in wales is the best of the bunch as it is a recent build and has a tilt cab, isnt long so should be a sensible weight.. the others look like nice boxes but I would'nt touch anything without a tilt cab its too much of a risk,as any problem costs much more for labour and people who build non tilt 7.5 ton lorrys are rogues as are selling something that cannot easly be maintained and or repaired so you would wonder
what other corners they have cut...
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It is indeed funny what people think :). I have a great quality 7.5t which doesn't have a tilt cab and it has never caused a problem and my mechanic is happy to work on it without charging excessively. It is the 3rd lorry we've had - none have had a tilt cab and none have had a problem.

I have no doubt that others have had boxes with fixed cabs and it has caused them an issue but likewise I know people with tilt cabs that leak. It all comes down to personal preference and overall build quality. It is a fact however that coachbuilt boxes, ie those with bodies built from scratch as horseboxes, hold their value better.
 
perfect11s said:
Its funny what people think and the I would say the box in wales is the best of the bunch as it is a recent build and has a tilt cab, isnt long so should be a sensible weight.. the others look like nice boxes but I would'nt touch anything without a tilt cab its too much of a risk,as any problem costs much more for labour and people who build non tilt 7.5 ton lorrys are rogues as are selling something that cannot easly be maintained and or repaired so you would wonder
what other corners they have cut...
Click to expand...

Have been told to steer clear of tilt cabs because they leak and usually engines can be accessed in a non tilt cab if it is a good build. I like the look of the solitaire and ascot they both look nice lorries in good condition from good coachbuilders. Check the weight of the solitaire as the one I know is only 5.2 unladen and so it easily takes two horses and equipment. Personally I wouldn't touch the other two with a barge pole, the first is a cowboy build (e.g. look at the height of the luton!!) and the second one is only half finished so would cost you alot more and I don't like the horse area, I would hope that that too was only half finished...
 
Sarah_Jane said:
Having had a Solitaire I personnally wouldn't touch with the proverbial barge pole as ours caused nothing but trouble. It is fairly lightweight but this can then cause other issues as the build is not as strong!
Click to expand...

Was this one of their newer ones though? have heard that their older ones such as the one advertised are good solid boxes while the new ones aren't as good.
 
I would say that the Ascot for its year is massively over priced! My dad had an Ascot and it wasn't that robust or high quality build. as such I would prefer the one in wales. Considering your budget I would try to get as post 2000 chassis as the newer they are the more your box will keep its value and hopefully less maintenance. With a budget the same of yours i found a new build box on at 2001 chassis 3 large horses (unladen weight 5.1 tonnes) with an unfitted living and so far it has not had any problems. I did shop around for a bit though...
 
measles said:
It is indeed funny what people think :). I have a great quality 7.5t which doesn't have a tilt cab and it has never caused a problem and my mechanic is happy to work on it without charging excessively. It is the 3rd lorry we've had - none have had a tilt cab and none have had a problem.

I have no doubt that others have had boxes with fixed cabs and it has caused them an issue but likewise I know people with tilt cabs that leak. It all comes down to personal preference and overall build quality. It is a fact however that coachbuilt boxes, ie those with bodies built from scratch as horseboxes, hold their value better.
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Every lorry body is coachbuilt to suit the job it was bought to do!! it just might happen to have been built as a horsebox sadly the quality of horseboxes varies greatly,so a ground up build could be a death trap and a converted dry freight box converted into a horsebox could be very good strong and long lasting , and fine you have been very lucky with your non tilts there are many people who have had major expense getting them repaired one on this forum had a engine fail and possibly wont have much change out of 5k for a engine and fitting about 2.5k extra to unpick the cab and refit for what is a simple job when the cab tilts, the chassis manufactura makes the cab tilt for a reason only a idiot or conman would perminantly fix it down......
 
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If the manufacturer designed the cab to tilt easily ,he did it for a good reason and I would invite you to change a fan belt on a Leyland roadrunner 7.5 tonner without tilting the cab . Belt breaks on the road, you will have to be towed home because a two minute job just became a half day job(or more).
 
perfect11s said:
I just dont want to see people get ripped off and ending up with problems... life is difficult enough...
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And some of those problems could kill you and your horse. Have just returned a customers a recent purchase to them after having BOLTED THE BODY TO THE CHASSIS. It also passed a ministry test like that! The sad thing was that the previous owner also thought it was safe ,having trusted his local cowboy fitter. Perfect 11,s we fight a loosing battle here. We tell them how it is and they just dont believe us.
 
Mike007 said:
And some of those problems could kill you and your horse. Have just returned a customers a recent purchase to them after having BOLTED THE BODY TO THE CHASSIS. It also passed a ministry test like that! The sad thing was that the previous owner also thought it was safe ,having trusted his local cowboy fitter. Perfect 11,s we fight a loosing battle here. We tell them how it is and they just dont believe us.
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I feel quite postive to be honest, most horse people are savy and understand things like tilt cabs, weight and the other isues and can see through the bull that sellers come out with like "Our mecanic can work on it there is access to the engine from the living" and oh I know it is ok to travel 3 there is no need to take it to a weighbridge!!!!
 
The ascot is BB's on here's lorry. She will have taken 2 large horses in it. May be worth PMing her. Having seen it in the flesh, it is a lovely lorry.
 
Squeak said:
Have been told to steer clear of tilt cabs because they leak and usually engines can be accessed in a non tilt cab if it is a good build.
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Well that's not true - every part of my lorry leaked apart from the tilt flap!! :D
(now solved, but damn annoying)!

Plus I wanted to use a mobile mechanic, and if it didn't tilt you have to go to a ramp or pit and it will take more time. Jobs are difficult enough when you can get to the bits in the first place. You wouldn't buy a car with a welded shut bonnet!!

I think with the ascot and solitare you are getting old trucks with a brand, on the other hand brands hold their money.

Plus the ascot means if its a dud you can moan on here to owner!!! :p
 
My lorry has a tilt cab and its never leaked - as long as they are re-sealed properly after ''tilting'' there should be no problem with leaking. We recently had to fork out 2k to get the deisel pump changed and had our lorry not been tilt cab it wouldve cost us over 4k to have done. Think I would rather go with a tilit cab!!

I do however have an Iveco and would not recommend them to anyone, unfortunately when we got the lorry we didnt realise how unreliable they were. We have spent an absolute fortune on repairs for it - probably in excess of 7k and we've had it about 5years. We have also had a lot of other ''cosmetic'' work done it as i used to do a lot of competing away so it is now totally at our spec hence we would never sell it as have spent so much on it!!

My theory was that we have spent so much on repairs that nothing else can go wrong. However its now sat on the yard after failing to start 2 days after it had come back from the garage after having MORE repairs. Now its going to stay where it is, not fixed, until the summer as i've had enough of it!
 
Hmm there are a LOT of people on here who seem to have problems with ivecos! And I know a few in RL who have also had multiple ongoing problems....
Not much to add apart from I personally wouldn't buy one without a tilt cab.
 
Thanks everyone for your helpful comments - I'm going to reply to various people's comments this evening when I'm home from work and the yard! I'll also start ploughing through the suggested links someone put up of other boxes for sale!

KatB said:
The ascot is BB's on here's lorry. She will have taken 2 large horses in it. May be worth PMing her. Having seen it in the flesh, it is a lovely lorry.
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Thanks, have already been in contact with her via email several times! Unfortunately we're not both free at the same time this weekend so can't go and see it this weekend and my OH (who will be the driver!) is away until nxt week, so the earliest I'll be looking at it will be next weekend (11-12th) - I work FT and I'd rather see it in the light than in the dark after work!
 
I think there are alot of Ivecos as horse boxes and a lot on the road as working lorrys so maybe that accounts for seeming that they have alot of problems perhaps?
However the brake system is horrid on them and expensive to fix but apart from that rust and the odd electrical issue they arnt too bad!!! my pick DAF, MAN or Mercedes..
 
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Friends of mine paid three times for their l reg iveco what I paid for my l reg merc. They have now spent over 10k on repairs, and spent a total of over 24 hours (sad that they had time to work this out!) on the sides of roads waiting for repair men.... Most notably a 5 hour stint on side of m25 when two different repair guys couldn't get it started....
Have to say their experiences plus Reading about tempi and kerrilli on here (believe hers also an iveco) is enough to have put me off. My merc is yet to fail us in that amount of time.
 
Just to add to the tilt can/not tilt cab. Mine as many of the older boxes does not have a tilt cab. We have had it regularly serviced and sorted without a problem. Yes it is a bit more tricky (as the garage tells me) but they don't charge me extra..Like others have and will remark, some tilt cabs have there own problems - leaking being one - and I went to see one recently and asked how it tilted and was told that there was no way you would tilt it unless you needed a new engine ... so I guess it just depends on the box and your mechanics.

I have been looking for a new box for a while and it really is a mine field out there... price is no indication of condition or quality .. and many of the pictures that accompany the adverts are ones taken at the time of the conversion (I now ask as my first question!) so X years of use will produce a slightly different looking box!!

Its a real case of BUYER BEWARE - just make sure you take a close look at build quality and if its a new paint job remeber - that may cover a multitude of sins!

Good Luck...
 
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