Horselyx

[alainax]

I read an interesting article about the common misconception that sugar is evil for horses. About how it was ridiculous to compare their diet with ours and banning all sugar had a detrimental effect. I'll try and find it, it was enlightening!

 

[FfionWinnie]

I read an interesting article about the common misconception that sugar is evil for horses. About how it was ridiculous to compare their diet with ours and banning all sugar had a detrimental effect. I'll try and find it, it was enlightening!

Did HGA or horslyx write it?

You can see what "detrimental" effects a low sugar and starch diet is having to my horse. Physio commented she treats top event horses which are not in such perfect physical condition as she.

She does not even graze grass. This regime is saving her life.

70-100kms per week on rough stone tracks and tarmac.

 

[TGM]

I read an interesting article about the common misconception that sugar is evil for horses. About how it was ridiculous to compare their diet with ours and banning all sugar had a detrimental effect. I'll try and find it, it was enlightening!

You can't eliminate sugar from a horse's diet because it is naturally present in grass and hay which horses need to eat. However, considering some horses can actually get laminitis from the sugar levels in grass and hay alone, why would you then want to add additional quantities of sugar to the diet when it is not necessary?

 

[Red-1]

I read an interesting article about the common misconception that sugar is evil for horses. About how it was ridiculous to compare their diet with ours and banning all sugar had a detrimental effect. I'll try and find it, it was enlightening!

I have learned most about horse diets since having mine barefoot. It is interesting how sugar, wormers and carbs can show in the feet really quickly.

 

[alainax]

Did HGA or horslyx write it?

That's a bit mean... I'm not as daft as I look

No it was in a magazine, seemed well balanced, was trying to debunk the myth. I can't remember who wrote it, but I'll keep searching for it. It was well written though and made a lot of sense about when humans try to compare and attribute human needs to that of equines.

 

[TGM]

That's a bit mean... I'm not as daft as I look

was trying to debunk the myth.

What myth? That high sugar diets can cause laminitis?

 

[Theocat]

What myth? That high sugar diets can cause laminitis?

The myth that sugar is bad full stop and the holy grail should be total elimination from the diet.

 

[ILuvCowparsely]

You have posted many times in the past on threads about Horslyx and similar sugary licks how you feed them to your horses, how they get covered in molasses and how quickly they devour them. And how it makes you feel like 'a caring mummy' to provide them for your horses.

I have to agree with be positive, I find it alarming that anyone should actively promote the use of these sugary licks on the forum, let alone someone who has already lost one horse to laminitis and so should be fully aware of the risks.

You said it in the first line the past!!!!
OP asked about the sugar content and I found and quote the website Q&A in case they had not seen it.

The incident you are on about was back in July when my new mare had drivels of an old one which was left behind by a livery. There is no plan to buy or to give mine or any livery one of these licks.
That does not mean I am for or against and like most things once in a blue moon and sticking to the desire dose is ok should you choose to give it. To much of anything is bad or when you over dose but a quick lick every now and then should not cause problems IF you buy one. Now less of the personal attack on me and stick to the topic in hand.

MY mares Laminitis was nothing to do with sugary licks I advise you don't drag her demise her up

 

[FfionWinnie]

The myth that sugar is bad full stop and the holy grail should be total elimination from the diet.

Total elimination is a far cry from the suggestion you don't feed your horse pointless sugary crap.

 

[TGM]

The myth that sugar is bad full stop and the holy grail should be total elimination from the diet.

I don't think anyone on this thread has said that sugar should totally be eliminated from the horses diet, only that is makes sense not to feed very high sugar products on top of the sugar that the horse will naturally be receiving from grass and hay.

 

[TGM]

You said it in the first line the past!!!!
OP asked about the sugar content and I found and quote the website Q&A in case they had not seen it.

The incident you are on about was back in July when my new mare had drivels of an old one which was left behind by a livery. There is no plan to buy or to give mine or any livery one of these licks.
That does not mean I am for or against and like most things once in a blue moon and sticking to the desire dose is ok should you choose to give it. To much of anything is bad or when you over dose but a quick lick every now and then should not cause problems IF you buy one. Now less of the personal attack on me and stick to the topic in hand.

MY mares Laminitis was nothing to do with sugary licks I advise you don't drag her demise her up

I was sticking very much to the topic at hand, and I am afraid I feel very strongly about laminitis. My husband is a farrier and I often have to speak to customers who have been devastated after their horses have been diagnosed with laminitis, and often feel guilty that they didn't know the risks attached to some forms of feeding and management. Your first post on this thread made out there was no risk from these products apart from getting the horse getting covered in molasses. You then dismissed be positive's suggestion that these very high sugar licks may be a laminitis risk. There is enough confusion about diet and laminitis without people like you (who should know better) making out these things are not a risk. I don't want other people's horses to suffer due to people like you saying these are safe to leave in the stable. If my post makes save even one horse from suffering this terrible condition, then it's worth it!

 

[Equi]

How is your stallion demonstrating that he is bored - is he weaving or cribbing or such-like?

No he shows no vices or behaviours. I just assume stables are very boring.

Youll all be glad to know he has survived the night haha!

Also, there was no container - it says on it not to leave the container with the horse soooooooo...? I drilled a hole through it and tied it up on the wall.

 

[Equi]

Also i think everyones going a bit mad here. I'm not filling my horse with sugar food, fresh grass, sugary sweets. In fact, i choose food with as little as possible. I was asking about one little treat, the first ive ever bought, and if it would cause colic from licking (due to air etc) the horse has never had laminitis and i doubt a few licks of this treat now and then is going to founder him.

 

[only_me]

OP I gave my horse a paddock sized horsylx when he was in, purely as a nice thing for him to enjoy. He got it 24/7 and the only thing he suffered was 4 molasses covered legs & a nose
i suffered a molasses cheek once when he licked me.

Only time I took it away was when he had a cut on his front leg & I didn't want him getting molasses in it!

He lives out 24/7, when he has to come in he has ad lib hay & is fed low starch feed. The horsylx had no effect on him whatsoever.

OP I think it depends on if your pony has a high lami risk - my horse is 17h at at a very low risk, but if your minis are more sensitive then I'd only give it to them while mucking out etc.

 

[TGM]

Also i think everyones going a bit mad here. I'm not filling my horse with sugar food, fresh grass, sugary sweets. In fact, i choose food with as little as possible. I was asking about one little treat, the first ive ever bought, and if it would cause colic from licking (due to air etc) the horse has never had laminitis and i doubt a few licks of this treat now and then is going to founder him.

A few licks is not likely to be a problem, but if you were, for example, to leave it in the stable overnight and he was licking it pretty constantly, then yes he would ingest a lot of sugar. If, as you say, you purposely choose low sugar food for him, then giving him a highly sugared lick does seem rather at odds with the rest of your regime. The minerals and stuff in these licks can be easily found in other supplements without the added sugar and you say he has ad lib hay to munch on in the stable, so I really don't see why he needs anything else. As you've bought the thing now, it won't do much harm to let him have a couple of licks whilst you clip his ears, as you suggested. But to leave it in the stable overnight would not be a good idea if he licks it a lot, as you say he does.

Your original question was, is it safe to leave in the stable? Could it make him ill? So my answer is, personally, no I wouldn't leave one in the stable and yes, there is a possibility that prolonged use could make him ill with laminitis.

 

[Theocat]

Total elimination is a far cry from the suggestion you don't feed your horse pointless sugary crap.

I don't think anyone on this thread has said that sugar should totally be eliminated from the horses diet, only that is makes sense not to feed very high sugar products on top of the sugar that the horse will naturally be receiving from grass and hay.

I know that. I was trying to summarise the point alainax was making about the article.

 

[MrsNorris]

Did HGA or horslyx write it?

You can see what "detrimental" effects a low sugar and starch diet is having to my horse. Physio commented she treats top event horses which are not in such perfect physical condition as she.

She does not even graze grass. This regime is saving her life.

70-100kms per week on rough stone tracks and tarmac.

Just out of interest, do you supplement with vit E as your horse is not on pasture? Would like to try grass-free for my older, semi-retired EMS horse, but am a bit worried about vit E deficiency, EMND etc, and how effective supplementation is compared to fresh greens. Sorry to hijack, but I don't know anyone else with a grass-free horse, so wanted to pick your brains a bit.

 

[FfionWinnie]

Just out of interest, do you supplement with vit E as your horse is not on pasture? Would like to try grass-free for my older, semi-retired EMS horse, but am a bit worried about vit E deficiency, EMND etc, and how effective supplementation is compared to fresh greens. Sorry to hijack, but I don't know anyone else with a grass-free horse, so wanted to pick your brains a bit.

Yes I do, she has PSSM so natural vit e is very important for her muscles anyway. I use Equimins and feed 7500iu which is 7.5ml per day. The recommended rate for PSSM horses is 5-10000iu, and a lot of them are kept off grass in America. Don't know anyone else who does it in the UK. Along with adlib hay she gets 2kgs coolstance copra and 1.5kgs alfalfa pellets per day in two feeds. I've kept her like this for over a year now (was diagnosed 5 weeks after I bought her after a catastrophic tie up).

I'm actually planning to have her blood tested soon as she is the best she's ever been as I've now got the diet spot on and I want a baseline for the future (because they can become more symptomatic as they age).

Her turnout area is recycled type 1 and she has a shelter but lives out on it 24/7 very happily. I exercise her every day due to the PSSM and she is doing really well just now.

Good luck if you decide to try it!

 

[Magnetic Sparrow]

I bought a sugar-free hanging horse treat thing to put in the stable so that my horse isn't bored in the 10 minutes a night she isn't eating or asleep (she takes her responsibility to trickle feed extremely seriously). It obviously wasn't as attractive as the molassed kind as it lasted a couple of weeks, so I thought that was quite successful. I have a handheld Horselyx that I use to stop her fidgeting when she's bored during farrier visits, but I wouldn't use it as a constant thing mostly because of the extreme stickiness rather than any concern about laminitis.

 

[Gloi]

Don't give these to greedy cobs. Thought mine might like one for a treat when out in the worst of the winter weather. The beast just about finished a 15kg paddock sized lick overnight. No ill effects apart from being a bit loose the next day and being covered in molasses. Never again.

 

[Orca]

I don't use horselyx but I have used rockies (baby red, usually). It seems like the old style mineral block and lasts my mare (a greedy cob ) five to seven days and does seem to serve as a boredom breaker (yet not tasty enough or soft enough to be devoured in an hour!).

Rockies also do a lami lick, although I haven't had cause to use it and haven't researched what's in it, it might be of interest to others.

 

[be positive]

I don't use horselyx but I have used rockies (baby red, usually). It seems like the old style mineral block and lasts my mare (a greedy cob ) five to seven days and does seem to serve as a boredom breaker (yet not tasty enough or soft enough to be devoured in an hour!).

Rockies also do a lami lick, although I haven't had cause to use it and haven't researched what's in it, it might be of interest to others.

That is very quick to get through a rocky, mine last months as they only lick them a bit, they are obviously far safer than the sugary licks, if she is getting through one that quickly I would look at adding a supplement to the diet as she may be lacking in something, although I think she has been on a serious diet so it may be that she is using it as it is the only option once her hay has gone, don't forget that soaking hay will deplete the vits and mins significantly.

 

[Orca]

That is very quick to get through a rocky, mine last months as they only lick them a bit, they are obviously far safer than the sugary licks, if she is getting through one that quickly I would look at adding a supplement to the diet as she may be lacking in something, although I think she has been on a serious diet so it may be that she is using it as it is the only option once her hay has gone, don't forget that soaking hay will deplete the vits and mins significantly.

Thanks BP. She has soaked straw along with her hay, so all in all does have quite a large amount of forage but I did speak with the rockies nutritionist because I was concerned about her consumption. On working out the levels involved, she was in no way overdosing on rockies but I was concerned for the same reason as you (an underlying depletion) and am awaiting an order of equimins as I type

 

[rachk89]

Eh I see nothing wrong in giving a horse a horselyx as a treat. Mine loves his. Used to give him it when washing him to help distract him and he has learnt that washing his legs won't kill him so stands for that now without acting like i am killing him. Still not good for the rest of him but doubt he ever will be. He gets it now and again when he has been very good in a lesson but i usually do treats now as since he is grey the licks turn his muzzle orange. Not a good look.

I don't see the harm in giving them a lick on occasion. I wouldn't leave it in overnight though i mean he would finish the thing in about an hour. But what's wrong with an occasional treat for good behaviour? How many of us are currently posting on here while eating a bar of chocolate? How many of us are on here while drinking some wine? How many of us do that everyday? I think there is probably far more wrong with our own diets than our horses. A tiny bit of sugar every few weeks is not going to kill them.

 

[be positive]

Eh I see nothing wrong in giving a horse a horselyx as a treat. Mine loves his. Used to give him it when washing him to help distract him and he has learnt that washing his legs won't kill him so stands for that now without acting like i am killing him. Still not good for the rest of him but doubt he ever will be. He gets it now and again when he has been very good in a lesson but i usually do treats now as since he is grey the licks turn his muzzle orange. Not a good look.

I don't see the harm in giving them a lick on occasion. I wouldn't leave it in overnight though i mean he would finish the thing in about an hour. But what's wrong with an occasional treat for good behaviour? How many of us are currently posting on here while eating a bar of chocolate? How many of us are on here while drinking some wine? How many of us do that everyday? I think there is probably far more wrong with our own diets than our horses. A tiny bit of sugar every few weeks is not going to kill them.

Nothing wrong with a treat, even a sugary one but there are still better options, it is far easier to offer a carrot, apple, polo or other treat than a sticky tub of molasses, mine may get something when they have been good and I always take treats to competitions for them, in moderation most things are fairly harmless but I just cannot understand why anyone would actually buy a horselyx other than they are very well marketed and seem to be available in all feed stores and tack shops, there must be a gap in the market for something more suitable.

 

[MagicMelon]

I tend to avoid licks as mine either seem to go crazy over them and get narky with other approaching horses (mine live out) and basically will eat the whole thing in one go which can't be good for them sugar-wise OR they will not touch other lower sugar type licks (the vit & min type ones).

The only time I use licks is bog standard salt licks (tried the whole Himalayan salt blocks - they have never touched them!) and I always have a couple of Horslyx small licks which I can hold in my hand for a horse who possibly isnt standing still for the vet etc. They're brilliant for emergency attention grabbers!

 

[rachk89]

Nothing wrong with
a treat, even a sugary one but there are still better options, it is far easier to offer a carrot, apple, polo or other treat than a sticky tub of molasses, mine may get something when they have been good and I always take treats to competitions for them, in moderation most things are fairly harmless but I just cannot understand why anyone would actually buy a horselyx other than they are very well marketed and seem to be available in all feed stores and tack shops, there must be a gap in the market for something more suitable.

Because the horses go absolutely nuts for them and love them. Yeah a carrot is nice to give them too and is healthier but it's like a kid in a shop are they gonna pick fruit or chocolate? More often than not it will be chocolate. The licks are like chocolate to a horse it's delicious. Its a nice treat for being good. And everything is marketed to sell well yeah some will just be buying them because they are told to but most people I know have bought them after they have been harleys reaction to them. He loves them and will usually bite onto it when I try to take it away. He loves them so much he knows the sound of when we take the lid off one his head shoots up and he is looking for the lick. He isn't addicted honest... he hasn't actually had one this year at all.

 

[ILuvCowparsely]

Eh I see nothing wrong in giving a horse a horselyx as a treat. Mine loves his. Used to give him it when washing him to help distract him and he has learnt that washing his legs won't kill him so stands for that now without acting like i am killing him. Still not good for the rest of him but doubt he ever will be. He gets it now and again when he has been very good in a lesson but i usually do treats now as since he is grey the licks turn his muzzle orange. Not a good look.

I don't see the harm in giving them a lick on occasion. I wouldn't leave it in overnight though i mean he would finish the thing in about an hour. But what's wrong with an occasional treat for good behaviour? How many of us are currently posting on here while eating a bar of chocolate? How many of us are on here while drinking some wine? How many of us do that everyday? I think there is probably far more wrong with our own diets than our horses. A tiny bit of sugar every few weeks is not going to kill them.

Naughty but nice eh


Then again I cannot understand anyone wanting to smoke or to take drugs which are bad for you but people still do it, we worry so much about our animals but do not think about what we eat or put in our bodies.

I see your point in relation to a treat every now and then, if you want to give your horse a treat or an occasional lick for 10 minutes which is what the company said to me when I last brought one a few years back then do with caution, and if over weight or had previous lami then I would not.

I wonder how many on here are over weight but still eat sticky cakes/ chocolate/ fast food or greasy food, sweet sugary drinks. How many parents on here give in to the screams for sugar cravings just to keep child quiet.

The individual takes a risk or must think before buying treats and be made aware of the potential risk.

 

[ester]

equi I wouldn't give a garlic lick, garlic IMO should have no place in horse diets, it is an antibacterial so disrupts the gut bacteria, that and it probably doesn't repel any flies either .

 

[Pearlsasinger]

I'm amazed you don't know "the facts". Your "article" is an advert by the manufacturer for their product.

Sugar, is not good for horses. It's not good for humans either.

There's no second guessing here - if you have a scientific study that says horses need added sugar in their diets I would be *really* interested to read it.

Low sugar and starch diet is best for all horses. That's a fact.

Unmolassed mineral licks are available.

If you want to "break the boredom" for a horse, give it more hay. That's what they need to do with their lives, eat more hay.

And it is not true that molasses is the same as the sugar in g rass. It is far more concentrated and has no fibre. Why anyone would leave such a lick overnight, I can't imagine. You can be sure that the horse will not eat it at the recommended rate.