How are all these beautifully schooled HOYS tiny kids ponies produced?

[lisa_lou]

Do they really go between the hand and the leg from riders as young as 4 + 5 or is there something going on that i dont know about. I have a potential hoys pony aged 2.5 yrs and want to produce him well but would like a few tips as to how these ponies have such huge necks and go 'on the bit' for tiny 4yr old riders? Are they lunged in side reins from the start?

 

[toffeeyummy]

Ooo yes I'd like to know too as I have a lovely little 2.5 year old I'm planning for a show pony too. They all go fantastically and some as young as 4?!

 

[Louby]

Sorry dont know the tricks of the trade but I know they are ridden/schooled by very good tiny adult riders.

 

[madeleine1]

yer also was wondering xx

 

[rockysmum]

Probably best not to ask, we might not like the answer.

 

[JFTDWS]

Probably best not to ask, we might not like the answer.

 

[elliegirl12]

I was at a showing yard with show ponies, i got told they arnt looking to have them proper leg in hand they just want them with there head in between there legs and the flicky toes action! They dont look for what the dressage judges do! Maybe im wrong and jolly well hope i am too!

 

[Elf On A Shelf]

Probably best not to ask, we might not like the answer.

I third that!

Let's just say that a lot of gadgets are used and a few unsavoury methods!

 

[madeleine1]

i still would like to no. there must be someone on here that actuall does it

 

[Ravenwood]

Some can stand for hours on end, in a stable with side reins on, some are beautifully schooled by a small adult rider. There are many tricks up sleeves for showing people, some good, some not so good.

 

[rockysmum]

If there is I doubt that they will share.

Either they do it properly and it will be a trade secret or they don't and are not likely to admit it.

 

[Kaylum]

Lots of lunge work for the rider. Riders are hunting at 5 on the lead rein and loving it. Producing usually involves lightweight teenagers and our kids were schooling and backing at a very young age. Nothing nasty about the schooling basic actually as you would school any pony.

Put the work in you get the work out. Mixture of hacking and schooling. The kids ride every night after school.

 

[Elf On A Shelf]

To be fair some professional producers do everything right and have lightweight adults or teenagers schooling the ponies to perfection so that it doesn't matter who rides them they will always go well. But then there are others who have ponies tied in for hours on end so they learn that they can't move their heads with a bridle on, others who lunge and lunge and lunge with very tight side reins, yet more who weigh the ponies heads down with weights. Then you get the "in ring" gadgets. It has been known for pieces of cotton or fishing wire to be attached to the saddle, run through the plaits, down under the bridle and to the bit so the pony feels the resistance and doesn't move it's head.

All of my lead rein ponies are schooled by me. They do 15mins of work with me on their backs then 10mins of having the reins looped under the stirrups and lead around the field. I rarely have small riders at home, they usually meet up with the ponies at shows but it can be done and be done well with correct schooling.

 

[Kaylum]

See thats not the way we did it. Rider and pony are a full package. Training starts with them both. Not professional producers but have done as well as the so called professionals in fact better than, due to the partnership between the rider and pony. The kids could ride pretty much anything and were hunting every week.

 

[the watcher]

See thats not the way we did it. Rider and pony are a full package. Training starts with them both. Not professional producers but have done as well as the so called professionals in fact better than, due to the partnership between the rider and pony. The kids could ride pretty much anything and were hunting every week.

I would say that you are in the minority. Most of the ponies I have encountered (be it L/R, S/J or dressage) are produced almost entirely by adults and then the passenger gets plonked on them at the show. Not that I think that is a good thng, I don't. The junior rider who keeps her pony with me knows that she has to put the work in too, even if that means they will be less successful against produced ponies.

When she is done she will really be able to ride anything. Unlike some very successful junior riders who are actually quite windy on anything other than a push button ride.

 

[elsielouise]

Prof yard I worked at briefly did lots of lunging with tied in heads then would leave poor creatures stood tied in with tack on for several hours a day. Sometimes wearing plastic bags! Nb this is my only experience of showing yards and since I was working in return for livery as a student I wasnt party to much methodology. Little riders did train but never without much tying down of ponies heads. Adults used draw reins and bungees not much else. And this was a pretty successful yard.

 

[teamsarazara]

I agree, alot of hard work! Its the same with any young horse it doesn't come easy. Alot of the show ponies naturally have good movement, i had an amazingly bred pony a few years back, all his family were show ponies but he didnt pass a vet test so the family decided to sell him on.

 

[photo_jo]

One round us-a while back as in you'd never get away with it now-used to take tiny pony out hunting on a lead rein with tiny rider up and it had wood poles bandaged up back of leg so it couldn't bend it's knees to make it flick it's toes

 

[Kaylum]

I would say that you are in the minority. Most of the ponies I have encountered (be it L/R, S/J or dressage) are produced almost entirely by adults and then the passenger gets plonked on them at the show. Not that I think that is a good thng, I don't. The junior rider who keeps her pony with me knows that she has to put the work in too, even if that means they will be less successful against produced ponies.

When she is done she will really be able to ride anything. Unlike some very successful junior riders who are actually quite windy on anything other than a push button ride.

oh maybe its a Yorkshire thing as many of them around us do it this way. It teaches the children its not just about winning its about the work and how you look after your ponies. Hate the win this win that without the work personally but thats showing for you.

 

[Archangel]

I worked with 13.2 show ponies yonks ago and although I used to tune them up for the ring, I have to say they were classy little things who were an absolute delight to do. Their conformation and movement predisposed them to going correctly. They didn't have a true pony attitude more like tiny TBs.

 

[trick123]

I remember watching colin rose school ponies, he spent time long reining his ponies, he hand beautiful light hands and would walk them, make them stand whilst he talked to someone, in essence they had lovely manners for a young child to sit on. It was all done on voice as well.

 

[HorseyJennie]

I'm afraid the answer is huge amounts of strapped up lounging and adult jockeys. They will often be left in their stables strapped up in an outline.

It seems to be a bit of an old fashioned parctice but we would do a lot of 'strapping' of their necks and bums - which is just rhythmic beating, enough to make the muscle react - to help get muscle on them and it is also good for condition because it increases circulation and works the coat.

These ponies look to go beautifully, but the sad thing is that if you were to blow them up to 16hh and get on them yourself most of them would be horrendous.

We have all these young jockeys coming through with awful hands and they wonder why they dont do well when it comes to showing horses. If they don't learn how to do school them properly they will produce horses with awful mouths and no flexion or ability to vary pressure as asked. They are used to poines with fixed outlines. And don't get me started on the bits they are putting in their mouths, throwing a severe bit into a hack so that it doesnt want to put any pressure onto the bit is not schooling - it is actually just ruining its mouth for good.

It would be lovely to get all the kids on board and have them do everything but you need a little one that wants to learn and has the patience to realise it is not the pony's fault if it is not doing something right. And that is really hard for them when the other kids are sitting on pre-made ponies.

Unfortunately without some adult schooling and outward intervention you are automatically at a disadvantage, so you have to have the pony going well, which makes the child a passenger and teaches nothing. This is why all the good jockeys come from having ridden all the bad and novice ponies as well as the good ones. But if you just have one or two poines that are being shown, and a child that can only ride at the weekends, it is hard.

But I think it is more satisfying for them to take the showing less seriously and do more themselves. Get them out jumping and pony clubbing and hunting and when they are older they will be leaps and bounds ahead of the kids they have stood behind in line who can only sit on a robot pony and have no feel for what is right.

It would be nice to see this attitude instilled in the judges more. I would much rather see a pony that is not quite 100% foot perfect but being mannerly and doing exactly as the pilot has asked than one that is 100% consistent but oblivious to the fact that there is a child on board.

Ultimately, a child does not enjoy being dragged from one end of the country to the other at silly o'clock in the morning to be surrounded by an often not very pleasant attitude/environment. If they want to ride it is becasue they have fun doing it and they should be allowed learn about responsibility and reward the fun way... mum will have a far less stressful time and they will be much better jockeys in the future!

Rant over sorry lol!!

Jen xx

 

[juliag]

We have a professional showing yard just up the road from us and I am pretty sure there is nothing 'horrible' in their methods, just an awful lot of hard work. Having said that the 4-5 yr old jockeys certainly do not work the ponies themselves. Neither do these ponies hunt...... heaven forbid they might get muddy!!! lol. They do get turned out in several rugs, neck and face covers. The ponies are all ridden by teenagers and small adults and always in side reins. Fairly strapped down although I am not sure that qualifies for a horrible method. Ponies are also tacked up with side reins and left in their stables although again this may be for a very short time before they are ridden.
At most of the Agricultural shows you will see the ponies being lunged for 10-15 mins and the little kids literally picked up and plonked on top before they go into the ring.
Having said that I also think they do look gorgeous and I certainly dont have the skills to produce a top class show pony!

 

[FionaM12]

Most of the ponies I have encountered (be it L/R, S/J or dressage) are produced almost entirely by adults and then the passenger gets plonked on them at the show. Not that I think that is a good thng, I don't.

My friend, who was a tiny light weight teenager but a very strong, good rider at the time, used to work at a showing yard. She would be up at the crack of dawn for a show, prepare a show pony, travel with it and ride it at the show ground until it behaved perfectly. Its little owner would then be lifted on, in her fresh pristine outfit, just in time to warm up a little then enter the show ring.

That was a few few decades ago . I wonder has it changed?

 

[HorseyJennie]

Hi Juliag (and others)

No I dont think there is anything horrible in it either. When you think of some of the things we ask our horses to do, putting them in side reins and lounging them is hardy horrific. Obviously its not pleasent for them and there should be boundries but I dont think cruelty really comes into it.

And you are right - it is just time and hard work, and with all the knowledge in the world you simply cant match that when you work and have children to be running round after.

It's a shame though when you see kids that expect their ponies to be like it with no appreciation of what goes into producing them. And ultimately, only riding these poines literally teaches them to bad jockeys. How often do you see kids going round with their hands burried into the wither to keep them still and mimick the solidity of side reins. But it is an inevitable consequence of the fact that showing ponies is about just that - producing a pony to the best possible standard, which makes the jockey secondary. People don't invest a fortune in time and money finding good ponies and entering them for them to not have them going well.

So yes regarding the pony - experience and hard work. I know producers seem scary but if you find yoruself stood in line next to someone and have a question, just ask. Most people would be glad to help you and explain things about the different ponies.

Regarding the jockey - if you can, let them have a good show pony for the showing and an average all round that doesnt need to be schooled for them and doesnt need to be wrapped up in cotton wool!

Jen xx

 

[Munchkin]

Other practices I've witnessed first hand include cutting the protein from their diets during the 'head strapped in in stable and whilst on board' phase, until they were too weak to fight against it, then building it back up again. (Don't tell me you've never seen a retired show pony with that giant crest deformity!)

Also, making little cuts in the corners of their mouths so that they had to hold their heads like that, rather than lean on the bit to try to relieve their aching neck muscles.

Lunging through the night with no access to water, when brat had an early morning class.

Yes, this stuff still happens.

ETA: I forgot the laminitis-management... it was almost a given that ponies would 'tip' if their feeds weren't exactly in line with their workloads as they had to be fed as much as they could possibly handle to build that elusive 'topline' and ensure they were in 'show condition.'

Wish I hadn't got started on this subject.

 

[Shavings]

I wouldn't know for sure what ever one does but I have a friend who has some small ponies that she shows and she lunges them with side reins on then gets she small teen sister to school them and then pops the small child who will show them on (when child rides very lose side reins are popped on so pony can't put head right up or right down) and I think it comes with time, she also said she does a lot of long reining with her ponies as she is to big to ride them and some times her sister is not able to ride them, but that's just what she does I don't know about other people, but I do know that most of the ponies are shown in hand from day one so weather or not that is a factor

 

[Horses24-7]

I would hate my daughter to feel such pressure at such a young age

Where's the fun for the child in all of this? My daughter is 4 and has a lovely sec a who is well schooled correctly. I have a 12 year old who comes and has lessons with me on him and schools him in-between to keep his schooling up to scratch ready for when she comes off lead rein.

My daughter has lots of fun on him doing games, lr jumping etc mixed in with lessons on the lunge to help her RIDE him, as apposed to just sitting in him which is what most lr show jockeys do (IMO) we do it all through fun games and she loves it!

She can slow his trot right down and push him back forward into a nice steady true contact (the game we call snails and cheetas ) I must say I'm very proud of her as she loves the pony to bits and loves caring for him and getting her hands dirty!

 

[peaceandquiet1]

We had lessons from a well known producer, who wanted me to leave our pony tied up with tight side reins on, also to rug her even though it was a heatwave. We abandoned that line of thought and just enjoy local shows where we can just enjoy our home produced ponies.

 

[zoelouisem]

Ive got a well bred sec a pony who does a bit of everything with my daughter including pony club. He does extremly well local level and as he was well bred thought id dip my toe in a bit of affiliated stuff and unless your willing to do the head strapped down all the time with leather side reins or something similar and have a adult ride them, (and not always small) ive see some right beefy people on small ponies!!! all the time its not really possible to compete with the professionalls.

Ive now come to the conclusion that id rather a good alround childs pony than one that goes round with his head stuck between his legs. Although my daughter is actually learning now that soft contact and legs mean nice foward soft pony with nice outline not set your hands in his neck and his head will stay there, and this will be better in years to come when shes older. She has far more fun playing games at the pony club field than stood with robot ponies in the show ring. She shows at local level where its more fun and the judges are alot more encouraging on her riding rather than saying to me your pony need to be fatter and in a tight outline!!!!