How far is too far -The worst thing your boss would make you do?

Remember the sayings such as 'you reap what you sow' and 'you get what you give'. I employ grooms and I have not been too well recently. The grooms would not let me drive myself to/fro doctors and hospital. They took me. They walked and fed my dogs and totally took over running the yard. It was not part of their job.

In return, I pay them every month on the day, I have their horses at a minimal price, I travel their horses to shows free, I include them in any course hire etc and do not expect them to chip in, I feed them at shows and occasionally we all go out for lunch. I try to give them good, regular hours. Sometimes we are early/late with shows but if the weather is foul I try to see that they leave early. They have full paid holidays and a pension scheme. Oh and if they live in they have purpose built flats to the same spec as my house.

They are lovely girls ( have been men too!) and I hope I am a good employer.
 
sport horse said:
Remember the sayings such as 'you reap what you sow' and 'you get what you give'. I employ grooms and I have not been too well recently. The grooms would not let me drive myself to/fro doctors and hospital. They took me. They walked and fed my dogs and totally took over running the yard. It was not part of their job.

In return, I pay them every month on the day, I have their horses at a minimal price, I travel their horses to shows free, I include them in any course hire etc and do not expect them to chip in, I feed them at shows and occasionally we all go out for lunch. I try to give them good, regular hours. Sometimes we are early/late with shows but if the weather is foul I try to see that they leave early. They have full paid holidays and a pension scheme. Oh and if they live in they have purpose built flats to the same spec as my house.

They are lovely girls ( have been men too!) and I hope I am a good employer.
Click to expand...

This all the way!
Have not had grooms myself, but have been a groom along with all sorts of other jobs including a vet. I would always do for my boss what i would do for a friend (until the boss proves not worth it in some way) and would have no hesitation doing anything that helps run the business (including washing windows on a quiet day when i was working as a vet, cleaning some very manky wellies that had been used for a calving by another vet, cleaning toilets when needed etc.etc.).
The only things i won't do are things that are illegal, immoral, unethical, or involve looking after children.
Wish i could work for you 'sporthorse' and am sure i wouldn't feel like a doormat while cleaning your boots ...
 
sport horse said:
Remember the sayings such as 'you reap what you sow' and 'you get what you give'. I employ grooms and I have not been too well recently. The grooms would not let me drive myself to/fro doctors and hospital. They took me. They walked and fed my dogs and totally took over running the yard. It was not part of their job.

In return, I pay them every month on the day, I have their horses at a minimal price, I travel their horses to shows free, I include them in any course hire etc and do not expect them to chip in, I feed them at shows and occasionally we all go out for lunch. I try to give them good, regular hours. Sometimes we are early/late with shows but if the weather is foul I try to see that they leave early. They have full paid holidays and a pension scheme. Oh and if they live in they have purpose built flats to the same spec as my house.

They are lovely girls ( have been men too!) and I hope I am a good employer.
Click to expand...

This is how the horse world goes round! 'You scratch my back and I will scratch yours'
I would go miles out of my way to help out an employer if I knew they would do the same to me. But the bosses that we could see sat inside on a socking wet day watching tv with their feet up while we were slogging about in the rain just used to rub me up the wrong way.
 
Red-1 said:
and yes, I went to the shop to buy his razors or whatever else he needed. I don't recollect him having dry cleaning, but it would not have been an issue.

To my eyes he needed to have razors, and he could either go and buy them himself and do no vet work (which was after all what paid my wages) or I could go and buy them and he could do vet work and cover the reception, earning wages for me too :-)
Click to expand...

Or your boss could have gone and bought his razors/whatever else he needed in his own time, which is what the rest of the world have to do, busy or not. As a manager myself, I think it's an outrageous liberty to take, and shows a lack of respect for both the employee and the job they're employed to do.
 
I always thought that the care and maintenance of boots, spurs, gloves, jackets, hats etc would fall to a groom

Probably just as well I don't employ one! :D
 
Last edited:
ycbm said:
There are plenty of secretaries and PAs who take pride in facilitating their boss's ability to focus 100% on their task of managing a business, who are happy to sort out the dry cleaning of business suits, ordering flowers for the partner's birthday and anything else that helps if they have time around more onerous duties. Bigger companies have people/service companies employed to provide those services to senior members of staff. In smaller companies the PA does it.
Click to expand...

PA - Personal Assistant. The clue is in the job title, and is a completely different role to secretary. The 'looking after' part of the role is usually in the job description, and the role is better paid in comparison. Someone in that role would also have an expectation to facilitate their boss's personal life where necessary.
 
SpottyMare said:
Someone in that role would also have an expectation to facilitate their boss's personal life where necessary.
Click to expand...

Maybe I'm old fashioned but my approach is that regardless of your role your boss employs you to make their life easier full stop and unless a request is unethical, illegal etc i would do it if it helps take some strain off them

My actual job is compliance, form filling, red tape etc, a job I have years of experience in however I also manage a small feed shop onsite which is not related to my immediate skill set and if my boss asks me to drop something to the yard or groom or lunge their horse I do it without question
 
Last edited:
I’ve been thinking how I feel about this. Having been at the bottom of the rung I would have done whatever I was told without question. Including jobs that probably weren’t strictly in the job description to help the boss.

However, now I’m in a managerial position it would be considered wholly inappropriate if I asked someone to do a personal favour for me. One of the guys offered to walk my dog at lunch, because he wanted to play with the dog and I was busy and that was frowned upon as an inappropriate use of a subordinate. God knows what would have been said if I had asked someone to polish my shoes for me.

It still depends on context. For example, if someone was nipping to the shop anyway and I asked if they could grab me something whilst they were there, then fine but it would not be acceptable for me to send someone to the shop to get something for me.
 
Seville said:
As an ex professional groom, no, its not your job to clean boots. A groom looks after horses, saddlery, the yard, feeding, exercising, grooming,, maybe, and only maybe, poopicking a field.
The personal clothing of your employer is their responsibility. Well done for standing your ground. Mention that you won't do their ironing either.
Click to expand...

I'm going with this. It's nothing to do with 'work ethic' or whatever else is thrown in there, it's about valuing your skills in your profession...and yes, it is a profession. Once you've done the boots, it could develop onto 'feed the dog, pick up the kids from school, fetch the shopping'.
 
SpottyMare said:
PA - Personal Assistant. The clue is in the job title, and is a completely different role to secretary. The 'looking after' part of the role is usually in the job description, and the role is better paid in comparison. Someone in that role would also have an expectation to facilitate their boss's personal life where necessary.
Click to expand...

There are thousands of secretaries all over the country happily sorting out their boss's dry cleaning. In places I've worked, the term PA was used to distinguish shared secretaries from those who work only for one person, not what was in the job description. In many organisations, the terms were used synonymously. Why on earth would someone be paid more for getting the dry cleaning, which takes zero skill, than formatting a PowerPoint presentation for a conference?

This thread's example doesn't equate to being asked to polish your boss's shoes in an office, as so many people are suggesting. It's a piece of kit specific to the use of the horse. If someone is happy to clean the stirrups then, if they have time, I simply can't understand the fuss about being asked to clean the boots that will sit in those stirrups.
 
SpottyMare said:
Or your boss could have gone and bought his razors/whatever else he needed in his own time, which is what the rest of the world have to do, busy or not. As a manager myself, I think it's an outrageous liberty to take, and shows a lack of respect for both the employee and the job they're employed to do.
Click to expand...

If he owned the practice it was ALL his own time. And he may have been on out of hours calls when he meant to get last night's shopping.
 
My boss once sent me out to buy him a copy of the Sun "newspaper"... I said I'd do it once but if he asked me again I'd buy him The Guardian. He didn't ask me again. :lol: (this was a retail job so personal shopping for the boss definitely not in the remit but he was pretty flexible with us so I didn't mind doing the favour really... just not the Sun more than once!)
 
PapaverFollis said:
My boss once sent me out to buy him a copy of the Sun "newspaper"... I said I'd do it once but if he asked me again I'd buy him The Guardian. He didn't ask me again. :lol: (this was a retail job so personal shopping for the boss definitely not in the remit but he was pretty flexible with us so I didn't mind doing the favour really... just not the Sun more than once!)
Click to expand...

Well there are limits :D. I'd want a lot of money to be seen buying a copy of the Sun or Playboy!
 
It's fairly apparent from some of the replies that many have never run their own start-up business; one man band, recruiting a second, then third, fourth or even maybe fifth employee. Trust me, in that sort of environment, both you and your team players need to be of the mind set to roll up the shirt sleeves and get stuck in whatever needs doing. Why? To ensure that the income is generated such that there is sufficient profit at the end of the week/month to pay all the wages.

Interestingly, when I helped out at a hunt kennels as part of a vacation job whilst at university, it was the done thing to BONE the boots of all the hunt employees. Granted, that was many decades ago but I still see care of the boots as part and parcel on many hunt yards nowadays.

Also, having been on several 4* event yards, I've seen the head lad/travelling head lad who is responsible for packing the lorry for away events giving the boots a once-over or extra polish. No big deal. The finished article reflects up on all.

Out of interest....who still bones boots? Who has any idea what I'm on about without resorting to Google? :)
 
Last edited:
ycbm said:
Well there are limits :D. I'd want a lot of money to be seen buying a copy of the Sun or Playboy!
Click to expand...

:D I do it most weeks for a couple of the operators - that and the daily star. At least it isn't the daily fail they ask me to pick up I suppose...
 
ycbm said:
If he owned the practice it was ALL his own time. And he may have been on out of hours calls when he meant to get last night's shopping.
Click to expand...

Of course it isn't ALL his own time. His own time is when he's out of the practice, not working. I think I'm safe in assuming that he wasn't doing a 24hr day 7 days a week, otherwise he wouldn't have survived for long!

I might also be on call out of hours when I have plans to go shopping. It doesn't mean I ask my team to do it for me! In fact, if any manager in any of the organisations I've worked in did that, they'd be in front of a disciplinary panel before they could blink.

My dad had his own business, and employed a few drivers/part time admin staff. He wouldn't have dreamed of adding to their workload with extraneous demands. It's one thing for people to muck in voluntarily. It's quite another for it to be expected as a matter of course because the boss decides on a whim that they can't be bothered to do it themselves - like cleaning their own boots.
 
gunnergundog said:
Out of interest....who still bones boots? Who has any idea what I'm on about without resorting to Google? :)
Click to expand...

If by that you mean applied polish to a boot with water to create a high shine, then yes. I’ve done it with my work and parade shoes but we always called it bulling?

I did it to the toe caps of my competition boots one day when I got bored! Also if you want a higher shine on Black Boots then mix in some dark brown polish in some of the layers
 
SpottyMare said:
I might also be on call out of hours when I have plans to go shopping. It doesn't mean I ask my team to do it for me! In fact, if any manager in any of the organisations I've worked in did that, they'd be in front of a disciplinary panel before they could blink.
.
Click to expand...

This, not that I would ever dream of asking but I’m pretty sure if I asked someone to polish my shoes for me because I was busy I would be up in front of my boss pretty quickly!
 
gunnergundog said:
Out of interest....who still bones boots? Who has any idea what I'm on about without resorting to Google? :)
Click to expand...

Not boneing, but I have a pair of boots, in antique trees, that were 100% bulled. So, still the hot spoon, but then spit and polish, but no bone. Hours of work on them, Never a brush, finished with a soft cloth, then covered in tights and treated as if they were made of glass.


ETA - Ooooh, I just realised - we would bull boots and parade kit before a parade, and there would be a few of us doing this, and .... wait for it.... on occasion someone would help out with my boots :eek:

Having said that, I would not let just anyone touch my parade boots, it would have been seen as a complement to touch them! In fact, I can only think of two people I trusted to work on them.

Maybe that is why the thread absolutely mystifies me?
 
Last edited:
Biglets Mummy said:
Just to say I LOVE your approach to life Red - If I could find someone that has half your attitude to work my business would run a lot better.
Click to expand...

I have my faults... I am happy to do whatever while supported, but my nemesis is if I am told off for something if I have not done anything wrong. It gets my goat. I put it down that I genuinely do my best, so being told off is more hurtful than if I were genuinely skiving or performing not at my best. If that were the case at least I could think 'yes, they are right, I *could* do better.' But, if you are already doing your best and what is right, if you are still told off, then that is hard to take.

That is why I left my last job, in fact. Rubbish bosses and I don't gel! I was not happy so moved on. But, the school where I am has a wonderful boss, hence doing more than contracted.
 
SpottyMare said:
Of course it isn't ALL his own time. His own time is when he's out of the practice, not working. I think I'm safe in assuming that he wasn't doing a 24hr day 7 days a week, otherwise he wouldn't have survived for long!
Click to expand...

When you own the business, and you are personally paying everyone else's wages, all your time is your own time, and it's entirely up to you whether you work any of it, or none of it.

I might also be on call out of hours when I have plans to go shopping. It doesn't mean I ask my team to do it for me! In fact, if any manager in any of the organisations I've worked in did that, they'd be in front of a disciplinary panel before they could blink.
Click to expand...

They aren't paying the wages. They should be on a disciplinary for it.

My dad had his own business, and employed a few drivers/part time admin staff. He wouldn't have dreamed of adding to their workload with extraneous demands.
Click to expand...

So when people finished early, was he happy to have them stand around doing nothing while he paid them, rather than add in something easy to their other duties?


It's one thing for people to muck in voluntarily. It's quite another for it to be expected as a matter of course because the boss decides on a whim that they can't be bothered to do it themselves - like cleaning their own boots.
Click to expand...

You're big on respect for the individual and not for the person who pays the bills.
 
Last edited:
ycbm said:
When you own the business, and you are personally paying everyone else's wages, all your time is your own time, and it's entirely up to you whether you work any of it, or none of it.

They aren't paying the wages. They should be on a disciplinary for it.

So when people finished early, was he happy to have them stand around doing nothing while he paid them, rather than add in something easy to their other duties?

You're big on respect for the individual and not for the person who pays the bills.
Click to expand...

A business is not a personal fiefdom - the 'owner' is just as much an employee as the rest of the staff, although usually at director level. The business pays the wages of everyone who works for it out of the income that comes in, minus costs. So in reality, the customers are paying the wages.

No - he would let them go early, but the nature of the business was such that it rarely happened. Like grooming etc, there was always something to do.

I'm big on respect for everyone - just because someone owns a business doesn't make them more deserving of respect than the people working for them. It goes both ways. Finding extra work for employees that isn't part of their job just so you get your pound of flesh generally makes them less willing to go above and beyond when you really need them to.
 
SpottyMare said:
A business is not a personal fiefdom - the 'owner' is just as much an employee as the rest of the staff, although usually at director level.
Click to expand...

The entrepreneurs who've put their own houses on the line to get their start up loans and taken massive personal risk to create jobs for the people they employ might not quite agree with you there.

Going back to the original example, the person who asked for their boots to be cleaned is either someone rich who was indeed in their own personal fiefdom inside their own yard gates, or a competition rider taking all the risk of getting backing/sponsorship leading to being able to pay the wages. Which I would also consider akin to their own personal fiefdom.


I don't see that asking a groom to clean a pair of riding boots if they have time shows disrespect, and I suspect this is actually our main point of disagreement.

If this rider downsizes and needs one less groom, and one of them willingly does little services like boot cleaning but another doesn't, and their skills are otherwise equal, which one is going to lose their job?
 
Last edited:
woodlandswow said:
An interesting thought and also an eye opener? How far is too far..

Today my boss asked me as a groom to clean her boots as an extra yard job. I politely said this wasn't my job and she scoffed so got me thinking.. unreasonable or just deal with it?!
Click to expand...
When I worked as a groom I wouldnt have hesitated to do it. Cleaning tack isnt that much different from cleaning boots, its all part of 'turnout' of horse and rider.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Top