How much longer should I let this go on?

im so sorry to hear about your mare iv never had a horse with lami but my thoughts are with you and i hope for a good outcome x
a 8year old mare on our yard has been diagnosed with cusings(sp) and has had lami for a few weeks however tonight i took a turn for the worst shes in alot of pain and can hardly walk now vet simply said were doing all we can and there just trying to make her more comftable (sp) shes beening xrayed again tommorrow =(

xxx
 
First big hugs to you both and best wishes for today.

Second - no mention of gastric ulcers? A lot of lami's suffer from ulcers and these alone can invoke some of the symptoms you are describing. I have no idea why but this is often missed and/or not allowed for/treated.

Please ask your vet about gastric ulcers.

Third - please read Founder Prevention and Cure by Jamie Jackson - available from Amazon
 
Our mare had an acute lamminitis attack earlier this year, she had a massive rotation of the pedal bone and was flat out in pain for several days.

Basically the attack was brought on by sugar from pasture, and feed. There is far too much sugar in horse diets in the UK.

The feet are a syptom of the illness, you need to feed soaked hay or haylage nothing else.

Let her lie down for as long as it takes, several days if thats what it needs.

Try not to give pain killers as it is detrimental to the regenreation of the lammina.

Our mare though at deaths door is now being ridden out and we have reversal of the pedal bone rotation.

The prevention for further attacks is diet, exercise and lastly hoof care, in that order.

Most horses can be cured of lamminitis yet the majority are put down.

Our vet was initially not happy with the way we treated our horse and said that he would not be responsible for the out come. He has now changed his mind.
 
when your vet comes out would it be worth asking about giving her some fluids and possibly feed by intravenous? if she isn't eating then she won't have the strength anyway.
i'd also ask about taking her off the acp and changing pain relief.

why do vets give acp/sedalin for lami? i've had one mare that's had it and have known of 3 others and each time the vet has prescribed acp/sedalin???
 
I have not read the whole thread so someone else may have mentioned that loss of appetite is a side effect of pergolide.Its should improve after a few days tho.

I lost my mare through cushings and lami but she was a old girl and her pedal bones sank.
Good luck and I hope you have a good outcome. its a horrible time but only you can make that final choice
 
Well she was on her feet this morning, albeit rocking and obviously in pain, BUT she had eaten her entire haynet :eek: and just feels a *tiny* bit perkier.

I've talked to the vet and am going to double her Danillon. The vet is coming tomorrow morning (can't come today :( ). Her view is that we should try to make her more comfortable and try to keep her going a few more days to see if the Pergolide starts working, particularly because her pedal bone haven't rotated or dropped. The vet admits she doesn't really understand why the mare is in so much pain. If the mare had been like she was yesterday I don't think I would have gone along with the vet, but whilst she is in a very bad way, she is eating.

I know what you mean by Is it really lammi, and I am personally still not 100% convinced. It LOOKS like lami, but the minimal rotation is a puzzle. She def has cushings (vet measured her ACTH and apparantly a normal horse without cushings would be below 100 and my mare was 583!!, which even allowing for seasonal rise and it being raised because of the laminitis is pretty conclusive.

They give acp because its supposed to cause the veins (I think) to widen slightly to greater blood flow to the feet, but I have to say I didn't give her any this morning, which was bad of me, but I do think its making her depressed

So all in all I don't know if I'm making the right decision to keep going for a couple more days, but I was slightly heartened this morning so it would be awful not to be sure and make the wrong decision!
 
I think you've done the right thing Oldmare, there is that saying that when in doubt don't, and as she seems a bit brighter and has eaten I think I'd be giving her a chance too. Just take each day as it comes and see where you end up, but I think if the pergolide is beginning to work then you may well see a difference over the next few days/weeks.

My neighbour had an old horse that developed several bouts of severe laminits and was given pergolide, after a while he was sound as a pound and even able to graze normally, He lasted another few years before he died with an unrelated condition.

Here's hoping it is onwards and upwards for your girl, and remember to get some rest and relaxation yourself, it is a very stressful time!
 
I think you should PTS if the horse is suffering without hope of recovery.
The problem is, that your crystal ball may be as cloudy as mine.
My friend's horse went to one of the big vet schools with the worst laminitis I have ever seen - the pedal bones were coming through the soles, which were cracking and oozing serum. Vets gave her painkillers, and drugs to alter his blood pressure and sent him home, but they took me aside and told me that he would only live 3 - 5 days before he'd need PTS. :(
He lived another 11 years, in work, being ridden, and was PTS due to old age at 26yr old.
S :D
 
Glad she seems to be feeling a bit better.

My share horse got lami in 2008, September time. She started off a bit lame, then vet diagnosed cushings. She had really bad tendons etc anyway and by December she could barely stand:(. She had good days when she would be led out for a pick at the grass, but she spent most of her time laid in her stable. She even had pressure sores on her body and head. :( She was put to sleep on New Years Eve 2008, as it became so clear she really had given up. She passed peacefully with her head in my lap. :(

In hindsight I think her owner left her too long, maybe even a few weeks too long. But when there's that glimmer of hope sometimes you just can't give up.

As someone else says, take it day by day and if the time comes, you will know.
(((hugs)))) for you and get well <<<vibes>>> for your mare.
 
Don't give up if she has perked up a bit! Our old mare got pedal bone rotation, and the hoof detatched. To cut a long story short, she regrew a new hoof and was returned to the field with her mates a year and a bit later! Unfortunately the original injury that caused the lami returned a few months later (pelvis issue, that made her put all her weight through one back leg), and she let us know that she had had enough and did not want any more time to recover again. The previous time she had been ill, she was perky and happy, but this time the sparkle in her eyes had gone and she was clearly very down.
If she had not got the pelvis injury again, I have no doubt that she would still be with us, so please give your mare some more time. x
 
I would be looking to make final arrangements for her and PTS without delay.

(((((((( )))))))) It's the most upsetting time for you.
 
She will tell you when she is good and ready, trust me. If shes standing and seems perky in herself then just give her time. I've got to have my boy PTS tomorrow and he has just lost all zest for life and is clearly not happy. He has let me know enough is enough and I am listening. Its bloody tough and I keep wanting to call up and cancel but I cant, unfortunately its our responsibility to take care of these beautiful animals, regardless of how much they break your heart x
 
Leg_end said:
She will tell you when she is good and ready, trust me. If shes standing and seems perky in herself then just give her time. I've got to have my boy PTS tomorrow and he has just lost all zest for life and is clearly not happy. He has let me know enough is enough and I am listening. Its bloody tough and I keep wanting to call up and cancel but I cant, unfortunately its our responsibility to take care of these beautiful animals, regardless of how much they break your heart x
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Sorry to hear that, you know deep down when it is the right decision, sending you hugs, and I hope it all goes smoothly for you. x
 
I really feel for you and your mare.

My vet told me that I wouldn't see the full effects from the Peroglide for at least a month so give it time. Also ask your vet about increasing the danilion until her other meds have had a chance to kick in.

Only you know your mare and like someone else has said, if the sparkle is still shining bright in her eyes then she hasn't given up.

I hope everything works out for you.
 
I really feel what you are going through 5 1/2yrs ago i went through the exact same thing with my beautiful mare. She was on peroglide for a few years it worked well till eventually she got like this and would hardly stand and was off her food so we made the tough decision to have her PTS.
Sorry to say but there isn't much else you can do for her we tried to put it off but she just wasn't improving so we knew it was for the best, it isnt nice to see them suffering and everyday you keep her going is just going to be more heartache for you seeing her in pain. My thoughts are with you at this difficult time.xx
 
Oh what a difficult situation. My first thoughts, and please remember I am a stranger to your dear horse, is that I would have to call it a day. Thinking objectively, a horse that is laying down so much and not eating, and also not improving, would seem to me to be past 'the point'. Of course that is easy for me to say when she is not my horse.

I would have, if you haven;t already, a really honest conversation with your vet (sorry if this has been covered haven;t read all replies) and ask them to be totally honest with you - what do they think you should do?

I hope things have taken a turn for the better, my thoughts are with you. Be strong for your mare. x
 
Its easy for other people to tell you to pts. When its your horse its very hard. Im glad shes a little brighter today. If you can keep her comfatable for a few more days you will have at least given the pergolide chance to work.
I think you will know when its time to give up. I hope it does not come to that for you. Good luck
 
It sounds like there is a little improvement today. In the long term no one knows what the out come will be but it is never a good idea to rush into taking a life and I am pleased you have given your mare a fighting chance. She may surprise you! Horses constantly surprise me!
 
So sorry to read about your poor horse. I know every situation is different so you need to make your own decision, however, my mare had cushings and developed laminitis. She was put onto a very deep bed and given bute and pergolide. There was very little rotation shown on x-rays but she got worse and layed down. She didn't get up for 3 weeks. She was groaning and her feet were hot and pulsing but she still called to me and lifted her head when I was there. I didn't know if I was doing right or wrong, didn't sleep much. Finally she stood up. She stayed in that box for 9 months. Then led out for 5 mins a day. It took 15 months in total before she was out 24/7 again but so far she hasn't looked back and is happily SJ again. It was heartbreaking for both of us but I have no regrets. I wish you strength and luck and hugs if you decide to wait a little longer. xxx
 
brighthair said:
My old boy had recurrent abcesses in all 4 feet, and they suspected lami and cushings. The abcesses kept coming back, and at one point I couldn't tell which leg he was sound on.
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I have dealt with similar. I've cared for ponies with laminitis and cushings before but I had a really strange one a couple of years ago, if you searched my old posts in vets you'd probably find it if anything can be of any help at all.

Basic summary

- pony lame on LF diagnosed abscess, Treatment, box rest, hot poultices.
- About 3 weeks later pony worse, abscess not burst. Vet nerve blocks RF, pony lame on RF. Vet diagnoses lami. Treatment, more box rest, bute ACP, laminitis management.
- About a month later, pony worse, lame all round. Same treatment but now x-rays which showed no rotation.
- About a month later pony worse, lying down all the time, could barely walk, looking miserable. More x-rays which were still absolutely fine. Cushings test which was negative. Even got faith healer out to this pony.
- Vet tried pony on pergolide and he suddenly showed improvement after about a week and I started to be a bit hopeful.
- After another 2 weeks pony was worse again. Farrier happened to be due and he said he suspected an abscess in the LF. He had a dig, I poulticed, but nothing came out. Then another vet visit. Vet dug some more, I poulticed, and the next day an enormous abscess burst in the LF which had been the worst affected leg all along.

After this the laminitis gradually improved and the pony's personality returned. Unfortunately, this didn't have a happy ending as the pony stayed a little bit intermittently lame on the LF even after a year off, and as he was a working pony he had to be pts. He could have remained a pet though.

Sorry for the essay, I just thought I'd share a weird lami case in case it helps at all. Maybe your vet could have a bit of an look in case your horse has underlying abscesses as well? Personally, I'd try and hang in there for ten days after starting pergolide, but laminitis is really unpredictable and it is not as simple as feed it less and it will be fine. You know you've tried your best and there's no shame in calling it a day at any stage when a horse is in pain.
 
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Sending you lots of hugs!! Only you can decide what is best for your horse, be guided by your vet and get 2nd opinions if you feel you have to. Above all go with your gut feelings. Best of luck
 
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