How long should horses be left with nothing to eat?

NooNoo59

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As the title, have been at various yards now and see horses left from seven at night to seven in the morning on a shavings bed with empty haynets, is this ok, it seems a long time to me, wondered what everyone else thought?
 

ImmyS

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In my opinion horses should always always have access to some kind of forage! Long periods without food is what causes so many health issues as the long period of no food is disruptive and also causes the horse to gorge when food is available again causing problems! Horses regulate their own food intake, trickle feeding thought out the day, it's what's natural for them!
 

pottamus

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Well it is not something that I would do with my horse. I like my lad to have sufficient for his weight and condition and to get him through the night. The compromise here is that he has a very small holed haynet to slow him down a bit and make sure he is trickle feeding rather than stuffing his face.
If I know that he is going to be in his stable longer than normal, I give him a little extra to cover the time.
We all look after our horses differently but I do not think it is good practice leaving them that length of time with nothing - asking for health issues and behavioural problems.
 

emerald_city

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Mine general go in about 4pm, have enough hay to last them through to about 6 in morning the majority of the time. Somtimes though its been issues for me to get up there so early and Ive not gone up till about 7.45/8am ... i'll admit its not ideal that they've gone without for 2 hours or so but they have survived, and to be honest they probably started scoffing their straw bed by then :rolleyes:
 

Pearlsasinger

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No it certainly isn't alright!

Horses are trickle feeders and naturally eat for 16 hrs out of the 24 but not in a block. I have a very overweight mare (we bought her that way) who is on a strict diet. She has to have haylage in winter because we can't get good quality hay, so she has a small amount and lots of straw chaff, so that she has something available to eat all night. She is also girthy and I suspect ulcers because of her previous feeding regime, so I certainly don't want her standing around with nothing to eat.

There is no reason why they can't eat straw and I bet many horses would have nibbled their bed in the past. Horses should not be left without food for more than a couple of hours.
 
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Cinnamontoast

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Trouble is, though, my horse would just eat til he burst, no rest periods! If I wanted to ensure that he had food all night, I'd have to leave him half a bale!
 

shadowboy

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Sadly it's probably similar to my boy. He's last netted up at 8pm and this is double netted a 4 kg net it lasts until 10pm and them breakfast comes round at 6.30am he too is on shavings. He's a fat native so I can't give ad lib. His hay is soaked and straw is added to bulk out and last longer but I can't feed more as it would put him at risk of lami and I can't hay up any later my OH would hate me I'm already pretty much last one up at the yard.
 

Goldenstar

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Ideally they should always have forage however they are at much bigger risk from the effects of being overwieght than anything else and if that means they have to be without food it the lesser of the evils
With my fatty I work on no more than three hours without anything and then he might just get given chopped straw .
This always let them have forage mantra must be tempered with they must not be overwieght and in the case of my fatty that means very very restricted food
Horses often rest long periods with out eating anyway.
 

Archiepoo

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thats what trickle nets are for! my 15.3hh cob would eat until he popped so he has 8kg which is correct for him in a trickle net and theres usually a bit left in the morning (from 4 pm)
 

Oberon

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I believe it takes 4 hours to empty the stomach. Then (at a litre an hour) I would expect it to take 2 hours for the stomach to be filled with acid with nothing to do.

So after approx six hours, you are going to have risk of ulcers forming.
 

jaijai

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I have seen this too.
I understand that some horses need to watch their weight but surely soaking hay for 24 hrs would mean the horse could eat as much as necessary without compromising weight control.
We sometimes use 2 nets and put soaked hay in one and dry in the other and always use small holed nets.
 

Goldenstar

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I have seen this too.
I understand that some horses need to watch their weight but surely soaking hay for 24 hrs would mean the horse could eat as much as necessary without compromising weight control.
We sometimes use 2 nets and put soaked hay in one and dry in the other and always use small holed nets.

There's no way my fatty would maintain his wieght on add lib soaked hay the only time we can go to anything like abi lib is when he's hunting.
He's out at night in summer on a completly bare strip and stands in during the day and gets some chopped straw he is however fed before work ( about one hour )to guard against splash ulcers.
He the best doer I have ever met since my Shetland in fact I think hes worse poor boy.
 

Slightlyconfused

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I've always with mine given them their Haynets last thing before I go. The nets are weighed to match their needs. Yard closes down at 9:30pm a d the gates don't unlock again until 6am. I cannot give my lami, WB and old welsh mare any more as they are good doers that pile in the pounds. Have had the welsh mare for nearly 13 years and have done exactly the same and she is fine.
 

shadowboy

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Jaijai my boy can clear 10kg in a night which is a ridiculous amount for a 13.3hh pony out for 12 hours. Even if I soaked it he would put on weight trust me I've tried. Personally this is the lesser of the two evils
 

starryeyed

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I've always been told that 4 hours is the maximum amount of time a horse should be left without any kind of food, not sure how correct it is though.
I try to make sure madam has something to munch on at all times, overnight in the stable she has 2 absolutely massive haynets (one soaked, one dry!) and although she never finishes them I know she always has access to fibre. She's also on straw so can nibble on that, rather she didn't though!

I think in an ideal world a horse should always have access to something fibre-wise, even a native should have a big heap of soaked hay to much through at night - though I know some horses can eat a ridiculous amount and that's not always possible!
 

Theocat

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Some nights mine leaves some, others he has polished it all off by 7pm. I top up when I leave as necessary but I'm pretty sure he's without hay for several hours most nights. However, he's on good grazing for eight or nine hours every day and on straw bedding if he's peckish - his weight's fine so I'd rather he eats his bed than pigs all night on good hay, and I like to feed from the floor so I'd rather avoid hay nets altogether.
 

TandD

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i have a similar problem to some of you to!

haveing a tb means mine can eat all night without a single change in his weight! its difficult to keep the weight on. so he can eat as much as he likes (lucky guy!)

but unfortunalty on our yard the YO has turned round and has said we are no long allowed to give our horses hay, and that the only hay they will get is what gets put in their stable when mucked out (small haynet amount), and an 'extra needed' (literally a handful) if they have run out on late night checks (at 8pm!)

i have been up to the yard at 6pm and horsey has run after only being in for 2 hours! :eek: . obviously sneak a huge wheel barrow load in to keep him going!

he cant have it in a haynet due to back problem, and doesnt actaually need his forage limited!

very fustrating and one reason why we are moving! surely this isnt good horse management/care? a grazing animal needs to graze!
 

Twinkley Lights

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i have a similar problem to some of you to!

haveing a tb means mine can eat all night without a single change in his weight! its difficult to keep the weight on. so he can eat as much as he likes (lucky guy!)

but unfortunalty on our yard the YO has turned round and has said we are no long allowed to give our horses hay, and that the only hay they will get is what gets put in their stable when mucked out (small haynet amount), and an 'extra needed' (literally a handful) if they have run out on late night checks (at 8pm!)

i have been up to the yard at 6pm and horsey has run after only being in for 2 hours! :eek: . obviously sneak a huge wheel barrow load in to keep him going!

he cant have it in a haynet due to back problem, and doesnt actaually need his forage limited!

very fustrating and one reason why we are moving! surely this isnt good horse management/care? a grazing animal needs to graze!

No it isnt are you on full / part livery by any chance with hay all in - kerr ching? Horses need to trickle graze to prevent impaction colic and other nasties - as others said trickle nets are good for fatties where needed as laminitis is a killer but I don't support the view to prevent feeding for several hours
 

**Vanner**

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My boys get their tea at 7pm at the earliest as they get fed at 7am so to me splitting 24 hours in half. They get half their weight allowance at night and their day allowance split into two nets; when not out grazing, I use trickle nets and they usually have some left in the morning.

I do feel for the ponies that have been fed at 4pm and have finished well before I feed mine and will have nothing for the rest of the night.
 

Heucherella

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Mine is on full livery, with hay in vertical hay cages. Some of the horses in my barn can inhale the entire column of hay in two hours, and as they are fed at about 5pm, they then have 12 hours with no hay. But the hay cages hold loads - probably about two haynets worth, and with plenty of grass during the day, they don't need any more than that. Luckily they are all on straw beds, but they don't seem to eat much - when their hay is gone they seem to just doze. We never have any problems with colic, so presume the option to nibble their beds is enough to negate the negative effects of an empty stomach.
 

TandD

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No it isnt are you on full / part livery by any chance with hay all in - kerr ching? Horses need to trickle graze to prevent impaction colic and other nasties - as others said trickle nets are good for fatties where needed as laminitis is a killer but I don't support the view to prevent feeding for several hours

yes shivvy! part livery! so diy'ing at the weekend. feed as much as we like then! but YO is always scrimping/saving extra cash e.g. not fixing broken fenceing or not having enough bedding to go round.....to spend on themselves and family, while horses care isnt always to the standard id like! its not bad or life threating but just poor knowledge of care and saving cash :/

wish my horse was fat! make life much easier! could make him work harder and not feel bad....
 

Twinkley Lights

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yes shivvy! part livery! so diy'ing at the weekend. feed as much as we like then! but YO is always scrimping/saving extra cash e.g. not fixing broken fenceing or not having enough bedding to go round.....to spend on themselves and family, while horses care isnt always to the standard id like! its not bad or life threating but just poor knowledge of care and saving cash :/

wish my horse was fat! make life much easier! could make him work harder and not feel bad....

Move him if you can hun look into other options first do your research it's hard hun but when I had my old chap in livery they took the mickey royaly so I moved him and he landed on all four hooves and had a wonderful year or so with an ex eventer before we moved areas and found another star and then his retirement in our own yard. Good luck let us know how things go:)
 

mynutmeg

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Ideally no they should never be without something in front of them but it's not always a realistic option. My mare puts weight on looking at green paint so has to have restricted hay overnight, to give her enough so she has a little left I'd have to be giving her 8 or 9kg, whereas she only gets 3.5-4kg most nights, much more than that and she starts to pile on pounds.
She has it in a small holed net to make it last longer and gets a treat ball with hay replacer in it to occupy her and a pretty big bucket of plain chaff but I simply can't leave her with more hay, even soaked she still puts weight on. I've tried feeding straw alongside but she doesn't touch it (for a cob she can be fussy). She's usually still got hay when I've been up around 11 before now (other ones colicking etc) but she certainly has a good few hours in the morning without anything.
I figure the risk of her developing ulcers is much more acceptable than the risks associated with her being enormously fat, especially as she has no other risk factors for ulcers.
 

popeyesno1fan

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In an ideal world, they should have something to eat all the time, but going on my "pigs", i'd need to put a round bale into each of their stables every day. My sister thinks I over feed hay, but i dont, i give them enough to hopefully see them through the night, but i'm sure they munch through it in a few hours. I do go through a huge amount of hay, but there is never a rib of hay left!!! they are not fat, but not skinny, so i think i'm right. My sister has her horses on way too much hard feed, so hay is only a substitute, whereas, mine get hard feed, but just a little, so love their hay. (I bet that if i did put in the round bale, the savahes would have it nearly gone!!)
 

freckles22uk

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I dont have any grazing at all.. not even a blade of grass.. so i feel like im forever feeding mine, so they dont go to long... mine live out at home

I feed mine between 8-9 in the morning (hard feed)
the at lunchtime 1-2pm they get nets which can last 2-3 hours
evening feed is between 6-9 (depending on the time of year) and they get hard feed and another net (small holed)
and often pop out inbetween with treats, carrots or carob beans

so mine can go 9 hours without, (though they do pick up blown about straw and hay in the paddock, as the bales are in there under tarps)

It is surprising how long a net doesn't last, and even though Ive got small holed nets, and hang them from the tree branches so they have nothing to push them against, they dont last as long as you think 4 hours max (they have straw in them at night, as they have enough weight on them) ... but Ive found a netting with smaller holes (like the trickle nets) and Im waiting it to come so I can make my own nets (works out a hell of a lot cheaper than buying them.. I can make 4 nets for the price of one trickle net.. and I need 3)
 

Tiffany

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I wouldn't leave a horse without food for that long intentionally but my mare is greedy and a good doer. She gets a large doubled netted net about 6.30pm and it's usually gone by 9ish. Seeing the colour of her in the mornings I can only presume she gets down and chills out
 

Pearlsasinger

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Having read the whole thread, I think that for some horses the problem is that they are being fed hard feed, which only last them a short time, but provides plenty of calories, so the remaining calories that they need must come from a small amount of hay - or the horses WOULD be far too fat.
Horses have evolved to eat forage, not cereal, and to get plenty of energy from it, so the answer to many of those who feel that they cannot give their horses enough forage to last the night is to feed fibre only.
If your horse has straw available, it can and will nibble a bit every now and again, even if you can't tell that in the morning. This will keep the stomach acid which causes ulcers at bay.
 

Rose Folly

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Interesting thread, and don't really know the answer.

Ours live out 24/7 with constant access to barns/ little stable yard. For logistical reasons they live as a herd which is quite difficult as one is a skinny 17.2 ex-steeplechaser, one is a stout Welsh Section D or Irish cob and one is a plump Welsh Section C.

In summer the two fatties come in to the stable yard at 9 a.m., have a very small breakfast of hard food, and then have no access to food for 6 hours. At 3pm they go out (unmuzzled) until 9 am next day. The TB chaser stays out, stuffing his face or lurking in the shade waiting for his 'girls'.

In winter the stableyard is open at all times (i.e. not fatties shut in). After breakfast at 9 am the fatties get a small mesh haynet of haylage each. The TB is shut in a box for a while until he has finished a huge haynet (wide mesh) of haylage, then he's released to join the other two grazing. At 3.30 pm they get their tea, and 3-4 medium haynets hung round the yard. At midnight or thereabouts (horses kept at home) I give them 3 more good haynets which last them, one hopes, for a bit of the night, after which they just have to graze!

So basically the TB is never without access to forage, but the fatties in summer have to go without for 6 hours. The vet is happy with this, and while in my opinion still overweight, they are not the pregnant barrels they could be.
 
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