Horses that "dish"

My Lipi x dishes. I have had comments over the years about his legs being 'all over the place' from various professionals, including the vet who did his pre-purchase examination. It has never worried him nor me.
 
Erm, I have a suspicion that the "confusing the bulls" comment was a tongue-in-cheek jibe at the expense of the "foreigner", something that Spanish horsemen are quite fond of :-)
 
Cortez said:
Erm, I have a suspicion that the "confusing the bulls" comment was a tongue-in-cheek jibe at the expense of the "foreigner", something that Spanish horsemen are quite fond of :-)
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Well did come from a someone I know well personally I thought it was post rationalisation of why the horse where all moving incorrectly .
 
Cortez said:
I wish I could find a Spanish horse that dished! They are steadily "improving" this trait out of existence in pursuit of more sales to people who prefer straight movement (largely residing in the UK :-) The real old type of Spanish horse would fling legs in every direction; my type of horse. I've had many that did this, never a one has had any adverse effects. Horses with a lot of knee action tend to rotate the leg.
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Would you like mine? :)
 
I have a PRE and he dishes. Funnily enough after his knee problems he didn't dish on his left side. The day he dished equally was one of the best ever!

In Spain, the more the dish the better, here, less so ( outside of Spanish horse lovers that is!).

I love it, but then I would! ;)
 
Cortez said:
Ah, but they are not moving incorrectly for a Spanish horse, or any of the other breeds where that is a desired trait.
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I am confused, why would flinging legs all over the place be desired ?

The dressage world is finally coming to realise that the excessively forelimb movement is detrimental to the production of a true two time trot, many pictures can be seen of so called big movers with just one limb on the floor in trot, that is incorrect.
 
AdorableAlice said:
I am confused, why would flinging legs all over the place be desired ?

The dressage world is finally coming to realise that the excessively forelimb movement is detrimental to the production of a true two time trot, many pictures can be seen of so called big movers with just one limb on the floor in trot, that is incorrect.
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It certainly is and not a nice thing to see.
 
I think Cortez is meaning dishing, so even though they are dishing wildly they are still maintaining a 2 time trot, not leg flinging a la Totilas who fling their front legs not in a 2 time beat.

Because at the end of the day who decided dishing was a 'bad' trait as plenty of breeds do it who live just as long sound lives as those who don't?
 
shortstuff99 said:
I think Cortez is meaning dishing, so even though they are dishing wildly they are still maintaining a 2 time trot, not leg flinging a la Totilas who fling their front legs not in a 2 time beat.

Because at the end of the day who decided dishing was a 'bad' trait as plenty of breeds do it who live just as long sound lives as those who don't?
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She was referring to dishing, it was just my thoughts about dressage horses, sorry for confusion.
 
FfionWinnie said:
Yes it can be and I wouldn't have believed it if I didn't own it!

This was in Nov 2014. You can see she paddles her whole shoulder out in this pic.

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If she had done that on both sides to that extent, and hadn't improved you would almost suspect that she had Peruvian in her.

Termino is serious dishing but breed specific. There was a video floating around FB a while ago about a girl and her horse, doing all kinds of stuff, she got some really nasty comments about her horses movement, it was a Peruvian.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9eUitupQwao
 
AdorableAlice said:
She was referring to dishing, it was just my thoughts about dressage horses, sorry for confusion.
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Yes I was, but dishing is not penalised in dressage either, as long as the trot is regular and the movement comes from the hind end. Quite a few very fancy dressage horses would give the showing crowd conniptions :-)

I love the pure brio and flamboyance of Spanish horses' movement, it is primarily for showing off, but it also gives their collected movements height and brilliance. And it is the way the old Masters' horses moved. Unless the horse is interfering, dishing has not IME caused soundness concerns.
 
Enfys said:
If she had done that on both sides to that extent, and hadn't improved you would almost suspect that she had Peruvian in her.

Termino is serious dishing but breed specific. There was a video floating around FB a while ago about a girl and her horse, doing all kinds of stuff, she got some really nasty comments about her horses movement, it was a Peruvian.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9eUitupQwao
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Is it a desired trait in them? She's a Welsh section D. Think I would have left her with the dealer if it had been quite *that* bad LOL

It's funny because people now compliment me on her amazing trot when I just remember legs flapping around all over the place looking horrific!

First time my SJ instructor saw her he put his head in his hands and said well you'll never do anything with that trot, he's since eaten his words lol
 
Goldenstar said:
It's not considered desirable in Lipizzaners is it .
They are the true baroque type are they not .
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THE true baroque??

Possibly the only true baroque horse would be the Spanish horse from which the Lipizzaner is descended. The book "The Royal Horse of Europe" by Sylvia Loch explains the origins very well and explains how Maximillian II brought the Spanish horse to Kladrub in the 1500's. It's a really good read if you've never read it before.
 
'I have seen many Welsh Cobs that dish too. Is it something to do with a higher knee action?'

Could be. My Hackney dished evenly on both fores. Had no problems at all with it throughout her very long life. Would rather have a disher than a plaiter.
 
I've bought a number of horses that dished, including current one.

All without exception have improved immeasurably with correct farriery and schooling and none had soundness issues.

All had straight legs and landed with a straight foot though.
 
My Spanish mare dished; it never caused her any issues and it did actually get better as she gained more balance and became more established (I bought her as a 4 Y/O), we competed quite successfully too.
 
The "dish" in Spanish and/or Iberian horse is called "campano" or "fimbra" if I recall correctly. It is certainly breed specific, and not a conformational fault as the hoof still lands heel first with equal weight bearing on both heel bulbs. This means that they are "straight moving" even with the dish.

Both of mine dish to a certain extent (part of their Iberian heritage), though it only gets really noticeable when they are due to be trimmed.
 
Current ISH youngster looks like he's swimming :o but the hoof lands correctly, and as he muscles up it seems to be diminishing - still wouldn't want to lead him for a trot up though :p
Years ago my little welsh x SJ pony had a pronounced dish and the more excited he got the bigger the dish - and the better he jumped :D if he walked into the ring calm and straight you knew it wasn't going to be a good day :D
 
My old Welsh Cob only dished when doing flat work, out hacking or if you stuck a jump up it disappeared. I think he did it on purpose to avoid dressage!

I assume it had more to do with going forward more when he was enjoying himself.
 
All three of our current horses dish/have dished to varying extent. All have been improved with a combination of proper work and good farriery.

Current horse was pronounced to have 'the weirdest movement I've ever seen' by our vet. In hand, his legs appear to all move separately of each other. Under saddle and working into the hand, straight as a die and gets good marks for paces. Galloping/getting excited, back to flailing (though not as badly as in hand!).
It's never bothered him (touch wood), hoof does land correctly.
 
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