How would you deal with these two scenarios?

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GeorgeyGal

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Just got me thinking after reading threads on for and against using physical reprimand and was curious as to how peeps would deal with these situations, especially those that never use physical reprimand?

1. Your usually good mannered horse tries kicking the vet who is trying to examine an injured leg (obvious pain response).

2. You are riding and your horse suddenly kicks out at another horse, would you correct with whip if to hand or other?
 
GeorgeyGal said:
Just got me thinking after reading threads on for and against using physical reprimand and was curious as to how peeps would deal with these situations, especially those that never use physical reprimand?

1. Your usually good mannered horse tries kicking the vet who is trying to examine an injured leg (obvious pain response).

2. You are riding and your horse suddenly kicks out at another horse, would you correct with whip if to hand or other?
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1. An angry growl and a 'stand up'. Pick up opposite foot and allow vet to continue.
2. Depending on the horse & situation then I would not rule out one hard crack up the backside with a whip.
 
GeorgeyGal said:
Just got me thinking after reading threads on for and against using physical reprimand and was curious as to how peeps would deal with these situations, especially those that never use physical reprimand?

1. Your usually good mannered horse tries kicking the vet who is trying to examine an injured leg (obvious pain response).

2. You are riding and your horse suddenly kicks out at another horse, would you correct with whip if to hand or other?
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1. Your usually good mannered horse tries kicking the vet who is trying to examine an injured leg (obvious pain response).

Understand that it is in pain due to injury, but he would definitely get a stern telling off as it unacceptable to ever lash out at a human.


2. You are riding and your horse suddenly kicks out at another horse, would you correct with whip if to hand or other?[/QUOTE]

I don't carry a whip on my horse, but it again would get a slap with the reins and a good boll**ing!
 
1. I would have been holding a leg up to prevent kicking in the first place and/ or twitch on.

2. Would give hard smack for lashing out at another horse depending on situation, ie if no reason to lash out. Had
the horse been run into from behind ?
 
GeorgeyGal said:
Just got me thinking after reading threads on for and against using physical reprimand and was curious as to how peeps would deal with these situations, especially those that never use physical reprimand?

1. Your usually good mannered horse tries kicking the vet who is trying to examine an injured leg (obvious pain response).
I'd understand that the horse was in pain and therefore I would 'tscht!' the horse and tell it to stand still. Or neck twitch it.

2. You are riding and your horse suddenly kicks out at another horse, would you correct with whip if to hand or other?
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I would tell the other rider to keep their horse out of my horse's space! I don't ride with a whip but in any case it's not necessarily the horse's fault for kicking out at another horse who's up his tail.
 
Spring Feather said:
I would tell the other rider to keep their horse out of my horse's space! I don't ride with a whip but in any case it's not necessarily the horse's fault for kicking out at another horse who's up his tail.
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See, I expect my horses, under reasonable circumstances not to kick out at others (even if they are close),
Obviously there are a multitude of scenario's whereby a horse may kick out, but on a day-to-day basis it's a no no for me.
 
1. Your usually good mannered horse tries kicking the vet who is trying to examine an injured leg (obvious pain response).

I would not reprimand at all the horse is in obvious pain and the vet should sedate if that bad!

2. You are riding and your horse suddenly kicks out at another horse, would you correct with whip if to hand or other?

Sharp quick hit with whip and growl!
 
I'd do the same as Spring Feather.

I'd also expect both myself and the vet to be suitably experienced enough to be prepared for such a reaction and either pre empt it before it happened or be positioned correctly so as not to in the direct line of fire.

The horse that got kicked was too close.
 
I have a working qh cattle horse, she's a mare. I've owned her for almost 9 years. She's a fabulous little mare. She works cattle well and will be bopped around by them and will also bang into them if they don't do what she tells them. She is not known for ever kicking. You'll never see her kick in her field. However ... there is an acquaintance that I occasionally have the bad luck to meet while out on rides. My mare has no problem riding with any other horse so no worries on that score. This acquaintance has this hideous habit of, when we are slowing down from canter to walk (with my hand raised, as is trail custom over here) she will allow her horse to run into the back of my mare. Twice I've been in the same situation with this acquaintance. When her horse runs into my horse's butt the first time, my mare does nothing. The second time within 10 or 20 mins is also not reacted to, but my mare apparently only gives 2 chances and the third time the other horse has run into her, my mare lifts a leg and kicks out. Both times this has happened, my mare has missed the horse but kicked the rider on the leg instead. Both times I've told her to stop running into my mare, then I've turned my head to the front again and sniggered quietly. I have no time for stupid people who could potentially injure my horse and I have no sympathy for the bruises this foolish person must have sustained.
 
Sure, that's one example out of a multitude.
I could name a few too.
But a blanket statement of 'I would tell the other rider to keep their horse out of my horse's space! I don't ride with a whip but in any case it's not necessarily the horse's fault for kicking out at another horse who's up his tail. ' doesn't cut it for me I'm afraid.
 
1. If it kicked I would growl at it but handle the situation however we would be holding up another leg and or twitching or sedating to stop it happening in the first place.
2. Reprimand with the whip , I grew up producing hunters we always reprimand for kicking its never acceptable for them to kick , it may be understandable but it's never acceptable .
I was very proud of j when on his fourth day hunting an out of control horse ran into him side on he just braced himself and he was very sharp about his back end when I first got him , however I kept him way out of the way after that for the rest of the day just in case it had rattled him.
 
ihatework said:
But a blanket statement of 'I would tell the other rider to keep their horse out of my horse's space! I don't ride with a whip but in any case it's not necessarily the horse's fault for kicking out at another horse who's up his tail. ' doesn't cut it for me I'm afraid.
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Ok here's a blanket statement which cannot be misconstrued or twisted - if another horse is not within kicking range of any horse, it will not get kicked.
 
my old horse has a wound on his back leg and was so sore that even doped up he wouldnt let the vet near it to staple. i couldnt tell him off as he was the type to fight back and also because he was doped there was a risk of him falling if he reacted. we had to work around it and couldnt staple it in the end. had to clean it by spraying it with the hose and pinning him in and spraying with antiseptic spray. so i guess no i wouldnt tell a horse off for being in pain and reacting to it. maybe im too soft but thats my view on it. i know if i was sore i would wish i could get away with kicking whoever tries poking and prodding my wound lol.

as for the kicking, i have always been told that it is the rider of the horse behind to not get too close, every horsey person should know that horses have the potential to kick so therefore surley it is the riders responsibility to minimize that risk. that said if a horse was to go out of his way/be nasty about it then i would give a sharp smack straight away, i dont carry a whip so this would be with the reins or my hand.
 
My horse is an established kicker - he hates anyone else in his space. He will pin ears and tail swish if they get close, which I growl at, but when they get up his bum he double barrels. I always wear a red ribbon on him, and am very aware of where everyone else is at all times and which way his bum is pointed. No matter how much I growl at him he will still do it, and unfortunately he's a horse who explodes if you touch him with a whip, he really overreacts to punishment of any kind, so avoidance of any horse gettin near his bum is the only tactic. Although my friends routinely let their horses canter up his bum and laugh when he tries to bronc me off :(
 
khalswitz said:
My horse is an established kicker - he hates anyone else in his space. He will pin ears and tail swish if they get close, which I growl at, but when they get up his bum he double barrels. I always wear a red ribbon on him, and am very aware of where everyone else is at all times and which way his bum is pointed. No matter how much I growl at him he will still do it, and unfortunately he's a horse who explodes if you touch him with a whip, he really overreacts to punishment of any kind, so avoidance of any horse gettin near his bum is the only tactic. Although my friends routinely let their horses canter up his bum and laugh when he tries to bronc me off :(
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Are your friends mad or don't they like their horses ?
 
Spring Feather said:
Ok here's a blanket statement which cannot be misconstrued or twisted - if another horse is not within kicking range of any horse, it will not get kicked.
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That is true up to a point but hunting is one situation where horse do end up in your space it goes with the territory you often end up catching up loose horses holding strange horses when the whip or hunts man are off them .
Crowded collecting rings are another place where even the most careful person can end up too close
It's best to invest time training them not too.
 
Goldenstar said:
Are your friends mad or don't they like their horses ?
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I wish I knew! I don't normally see what happens as they're behind me... One of my friends says her horse is just very strong and he is very clingy to my horse, so when he does get too close (doesn't happen very often, probably happened three or four times in the last six months) and my horse tries for him, she laughs it off and says he was having a strong moment. The other friend just thinks its funny that my horse is so grumpy and ill mannered compared to hers.

I just prefer hacking alone now tbh as he doesn't pull faces at all then and I'm not worrying about anyone else being an idiot and then Getting hurt...

Eta he's never actually landed one on them, hence the lack of care I think. I am VERY quick when I feel warning signs to swing his quarters and put his aim off.
 
There are of course various exclusions but generally

1) Very firm No! , possibly a yank on the halter but otherwise not make a huge fuss. The legs hurts and now is not the time to have a fight over it. And lots of praise when then horse is brave.

2) a very hard smack on the bum and a verbal *******ing. It does need to instant though. 5 seconds later, once you've faffed about and taken time to process what happened is too late. The other rider may or may not get a *******ing too!
 
ihatework said:
1. An angry growl and a 'stand up'. Pick up opposite foot and allow vet to continue.
2. Depending on the horse & situation then I would not rule out one hard crack up the backside with a whip.
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This ^ Although for question 2 I would have to be careful as my mare kicks out/bucks when hit with a whip so I would have to make sure she wasn't in a situation where she could cause further harm to the other horse.
 
Spring Feather said:
I would tell the other rider to keep their horse out of my horse's space! I don't ride with a whip but in any case it's not necessarily the horse's fault for kicking out at another horse who's up his tail.
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same....my old mare is very possessive about her space.....no one gets close to her on a hack or in the school as she will kick them its that simple.
 
1. I would assume pain reaction rather than actual intention to kick, so would tell to stand and lift other leg if needed to stop him lifting the injured one.
2. Mine does kick in certain situations; (horses, not people) I can tell when he is considering it and give him a warning then rather than wait for him to do it. I never carry a whip and would not smack him with one as a punishment. I just make sure there is sufficient space between his bum and the target to avoid a mishap.
 
I guess what I was getting at is do you reprimand a horse for kicking even if it is not the horses fault, ie pain response or through others stupidity, ie bolshy other horse/dog etc. Some people I've spoken to say there is never an excuse for kicking as it is dangerous behaviour and could carry on into other areas if they have got away with it once, and others say there are exclusions.

Apologies, I can see my examples could contain too many variables but this is what I was getting at.

Interesting replies, thank you. I guess like myself you would have to be in the situation in order to know how you would react at the time and then make the best decision you can, but given the very short time frame to reprimand I often wonder what I would do and what the best course of action would be.
 
ihatework said:
1. An angry growl and a 'stand up'. Pick up opposite foot and allow vet to continue.
2. Depending on the horse & situation then I would not rule out one hard crack up the backside with a whip.
Click to expand...

This. Although I'd probably already be holding my mare foot up anyway as she's not a huge fan of vets and will often play up.
 
Depends on which horse I'm handling, tbh. The youngster is/was terrified of vets and had been very badly handled around them as a foal (pinned in a corner, shouted at, hit, etc, which just made her explode and lash out). So, in response to a) - the vet I prefer and I had a total non-reaction policy. If she snatched her leg away, he let it go, then quietly picked it up again. Patience and persistence, loads of praise when she tolerated it. (If it had been a serious injury, we'd've sedated her). The only time she did actually belt one of the vets was when he kept hanging onto an injured leg, then leaping about if she snatched it. She warned him several times then kicked and meant it. Since it was at the point of putting the dressing on, I said 'no' sharply, flipped the rope over her neck and did it myself. She stood perfectly quietly. The older two would get a stern 'no' and another foot picked up, praise for patience.

In response to b) the older two (who know better) would get a growl and a smack, the baby a growl and a sharp sending forward. I also tell people to stay out of her space a bit and tend to move her out of crowded spots so she doesn't get uptight enough to strike out. With her it's very much a confidence thing and is improving the more sure of herself she becomes. I won't tolerate kicking long term, but will try to resolve it as appropriate to the horse.
 
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