How many RUGS??

[JessPickle]

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I'm afraid I'm amazed when I see someone saying their horse has a LW, 2 x MW and a HW on. To me that is utter madness not common sense and I pity the horse.
And I have a fair background in working with competition horses, and that volume of rugging certainly hasn't been in force on yards where I have been.

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My uncles racehorses arn't even rugged to that extent!! there not exactly well covered and are racing fit!

 

[Coffee_Bean]

I don't believe that horses need 3 HW rugs on... maybe I'm odd, but that could be like 1kg of rugging, when most only have 400g!!!

Seems a bit ridiculous but eadh to their own.


My part clipped girl is in her HW, and I have added a fleece at points this week, and when it gets down lower she may have a 150g under rug on under her FAL. But she would never have more than that.

 

[Rosehip]

Melly has 3 on tonight - a no fill sheety thing, her saxon MW and her Masta (I think its a MW but not sure!), and a hood. She lives out and is growing out a full clip - Ill trace her soon tho I think. I alternate rugs every day to keep her warm but not hot.... her field isnt the warmest and she doesnt have a shelter

 

[Puppy]

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Like you I am constantly amazed at the posts on here regarding rugs (or rather lack of!). My ISH mare is fully clipped/pulled/hairless and has a LW rug then two MW rugs under a HW and most of the other horses at the yard have similar but they are all competition horses. In fact all the horsey people I know have their horses heavily rugged but again they are mostly comp horses (tending to mean that they are hardworking, fit horses and also, perhaps more relevantly, their owners are relatively experienced/professional horsemen/women).

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I personally am rather amazed at the posts saying horses need 3+ rugs on at any one time

I also think it's a little rude to suggest that those who put any fewer on their horse probably don't know what they're doing/aren't v experienced...

 

[MistletoeMegan]

QR: All the posts about 'do what is right for your horse' are all very well and good provided people are aware of what is right for the horse!

IMO, a horse should not feel hot to the touch, nor cold. That 'lovely, warm, toasty' feeling that so many people (encountered in RL, not nec. on here) think is the right temperature, is far too warm. The aim of rugging a horse when it is incapable for whatever reason of maintaining a temperature that keeps it healthy and without loosing too much weight, is the same temperature that a healthy horse would be in average temperatures with no rug on, ie the temperature the horse maintains itself.

If you were to feel your horse on a summers evening for example, when it was turned out with no rug on, it should not feel hot to the touch and this is the temperature that I always aim to reach when rugging. For those who clip their horses, take a bit of effort to check the touch-temperature of a horse in the weeks before you clip it so that when you have to rug it, you are able to rug to the temperature that is normal for the horse, not most comforting for you.

Whilst I appreciate that some horses are very warm, some are very cool and that the conditions on each yard vary, a horse that needs 1kg of rugs on indicates an unwell horse.

 

[Pidge]

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Like you I am constantly amazed at the posts on here regarding rugs (or rather lack of!). My ISH mare is fully clipped/pulled/hairless and has a LW rug then two MW rugs under a HW and most of the other horses at the yard have similar but they are all competition horses. In fact all the horsey people I know have their horses heavily rugged but again they are mostly comp horses (tending to mean that they are hardworking, fit horses and also, perhaps more relevantly, their owners are relatively experienced/professional horsemen/women). I strongly believe that if we clip off our horses coats & confine them to stables where their ability to move about and generate warmth is restricted then we are under an obligation to ensure they are warm enough. And as for the post regarding horses shivering as a way to keep warm - you have got to be having a laugh?? Obviously that is why they shiver but the point is they shouldn't have to - are people honestly saying they watch their horses shiver and don't add a rug?? Remember that horses cannot just decide they are cold and move closer to the fire or add another layer as you yourself would - we shiver for the same reason as horses so would you be happy if your kids were shivering in their beds at night? Ok, rant over - but honestly guys - check your horses warmth (by ears and under rugs) and add/takeway as required. Common sense surely?

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See to me your horse is way over rugged, what on earth are you going to put on when it gets colder? Surely it can't be good to be wearing that many rugs?
Pidge is an ISH and competes all through the summer and over the winter and is very fit and doesn't carry an ounce of fat on him, his bum is rock solid with muscle for example. So I suppose that makes me an experienced owner then

Please don't assume those without comp horses are not experienced owners

And yes I religiously check his ears every morning and night to see how warm or cold he is and he was lovely and warm even this morning with his mediumweight on and it was -5

Each horse is different but please do not assume that those that aren't native should be rugged up to the eyeballs, if I did that to Pidge he would be so uncomfortable and then I'd be a cruel owner surely?

 

[Honeypots]

I'm in North Devon on the side of a valley..very exposed. Mine have chaser clips and are naked except my TB x...he's in a heavyweight. He is unclipped and has a pathetic winter coat but is toasty warm

 

[Coffee_Bean]

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Like you I am constantly amazed at the posts on here regarding rugs (or rather lack of!). My ISH mare is fully clipped/pulled/hairless and has a LW rug then two MW rugs under a HW and most of the other horses at the yard have similar but they are all competition horses. In fact all the horsey people I know have their horses heavily rugged but again they are mostly comp horses (tending to mean that they are hardworking, fit horses and also, perhaps more relevantly, their owners are relatively experienced/professional horsemen/women).
Common sense surely?

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Surely it is common sense to not put 4 rugs- Probably 100g+ 2x200g + 350g = 850g of rugs on a horse when it is only down to -5.

So are you saying that people that don't put 850g of rugs on their horse, even though their horse may be warm in a 200g are cruel/less experienced/have a lack common sense??

I hope it was just a badly worded post.

 

[Lulup]

I did have a feeling my post might get this kind of response. No I'm not suggesting that those who do not rug their horses heavily are less experienced or lacking in common sense - the last line of my post (which you have taken out of context by missing a section out) said :

check your horses warmth (by ears and under rugs) and add/takeway as required. Common sense surely?

Although I would add, much as you may slate me for doing so, that big DIY yards with a high quota of novice/first time owners are prime places for spotting horses with full clips and inadequate rugging - horses with fast sprouting whiskery 'cat hairs' all over their bodies are generally a sure sign that they have been cold.
I'm not suggesting that people should over rug their horses - just that they should be sure to check them when temp drops (or raises) and rug accordingly.

 

[JessPickle]

I also never get what these horses with 3/4 rugs allready will do when it gets colder. You are basically making your horse a complete wimp by rugging to this extent! Pickle has never needed and will never need a neck rug as he is perfectly find without one as he is used to it.

 

[MizElz]

Ellie was clipped out (full) today, and at night she has a cotton sheet, a heavy weight Witney blanket and a Masta stable rug. in the field she has a fleece with a HW full neck over the top.

 

[Tia]

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And as for the post regarding horses shivering as a way to keep warm - you have got to be having a laugh?? Obviously that is why they shiver but the point is they shouldn't have to - are people honestly saying they watch their horses shiver and don't add a rug?? Remember that horses cannot just decide they are cold and move closer to the fire or add another layer as you yourself would - we shiver for the same reason as horses so would you be happy if your kids were shivering in their beds at night?

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People who anthromorphosise often have trouble actually understanding how animals systems work.

You don't really understand the endocrine system in a horse do you.

One day, with a lot more years experience under you belt, you may well find that your post above is not quite as straight forward as you would have people believe.

But I don't care, so you keep putting your rugs on your horse

- I just hope you aren't one of these terribly negligent owners who throw their horses out in all of these rugs and then when the temperature changes (as it does throughout the day) do not go and take them off.

 

[chestnut cob]

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check your horses warmth (by ears and under rugs) and add/takeway as required. Common sense surely?


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I agree. My IDxTB has a hunter clip and has been in two MWs - one is a half neck older rug that I'd say isn't as heavy a weight as it would have been when new, and the other is a 250g full neck rug. He's been just right most of the week in that, and on the days where the wind has stopped and it's been ok in the sun, he's been TO in the half neck rug (which is slightly heavier) with a LW full neck on top.

I was surprised to find one morning that he was actually cold under the two MWs. I'm not a fan of putting lots of rugs on, and my last two horses have both been really warm so I'm not used to it, but if my horse is cold under his two MWs then he's cold. And if he's cold, he gets either more or heavier rugs... Likewise, as I say when it's warmer, he gets less.

 

[Lulup]

Well thank you for the very patronising reply

. I seem to remember a post on here from you the other day seeking advice about whether you should go and buy rugs for your yearlings who are shown in the pic sporting their lovely fluffy coats, and for whats its worth (not much I am guessing!) I agree with the advice you were given that they should be fine with their thick coats and ad lib forage.
However, my horse lives in an entirely different situation and is rugged accordingly. If you read my post in its entirety you will see that my closing comment was :

check your horses warmth (by ears and under rugs) and add/takeway as required. Common sense surely?

which will hopefully put your mind at rest that I do decrease, as well as increase, my horses rugs according to the temperature. There are various comments asking what I will do when it gets really cold but unless I have been living in a parallel universe for my entire life it generally does not get that much colder than this in my end of the country so my horse is in her max amount of rugs at this moment.

Blimey what a can of worms.

 

[Tinypony]

I'll confess to my age here - I'm 48. I've been around horses on and off all my life, horses that compete, hunt, hack and also do nothing. What I can't understand is why horses seem to need all this wrapping up these days, when maybe 30 years ago they didn't. They thrived and didn't stand about being frozen and neglected.
We have a lady on our yard who is insisting on rugging her poor mare in a HW rug with neck. Setting aside breed, weather conditions etc, the mare is too hot. We can tell because when we put our hands under the rug she is "toasty warm" ie the temperature that her owner likes to be herself in winter. However, horses shouldn't be toasty warm, in the summer when they are that hot they are uncomfortable and lethargic. Rather like her mare now. I think too many people (not pointing fingers here OK!) want to make their horses toasty warm in winter, losing sight of the fact that a few weeks ago the horses were happy when they were not that hot.
Everyone at the yard took the rugs off theirs today, apart from this one livery. The horses played and rolled in the mud, and even though the people were shivering they were fine. The mare in the HW just stood around being warm.
Anyway, I ramble, but I would like an answer to the question - Why are horses so much more delicate now than they were 30 years ago?

 

[Lulup]

Hilarious - have just found the following statement from you when reading the posts in Horsey slob v hygienist

[My]Horses live in the same winter turnouts for the whole of the winter (unless they are damaged)

Fair enough your winters are extreme but surely not the same temp everyday yet you say in your response to me that it is negligent to leave horses in same t/o rugs when it warms up during day etc. Don't know why a simple discussion has to become such a targeted attack but you've made me smile if nothing else.

 

[Lulup]

I don't think horses are necessarily more delicate its just the case that as with everything else, technology has improved and thinking has changed somewhat.
Technology has improved in all areas - we have far more advanced boots/saddles/equipment etc. as well as huge advances in veterinary treatment/shoeing/training etc. that have together contributed to the career span of competition horses being significantly extended.
And just a thought to leave you with, all those that frown upon those who rug their horses heavily, go and visit the yard of a top level sj/dressage/event yard where you generally see the results of our best training/technology in action and see how their horses are rugged.

 

[Tia]

Not sure which part you felt was patronising? You were anthromorphosising and you laughed and jeered at others for not rugging their horses, so I merely responded to clarify what actually happens within the horses body, that's all

Yes we all have our mad moments, as (if you had actually read the post) you will have seen. I guess it took me ... oh ... all of 5/10 minutes to bring me back to my senses. I question things ALL the time - that's the beauty of life and all of it's choices, don't you agree?

Glad to hear you chop and change your rugs accordingly - it's just that over the decades I have seen some really sorry sights stuffed inside rugs which may well have been fine at 8am, have become waaaay too hot for the horses by 11am and then the temperature rises and drops throughout the day.

Believe it or not, but I have lived other lives during the past 40-odd years I've been on this planet

. When I was competing in the UK 3 or 4 times a week during the winter, my horses were all clipped out however their usual attire during the depths of the winter were a stable rug underneath a MW turnout; if temperatures altered during the day, I changed these rugs, often frequently each day.

The thing you have to remember is this; horses CAN accommodate being cold, they find it far harder dealing with being too hot; so in essence, under rugging is far more favourable to over rugging. BUT if you say your horse is fine like this, then not my affair. I have no issue whatsoever with anyone rugging their horses responsibly and as little or as much as the horse needs; trouble is, some people don't know what their horse actually needs which is why you see some horses almost dying of heat exhaustion in a tonne of rugs.

 

[Tia]

My god you are obsessed Lol! I do believe I have my very own stalker!

Don't worry sweetie, my horses have NO chance of being too hot over the winter. So no I NEVER have to change their rugs because as I said previously (didn't you read it?) horses can warm themselves up, its the cooling down part that is their problem. Not your fault that you are unfamiliar with weather patterns where I live, but no it never warms up during the day - the temperature stays constant the whole of most days during our winters.

 

[Skhosu]

one heavyweight on a competition 3/4 tb who's not clipped and has maybe a 1/4 of the normal horse coat (he's pathetic that way)
He gets sweated even if a neck cover is added to that.
His companion, a 3/4 id is fully clipped and in a MW turnout w/ LW stable underneath and a neck cover.
How any horse needs more than 2 rugs on (and thats when its cold!) is beyond me..

 

[Skhosu]

Lulup-if you believe that the top dressage/eventing/sjing/competition yards are the paragons of the horse world in terms of care I think you need to have an education...

 

[Coffee_Bean]

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I'm not suggesting that people should over rug their horses -

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So what would you class as over rugging?? 2kg so the horses knees buckle under the weight?

And jeeez you really do have a problem with peoples horses that aren't rugged to the eyeballs by the sounds of it.... oh god report me to the ILPH my horse is only wearing one rug and it was FROSTY

 

[Lady_Bug]

My boy feels the cold, so the last two nights he's had a 110g and a 375g with full neck on. He isn't clipped, but is nice and warm with this combo.
My old horse had a 220g rug on on the coldest days and just a fleece when it was a bit chilly.
Rug to suit the individual horse.

 

[chriscrogul]

Clipped horses coat regrowth is not necessarily an ndication of them being cold! If you clip before the winter coat is fully through then there will be a faster regrowth. Also, you can rug your horse up to the eyeballs but length of daylight hours plays a huge part in coat growth, not body temperature alone.