How on earth to unpack all of this…

IrishMilo said:
The vet (who was brilliant, and very respected) advised the usual - Arthramid for the hocks and steroids for the neck, although was very honest about how costly they are and it's not just a 10 minute procedure. It's £1000 a pop, every 6-12 months, 'if they work'. In the field he's fine. On the neuro tests he was fine, apart from swinging slightly wide with a hind to the right which the vet said was only a very very low grade ataxia/proprioception issue but 'virtually not there'.


Yes that's him @Tiddlypom. He really is the most gorgeous, kind boy.

The tripping is mainly out hacking over grass, and if I do any polework with him - raised poles are a disaster for example. Jumping has always been an effort for him unless buzzed up at a show.

I really wish I'd X rayed the spine as well, I might do that anyway.
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I think I would X ray the spine to see if he has kissing spine as well, and maybe scan suspensories. It's difficult to know what to do without knowing the full picture. Sorry that this has happened.
 
IrishMilo said:
Ex racer, 6. Owned for a year. Persistent tripping issue and has never been able to work on a contact. Teeth done multiple times, bitting specialist came, no difference. I have a great farrier who works with the vet who saw him today, he shoes him with a rolled toe and side clips.

X rays - we did neck, hock, feet, and knees:

- Mild navicular both fronts
- Severe changes C4-C7
- Severe OA both hocks, bone spur right hind
- Old trauma to right knee, poss fracture

2/10ths lame right fore and hind.

I really don’t know how to move forward - I feel in a strange state of shock.

Do I just immediately retire him? Take his shoes off, turn away for 6 months and rehab his feet? (this was the plan before this anyway).

Is anything other than light hacking now cruel?

His sole depth was 2mms with a negative palmar angle each foot. Apparently normal depth is 15-30mms. I’m less concerned about his feet as I know this can be sorted.

But everything else… Argh.






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I'm so sorry you're in this position.

First thing I would do is to put him on bute for 2 weeks and see if there is a noticeable change in his behaviour or action. That would be a clear indication of how much pain he is in and would help with the retire or PTS decision.

I've an exracer having his last summer due to hocks and suspected other issues. I was wondering about my decision as he looked OK and happy in the field, playing with his companions, just occasionally bit stiff.
I had some bute so put him on 1 day and while no change in demeanour I have noticed that he is trotting and cantering around the field more and playing more, suggesting he was/is in some pain. Its heart breaking as he looks amazing atm but reinforced that my decision to PTS when the weather changes is correct.

I'm horse shopping and my experience and other stories like yours really make me question the sanity of buying another exracer. It also makes me really angry about what the hell they've been through to have soany issues so early 😞
 
poiuytrewq said:
I feel your pain. I got the loveliest ex racer and he tripped, was slightly lame on and off, sometimes it was just a “does that leg look off” feeling, others another leg would be visibly lame.
He has C6/C7 narrowing so possibly impingement bug the X-rays weren’t really conclusive. Medicating didn’t help.
Bone scans showed his back but again X-rays weren’t terrible.
I did a year or so of investigations and trying to get him right. Turned away, tried again but he still tripped.
Turned away again for 18 months and tried in hand stuff to see what happened but he went lame.
He has as a very last attempt on Friday Rob Jackson just coming to look.
This is absolutely definitely my final try at anything.
I think you have to consider (which is why I stopped riding) aside from how he may or may not feel pain wise if he trips and face plants the road, what could happen to you? Is it worth the risk.
It’s a really sh*t situation and I’m sorry you’re in it. From where I am 5 years on I’d really say don’t let it rule your life though as o did for a while.
Hugs
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Best of luck on Friday x
 
Oh that poor angel. He hasn't had it easy at all and he's so young. I'm afraid I wouldn't try to rehab, he'll never hold up with the neck and knee. I also wouldn't throw more money at unearthing more issues. If you can retire for a year or two, until he breaks down further, otherwise I'd make the decision now.
 
YourValentine said:
I'm so sorry you're in this position.

First thing I would do is to put him on bute for 2 weeks and see if there is a noticeable change in his behaviour or action. That would be a clear indication of how much pain he is in and would help with the retire or PTS decision.

I've an exracer having his last summer due to hocks and suspected other issues. I was wondering about my decision as he looked OK and happy in the field, playing with his companions, just occasionally bit stiff.
I had some bute so put him on 1 day and while no change in demeanour I have noticed that he is trotting and cantering around the field more and playing more, suggesting he was/is in some pain. Its heart breaking as he looks amazing atm but reinforced that my decision to PTS when the weather changes is correct.
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So sorry OP, I think YV has pointed out a good place to start - assess what level of daily pain he is in and that may make your decision for you. Being prey animals, they can cover up a hell of a lot of discomfort.

To be honest, I got to severe C6/7 changes and already knew I would PTS, but I understand if you feel as though the above would help you make that choice, it's easy to say when it's words on a page and awful to decide when it's your horse. Will be thinking of you!
 
I co-own him with his previous sharer, who hacks him a few times a week lightly. I ride him once or twice and lunge once or twice, my focus with him has always been jumping, we'd just started 90s with no success.

I don't know why I feel putting him to sleep is off the cards, I've had 2 put down for the same things or less but I just can't arrive at that conclusion for him. Maybe because he's been so stoic about it all... he never refuses, never bucks... just gets on with it. Loves a gallop.
If you didn't care for the finer details much you'd just think he's lazy in the school and clumsy.
 
IrishMilo said:
I co-own him with his previous sharer, who hacks him a few times a week lightly. I ride him once or twice and lunge once or twice, my focus with him has always been jumping, we'd just started 90s with no success.

I don't know why I feel putting him to sleep is off the cards, I've had 2 put down for the same things or less but I just can't arrive at that conclusion for him. Maybe because he's been so stoic about it all... he never refuses, never bucks... just gets on with it. Loves a gallop.
If you didn't care for the finer details much you'd just think he's lazy in the school and clumsy.
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I really don't think anyone should ride him, both from safety pov and for his comfort. I have had 2 x11 yr olds and 1 x6 yr old pts as emergencies, while I kept a mare retired for well over 10 yrs, so I know how difficult both options are.
The real problem us that you both have to agree on a way forward. I think I would remove his shoes and turn him away with effective pain relief for 12 months to see if he can be retired in comfort but realistically it wouldn't be wrong to pts, before his condition deteriorates, which it will even if his feet improve.
 
IrishMilo said:
I co-own him with his previous sharer, who hacks him a few times a week lightly. I ride him once or twice and lunge once or twice, my focus with him has always been jumping, we'd just started 90s with no success.

I don't know why I feel putting him to sleep is off the cards, I've had 2 put down for the same things or less but I just can't arrive at that conclusion for him. Maybe because he's been so stoic about it all... he never refuses, never bucks... just gets on with it. Loves a gallop.
If you didn't care for the finer details much you'd just think he's lazy in the school and clumsy.
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It's OK to feel PTS is wrong.

I brought the microcob home after the vet call with her huge list of problems to give myself breathing space. She now happily hacks but I would have kept her as a pet because she's a nice person & easy to have around.

No rush. Take time to think through options.
 
I’m so very sorry but I don’t see a happy ending here for you. It’s so sad, awful and you must feel as though it can’t be real.

Your experience is the definition of why we must look holistically at the horse and why nothing is in isolation.

My own experiences of ataxia/cvsm etc was absolutely devastating, my boy is in my photo. Two things give me comfort when I look back: We tackled it head on ASAP and had him PTS there and then to save him the drive home. And secondly the huge learning curve that has gone on to help lots of other horses in my care, it’s been night and day.

I’m so sorry that your determination to get the best treatment for your horse has such a sad outcome.
 
IrishMilo said:
Ex racer, 6. Owned for a year. Persistent tripping issue and has never been able to work on a contact. Teeth done multiple times, bitting specialist came, no difference. I have a great farrier who works with the vet who saw him today, he shoes him with a rolled toe and side clips.

X rays - we did neck, hock, feet, and knees:

- Mild navicular both fronts
- Severe changes C4-C7
- Severe OA both hocks, bone spur right hind
- Old trauma to right knee, poss fracture

2/10ths lame right fore and hind.

I really don’t know how to move forward - I feel in a strange state of shock.

Do I just immediately retire him? Take his shoes off, turn away for 6 months and rehab his feet? (this was the plan before this anyway).

Is anything other than light hacking now cruel?

His sole depth was 2mms with a negative palmar angle each foot. Apparently normal depth is 15-30mms. I’m less concerned about his feet as I know this can be sorted.

But everything else… Argh.






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I'm so so sorry you've had this diagnosis with him. I always really enjoyed your updates in the retraining racehorses thread.
I hope you are ok, it's an awful lot to take in. Make sure you take care of yourself while you decide what is best for his future, sending hugs.
 
Marigold4 said:
I think I would X ray the spine to see if he has kissing spine as well, and maybe scan suspensories. It's difficult to know what to do without knowing the full picture. Sorry that this has happened.
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But would this change anything? A horse I know had lots of the issues on your list and did actually have kissing spines too…they operated on him to try and treat the kissing spines then when he didn’t come right they xrayed everything else and found the navicular, severe hock arthritis…had they known about that they would not have had the surgery on him first. He had started rehab and became worse hence more investigations. With hindsight the owner wishes they’d never put them through it. The horse was 6 and PTS after the X-rays and scans rather than being him home.

It’s a horrible situation to be in I do feel for you x
 
We've had a chat tonight and decided that we're going to retire him. Neither of us wants to go down the invasive route for the sake of a few hacks a week and we don't feel it's fair on him to be put through all that.

He can be a pet as long as he looks happy in the field, we both love the bones of him. I will SO miss him taking me galloping, it's the only thing he's good at!!
 
IrishMilo said:
We've had a chat tonight and decided that we're going to retire him. Neither of us wants to go down the invasive route for the sake of a few hacks a week and we don't feel it's fair on him to be put through all that.

He can be a pet as long as he looks happy in the field, we both love the bones of him. I will SO miss him taking me galloping, it's the only thing he's good at!!
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That sounds like a really good idea, ☺️
 
IrishMilo said:
We've had a chat tonight and decided that we're going to retire him. Neither of us wants to go down the invasive route for the sake of a few hacks a week and we don't feel it's fair on him to be put through all that.

He can be a pet as long as he looks happy in the field, we both love the bones of him. I will SO miss him taking me galloping, it's the only thing he's good at!!
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I don't blame you. I just couldn't have Lari pts either and judging by how he's rallied this Summer glad I gave him the chance.

A long as you are prepared to keep assessing him I see no reason why he can't live a happy retirement. It's such a relief when you reach a decision no matter the direction that decision takes you. Sometimes when you can see the woods for the trees it's good to take a step back and see how it goes. Good luck!
 
IrishMilo said:
We've had a chat tonight and decided that we're going to retire him. Neither of us wants to go down the invasive route for the sake of a few hacks a week and we don't feel it's fair on him to be put through all that.

He can be a pet as long as he looks happy in the field, we both love the bones of him. I will SO miss him taking me galloping, it's the only thing he's good at!!
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Sounds like a good plan.

Please make sure your both on the same page with what is 'happy in the field' - as you say you both love the bones of him and want to do right by him, but we all have slightly different views on these things. I wouldn't want you friendship to be put under pressure because of differing opinions later down the line, especially at a time when you need each other and the horse needs you both.

Take care of yourself and each other.
 
He's such a handsome lad. I'm so sorry it has been such a lousy diagnosis. I'm another who would likely PTS eventually in the nearish future but understands that sometimes you need headspace and time for yourself too. He's lucky to have had someone who cared enough to investigate and someone who, I am sure, will call time when it's time. I would not ride or lunge him though for my own and his safety.
 
Have a look at the ‘barefoot rehab for navicular’ group on Facebook, I’ve taken mine barefoot and honestly never thought he’d transition, he’s doing amazing, he used to trip over fresh air, now it’s like he knows where his feet are and can position better, he is retired as has a multitude of issues, but he’s likely along same lines, 10 year old ex-racer that was heavy raced as won….🤦🏻‍♀️

He had nerve impingement in neck too, broken pelvis, start of arthritis in knees, likely hocks too, not think it now in field mind, living life like pays his own vets bills is ted! 😂

It may not hurt while he’s out on downtime while get your head around it all? At least to let you absorb it all in, is he in pain, does he fight carrier, to get up/down etc, all the usual things and the not so usual, like mine was dragging his leg and back was up, turned out his urethra was flat with a massive bean…..removed and relaxed, he had one spinal injections course and rest was intensive rehabbing the body BUT was all slow work :)

Whatever decide he’s your horse, you know him best and what he can and can’t do 👍🏻
 
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