How much risk is too much risk?

[Pmf27]

Hi all!

Eurgh, I've been putting off asking this for today but I can't stop churning this round in my head, so here goes...

Some of you may recall my last post about a horse I've started a trial loan with, which has been hugely exciting but I fear it has already thrown a problem up which I don't really know if I'm experienced enough to deal with.

It was only a couple of weeks ago that I posted on here saying "I've only fallen off a horse once, does that mean I'm not experienced enough?" And everyone's advice was "DON'T JINX IT" - well, it seems I kind of have!

I went to see him again the other day and had another ride but this time he had a bit of a 'moment'. He hopped off the track, bucked and did a mini rear which absolutely terrified me. I didn't fall but this was only because I got myself caught in the stirrup (I think? It all happened very fast I wasn't really able to take stock of what was happening).

His owner wasn't worried and barely batted an eye, but my OH later confided that he was scared it was gonna be an A&E job and he was poised ready to run to my aid, bless him! I think I dealt with it okay, as I pushed on and kept riding but it had left my confidence in tatters and each time he started getting any speed to canter I bailed and went back to trot.

This is where my question comes in really, as I'm now not sure what to do about continuing with the loan and my reason for this is actually nothing to do with the horse. I felt that I'd landed on my feet with this being my first loan as his owners are lovely and so supportive and he is a very sweet and affectionate horse BUT the yard is in the middle of nowhere and I would be the only person there when I go to see him.

My OH, having come with me to the yard, told me he would be coming with me each time I go up but the yard is also very far away from us and it's an easy three hours out of our evening each time, which is fine for me but I'm feeling a little guilty about the impact on my OH.

He's honestly the most supportive person I know and has already planned where in the yard he will sit to do his work (he does a lot of work from home in the evenings) while I am with the horse but I just can't shake the guilt that he's spending at least six hours out of his week on MY hobby.

But given how isolated the yard is (literally NO ONE around for miles) it just seems like this would never be a good set up should I decide it's time to 'go it alone'. Or is it? I know that with horses lots of people ride alone, so I would eventually like to get to the point where me and the horse build up a relationship and enough trust that I feel comfortable riding him alone, but if it's literally just me and a horse for miles is this sensible? When does being an independent rider turn into putting yourself at unnecessary risk?

The wobbly moment he had the other day has definitely exacerbated this fear, but I did make a mental note of the isolation of this yard the first time I went up, hence the arrangement me and OH made about him coming with.

Sorry for the ramble, but it's been quite good to get it all written down and out of my head!

 

[Petalpoos]

Honestly, if you are losing confidence now I think you may want to give this one a miss, however wonderful it seems otherwise. I think you are maybe concluding that anyway, judging from your comments at the end re the location of the yard etc. Life is too short to spend time on something that frightens you, wait for the right one in the right place. Good luck, whatever you decide.

 

[Pmf27]

Honestly, if you are losing confidence now I think you may want to give this one a miss, however wonderful it seems otherwise. I think you are maybe concluding that anyway, judging from your comments at the end re the location of the yard etc. Life is too short to spend time on something that frightens you, wait for the right one in the right place. Good luck, whatever you decide.

Thanks for your response! I don't feel like I'd be lacking in confidence to ride him again under the current set up, that's the confusing part.

I haven't ridden since this happened (not by choice, just my booked days haven't rolled around yet) but I'm still itching to get back on.

It's really just that what happened has now made me think: will it ever be sensible to be alone at this particular yard or shall I continue with OH coming with?

But yes, I suppose giving it up altogether is also an option, I did float this past OH and he said I was being hasty, hence my consideration on the safety merits of this particular yard.

 

[AmyMay]

It’s one thing having a rush of adrenaline, but another being ‘terrified’ when an incident happens. That coupled with the isolation of the yard would make me question the sensibility of going forward with the loan too.

 

[Pmf27]

It’s one thing having a rush of adrenaline, but another being ‘terrified’ when an incident happens. That coupled with the isolation of the yard would make me question the sensibility of going forward with the loan too.

Maybe not the right word for me to have used then, as I continued riding after and am still keen to get back on again - was scary, but I've never experienced anything besides a buck before so yes, definitely was a big, big rush of adrenaline!

 

[SpeedyPony]

With regard to the isolation of the yard, I wouldn't say it was too much risk, but if the horse has made you nervous so soon I'd be inclined to give it a miss and not risk losing your confidence.
To be fair, the little moment may have looked worse than it was to your OH if he isn't horsey, the acrobatics they pull do look spectacular from a non-horsey perspective, even when it's just a normal spook!

 

[Pmf27]

With regard to the isolation of the yard, I wouldn't say it was too much risk, but if the horse has made you nervous so soon I'd be inclined to give it a miss and not risk losing your confidence.
To be fair, the little moment may have looked worse than it was to your OH if he isn't horsey, the acrobatics they pull do look spectacular from a non-horsey perspective, even when it's just a normal spook!

Seems this is the general consensus, as I'd feared!

I was thinking the same thing about it maybe being that my OH was just healthily worried, but he rode as a kid and had much worse than that (vertical rear) so I feel inclined to trust his concern.

I guess I'll be giving this one up then!

 

[EllenJay]

If you enjoy riding this horse, then I would look to having lessons on him with a good instructor. In the meantime keep within your confidence zone.
If for the short term your OH is happy to spend the time at the yard with you then accept that help. I personally don't enjoy riding by myself, but if I have to do so, I message someone when I am mounting, let them know how long I will be riding for and them message them when I have finished. If they don't get the second message, they call me and if no answer, they will send the calvery

 

[Pmf27]

If you enjoy riding this horse, then I would look to having lessons on him with a good instructor. In the meantime keep within your confidence zone.
If for the short term your OH is happy to spend the time at the yard with you then accept that help. I personally don't enjoy riding by myself, but if I have to do so, I message someone when I am mounting, let them know how long I will be riding for and them message them when I have finished. If they don't get the second message, they call me and if no answer, they will send the calvery

I've been offered lessons on him with a local instructor which I've said I'd be very keen to take up, so I do feel this would help.

Your experience is very much what I thought most loaners/owners did and sounds as sensible as you can get when you're completely alone. Though I did assume most people rode at livery yards where there was always at least someone close enough to hear a yell if all goes pear shaped, guess this isn't true?

 

[EllenJay]

I've been offered lessons on him with a local instructor which I've said I'd be very keen to take up, so I do feel this would help.

Your experience is very much what I thought most loaners/owners did and sounds as sensible as you can get when you're completely alone. Though I did assume most people rode at livery yards where there was always at least someone close enough to hear a yell if all goes pear shaped, guess this isn't true?

Depends what time you ride. I tend to ride very early before people are around, a friend rides late evening after most people have left.
Obviously, during peak times there are people around and it's obviously safer

 

[ihatework]

My gut feeling is this is not going to work out. For a novice and first time loaner you really do need a Steady Eddie and be in a yard environment where there is an experienced person to keep half an eye out. I’m surprised the owners of this horse are encouraging this situation, it could get out of hand quite quickly.

Sorry to be negative but there is probably a better loan/share out there for you and in the interim try and get some lessons at a good riding school where the horses aren’t too institutionalised

 

[DabDab]

If you like the horse and are still excited to get back on then it may be worth continuing for a bit with OH at your side - just stay within your comfort zone with him until you know him better. Be careful though that you don't start to really lose your confidence, because it is hard to get back. I am also surprised that the owner of the horse has left you alone so soon.

On the isolation, I wouldn't consider it too much risk as a situation in itself. You can have an accident in very much not remote places and be struggling to get help. My horses are at home and people are almost always somewhere on the property when I ride, but if I ran into difficulties I doubt anyone would hear me yell. My mum had a stroke about 10 years ago when she was at home alone (in a town centre house). She couldnt use a mobile, couldn't really work out her surroundings, but knew she needed help so picked up the house phone and dialled a number. Thank the heavens that the number was the local tennis club she was a member of, and although she couldn't really speak the receptionist recognised who it was and that she needed help and called an ambulance.

All this is to say, if you do the text as you get on, text as you get off routine then you are probably better protected than doing many many other day to day things where you wouldn't think twice.

 

[Wishfilly]

Confidence is a precious and fragile thing- I would honestly think long and hard before putting yourself in a situation that could ruin it. It sounds like you dealt with the situation well in the moment, but afterwards it had affected you. I'm not saying you shouldn't go ahead, but I would personally want my next few rides to be confidence building. If you get off every time with your confidence dented, then it's not the right set up for you.

I do ride at the yard "on my own"- as in I ride when no-one is on the yard, and the people who know I am riding are up to half an hour away. However, it is a busy-ish yard, so someone would probably come across me fairly quickly if I had an accident. When we go out hacking, I always see walkers etc, so someone would notice if I had a problem. It does seem like your yard is very isolated, and this could be a concern.

Would you feel under pressure with your OH there to get things done more quickly? Would you enjoy yourself thinking of him doing his work and waiting for you?

 

[hottoddy]

You sound as if you really like this horse and are keen to improve and progress. If this is the case then accept the help you are being offered, have some lessons, let your OH come with you and see where you are in a couple of months. Chances are by the time the weather is better and the nights are lighter you will feel confident enough to go it alone

 

[Sussexbythesea]

The whole set up doesn’t sound ideal for a first time loan/ share. You’d be much better finding a horse that doesn’t scare you on a busier yard with people around to help and encourage. It doesn’t matter how nice his temperament is on the ground or how nice the people are if you lose your confidence which is extremely difficult to get back once lost.

 

[JackFrost]

I'd say it's too much risk. If you are riding out alone in a really remote area, you need to trust that the horse is going to be sensible at all times and not prone to having 'moments'. Riding is a risk sport and the risks are real, and can damage more than just your confidence.
Long term I'd be looking to find a better way to make the arrangement work (for dear OH as well as yourself).

 

[PurBee]

From the isolation perspective i echo others views.
IF you need outside help, be it vet, or dreadful to think, ambulance....work out how long it would take for them to get there.
im 45 mins away from local vet, and 1.5hrs from serious emergency crews. It is vulnerable, yet if confident when the shoite hits the fan, is copeable.
However, my neighbour had a heart attack and minutes count In some scenarios.

Its awful to think of worst case scenarios and im not sure its wise to embrace those realities in our minds to be honest, but horses are unpredictable sometimes, and so wisdom here is to know what is possible to handle being very rural.

Its a good idea as mentioned to have someone you call when riding, and when finishing, if you are alone, so that at least someone knows what you’re doing and can alert services should the 2nd call does not arrive. But that scenario can turn sour if phone battery dies, and other techy idiosyncrasies we can never plan for yet seem to happen.

If i could choose again, i’d prefer to be closer to civilisation! Just from an everyday perspective of ease of getting stuff home, yet its also a lot easier having other people around, even if theyre strangers, to call for help IF that ever occurs.

You’re travelling an awful long way for a loan horse. despite the horses behaviour quirks and husband accompanying you guilt you feel, just the distance would become wearying for me personally.
Before you really bond with the horse, if you let it go now, and find a closer loan horse, its easier to do now than when more committed and bonded. Theres many out there that are lovely. Even go and see some while you continue with this one, so you keep learning/improving.

 

[HashRouge]

Honestly it's a risky hobby and it's supposed to be fun - if you're going to be worried about riding for whatever reason, it's just not worth it. As other posters may know, I share a young Arab gelding and I have an absolute blast riding him, it's generally one of the best things in my life in what has been a tricky year for me. His yard set up sounds similar to what you describe - it's the owner's place so there is often no-one else riding and no-one around. The difference is that I always go down when his owner is there so that someone knows what time I left and what time I should be coming back, and can raise the alarm if I don't come back! We started doing this after I fell off him on a bridleway (over a year ago) and he buggered off onto the road. We were very lucky everything turned out okay and he was caught by some friendly pedestrians, but his owner wasn't there at the time and we decided it was safer all round if we coordinated what time we were there.

 

[Lipglosspukka]

I would only have lessons on him for now if you wish to continue.

 

[Pmf27]

Thank you all for your responses, I really appreciate the input from everyone!

I do think that if this loan was on a livery yard - as I was perhaps naively expecting - then I'd not be thinking twice about what happened, it is definitely the isolated nature of this yard that has me feeling a bit unsteady. Which is very frustrating because in every other aspect, from what I can glean so far, the set up is perfect.

To respond to some of the points raised:

His owner hasn't left me alone with him just yet, though I do feel we are nearly at that point because I've ridden him a few times now and have been clued up on his routine etc. But tbh his owner is at much the same stage as I am in terms of horse journey, we have been riding for a similar amount of time and seem to be of a similar level - the difference being they have loaned a horse before and, of course, now own their own.

I am also still having regular lessons at another yard, one which I moved to recently after moving away from the yard I'd been at for the last year and a half. In one of my last lessons at the new yard I was on a real bucker, never had to deal with that before and was told by my instructor that I sat them very well. So I'd say it was certainly the mini rear that freaked me out a bit with the loan horse, not so much the buck - though I think the hop, buck, rear combo shook me up a little.

Before this, I considered myself a confident novice, as I've been riding for years (started riding when I was 10 but it's only the last 18 months or so that I've gotten back into it properly) and I've always felt comfortable on a horse so the flip side of my worries is that there is always going to be a 'first time' for something scary that you've not experienced before. Something I was prepared for knowing that privately owned horses are different to riding school ones.

I do appreciate those of you who have said that perhaps this isn't the one for me and am more than prepared to walk away if that is the case, though I do have that niggle in the back of my mind saying "you'll never get used to these things if you run away from them when they happen".

I really hope that doesn't come off as me dismissing the advice I don't want to hear because, believe me, I'll be discussing everyone's input with my OH tonight and saying "but the folk on HHO say..." a phrase I'm sure he's sick of hearing by now haha.

 

[Upthecreek]

I guess it depends what behaviour you are prepared to put up with and I think you have to be very honest with yourself about that. Personally for me horses who lift their front feet off the ground are a no no, it wouldn’t matter about the location of the yard. On that subject, accidents can happen on the safest sanest of horses. You are mitigating the risk when riding in a location where people are around. This does not sound like a horse that is suitable for you to ride on your own in an isolated location.

 

[Crazy_cat_lady]

Your OH sounds lovely!

How often do you go up the yard? I worry he may get bored keep going up, especially if he gets wet and cold, it's lovely he cares so much and takes so much interest but will that wear off after a few times?

I agree you want a lovely safe horse for a first loan who you can just have fun on. I'm sure your OH would feel safer too!

Is there a yard more local with a more steady type, you can then go alone as he will feel safer then the times OH comes with you can be a little less often so he can enjoy watching you/ walking out on hacks with you.

Feet being lifted off the ground is a no from me as well. H is spooky but doesn't rear or buck. You have even more freedom to be fussy about spec when loaning.

The yard is also quite a way away then you need to factor in time spent there it sounds a long haul for someone non horsey, albeit very supportive. Would he end up getting fed up?

 

[Pmf27]

Your OH sounds lovely!

How often do you go up the yard? I worry he may get bored keep going up, especially if he gets wet and cold, it's lovely he cares so much and takes so much interest but will that wear off after a few times?

I agree you want a lovely safe horse for a first loan who you can just have fun on. I'm sure your OH would feel safer too!

Is there a yard more local with a more steady type, you can then go alone as he will feel safer then the times OH comes with you can be a little less often so he can enjoy watching you/ walking out on hacks with you.

Feet being lifted off the ground is a no from me as well. H is spooky but doesn't rear or buck. You have even more freedom to be fussy about spec when loaning.

The yard is also quite a way away then you need to factor in time spent there it sounds a long haul for someone non horsey, albeit very supportive. Would he end up getting fed up?

Gosh, he really is! I'm very lucky, he is selfless to a fault and hence my guilt is kicking in haha.

At the moment it's just been once a week, but when the owner eventually leaves me to it I'll be going up twice a week. However, my plan was to do one weekday and one weekend day, so I was hoping that on the weekend I'd be a little more confident on my own because it'll be day time and there are likely to be walkers passing by the yard (apparently!)

This is the question I've put to him a few times, it's been a very "but are you ABSOLUTELY SURE?!" type conservation and he keeps saying that it'd be good for him because he likes to be around horses, it will give him a change of scenery and he will have an hour or two uninterrupted to do his work.

In an ideal world, he'll come with me and be happy until Summer, then Summer will roll around and me and horse will have formed a bulletproof relationship and I'll be happy, comfortable and confident to deal with whatever he throws at me, but I'm not going to hold my breath!

 

[Pmf27]

I guess it depends what behaviour you are prepared to put up with and I think you have to be very honest with yourself about that. Personally for me horses who lift their front feet off the ground are a no no, it wouldn’t matter about the location of the yard. On that subject, accidents can happen on the safest sanest of horses. You are mitigating the risk when riding in a location where people are around. This does not sound like a horse that is suitable for you to ride on your own in an isolated location.

This is definitely where my inexperience with dicey moments comes in, because it felt like a rear but owner said he "barely left the ground". Though on the flip side OH said "he reared, but it was a small one", I know that rears are one of those that people don't (or shouldn't) ever accept, but I was left questioning "when is a rear not really a rear?"

 

[mariew]

I would definitely get someone to help with lessons and seeing if you can work through the rearing issue. I have sat many bucks but do not feel confident with a rearer so if it was a regular occurrence then I would go look for something else as I would be concerned he was sore or its too much of an ingrained evasion.

 

[Littlewills]

It was a rear. Anything that lifts its feet off the ground is not suitable for a novice. The isolated location just makes the situation worse. You need to ask yourself if someone offered you a perfect, sane but forward school master on a nice yard, would you even consider this horse. You wouldn't, You are keen because this one is here in front of you.

You need to walk away before you end up losing your confidence, or worse, hurt and unable to ride again

 

[Pmf27]

I would definitely get someone to help with lessons and seeing if you can work through the rearing issue. I have sat many bucks but do not feel confident with a rearer so if it was a regular occurrence then I would go look for something else as I would be concerned he was sore or its too much of an ingrained evasion.

I think based on what a lot of people have said it seems I need to walk away now, but was going to say that - if this seemed as though it was to be a regular occurrence - I'd definitely look elsewhere as you suggested.

It was a rear. Anything that lifts its feet off the ground is not suitable for a novice. The isolated location just makes the situation worse. You need to ask yourself if someone offered you a perfect, sane but forward school master on a nice yard, would you even consider this horse. You wouldn't, You are keen because this one is here in front of you.

You need to walk away before you end up losing your confidence, or worse, hurt and unable to ride again

Okay you've got me there! I can't really argue with that, because yes I'd not look back if offered the set up you describe. I'd be interested in your take on a buck, though? As you're not the first person I've heard say that a rearer isn't suitable for novices, but I've had a few 'excitable bucks' at my last yard (on RS horse) and then a whole lesson on a naughty bucking horse at my current RS.

 

[Upthecreek]

I don’t mind the odd cheeky buck when a horse is feeling fresh. I would not enjoy riding a horse that bucked or bronced on a regular basis with the intention of getting me off. There is a difference. Generally, with the exception of being spooky at times, my two are quite predictable and well behaved in most situations. If either of them started bucking/broncing/rearing I would be thinking there was something physically wrong or an issue with saddle fit.

 

[atropa]

I think the difference between a rear and a buck is a buck is likely to end with you eating dirt, or potentially if you're unlucky hitting a wall or fence. Not something to be dismissive of, but not quite the same as the potential for 500kg+ of horse to land on you if the horse goes over backwards during a rear. Also, a rider is more likely to unbalance a horse during a rear than a buck.
Tricky one, in horse ownership you do have to get used to isolation when riding at some times, as people have said previously either you may be on a quiet or private yard or you ride early/late, however as a sharer I think you have more of a choice of whether that's for you or not. You can more easily choose to leave and share at a busier, bigger yard than someone who owns a horse can find a more suitable yard and move horse, if you feel that the isolation is not for you.
I'd be slightly concerned the owner didn't bat an eyelid at the behaviour, makes me think it could be a reasonably regular occurrence.
Bless your OH, he sounds like an absolute diamond.

 

[Pmf27]

I don’t mind the odd cheeky buck when a horse is feeling fresh. I would not enjoy riding a horse that bucked or bronced on a regular basis with the intention of getting me off. There is a difference. Generally, with the exception of being spooky at times, my two are quite predictable and well behaved in most situations. If either of them started bucking/broncing/rearing I would be thinking there was something physically wrong or an issue with saddle fit.

Yes good point, he was great the first time I rode him but I'm not sure what the balance is likely to be between 'good days' and 'buck/rear days' having ridden him so few times already.

I think the difference between a rear and a buck is a buck is likely to end with you eating dirt, or potentially if you're unlucky hitting a wall or fence. Not something to be dismissive of, but not quite the same as the potential for 500kg+ of horse to land on you if the horse goes over backwards during a rear. Also, a rider is more likely to unbalance a horse during a rear than a buck.
Tricky one, in horse ownership you do have to get used to isolation when riding at some times, as people have said previously either you may be on a quiet or private yard or you ride early/late, however as a sharer I think you have more of a choice of whether that's for you or not. You can more easily choose to leave and share at a busier, bigger yard than someone who owns a horse can find a more suitable yard and move horse, if you feel that the isolation is not for you.
I'd be slightly concerned the owner didn't bat an eyelid at the behaviour, makes me think it could be a reasonably regular occurrence.
Bless your OH, he sounds like an absolute diamond.

Yes that's a very good point that I'd not even considered, probably because it was such a small rear I didn't allow my mind to go there. Hmmm also a good point re. owner not concerned, they did say he "does that sometimes", but only after it had happened!

This thread has certainly given me a strong reality check, I thought I was super ready for a loan - now I feel like a complete beginner all over again!