HOYS today - shocked at 'professional's' behaviour

UPDATE on Ben Maher at HOYS from the FEI to VANAH

Thank you for your email.

Following your comments, we can confirm that Ben Maher (GBR) was officially reprimanded by the President of the Ground Jury and the Foreign Judge after the incident at the Horse of the Year Show. The horse was also given a thorough veterinary examination after the incident and was given a clean bill of health.

With best regards,

Corporate Communications
Fédération Equestre Internationale
Chemin de la Joliette 8
1006 Lausanne
Switzerland

#vanah Very pleased to hear the horse was ok afterwards and received a veterinary inspection. Clearly Ben DID do something wrong if his actions warranted a caution, just as most people believed!
And very much despite his very venomous attacks to people who speak out, by his die hard friends and supporters who claim he is perfect!
 
sammy0878 said:
I'm not saying it's right touchstone but one minute youre riding a good stride to a 160 fence the next your horse is heading towards a person on the ground. What did you want him to do? Let go of his reins and give the horse a polo?? I'm pretty sure when he pulled that horse up it wasn't to make it go over!
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Here's the problem, Ben Maher WASN'T riding a good stride to a 1.60 fence. It was clear that the horse couldn't make the distance hence the half stride and refusal. There was no reason other than he couldn't make the distance for that horse to refuse, he'd already jumped the previous similar fence. Horses do actually try to do what they're asked.
 
Over 52,000 views - hopefully if nothing else Ben M (and any other wayward show jumper) will be aware what negative exposure they can expect if they treat their horses badly publicly - and if you read this Ben, the best way to avoid treating a horse badly in public, is to train yourself to treat them fairly all the time, then you will have other solutions on hand when you need them in the ring.
 
sammy0878 said:
I'm not saying it's right touchstone but one minute youre riding a good stride to a 160 fence the next your horse is heading towards a person on the ground. What did you want him to do? Let go of his reins and give the horse a polo?? I'm pretty sure when he pulled that horse up it wasn't to make it go over!
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I was within forty metres of this incident with a perfect side on view. The horse was HALTED nose to nose with an official before Ben pulled it backwards and then over onto its side.

He did it in two stages, the first to get it back off the official and the second in sheer and obvious temper.
 
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Someone commented on the FB page that they have seen far, far worse in BS classes from both adults and children. I merely said that whatever happened elsewhere was neither here nor there, but someone is such a position as BM, and so high profile needed to be seen to be beyond reproach. Hardly contentious, but it has been deleted. :(
 
Fellewell said:
That was not a fall and the 'correction' meted out by Maher had no training value whatsoever.
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Yes, but sometimes a horse needs to know it has done something wrong or that it has been naughty. That is what telling off is for. In no uncertain terms! Several cracks with the whip, HARD, would have been better in retrospect. Leave the real reprimanding till later...
 
fburton said:
Yes, but sometimes a horse needs to know it has done something wrong or that it has been naughty. That is what telling off is for. In no uncertain terms! Several cracks with the whip, HARD, would have been better in retrospect. Leave the real reprimanding till later...
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You are being fasicious, aren't you??
 
fburton said:
Yes, but sometimes a horse needs to know it has done something wrong or that it has been naughty. That is what telling off is for. In no uncertain terms! Several cracks with the whip, HARD, would have been better in retrospect. Leave the real reprimanding till later...
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Real reprimanding? ... The incident shows it's rider error so why crack it with a whip 'HARD' when it's not the horses fault? Assuming your referring to Maher of course.
 
Vanah.Horses said:
UPDATE on Ben Maher at HOYS from the FEI to VANAH

Thank you for your email.

Following your comments, we can confirm that Ben Maher (GBR) was officially reprimanded by the President of the Ground Jury and the Foreign Judge after the incident at the Horse of the Year Show. The horse was also given a thorough veterinary examination after the incident and was given a clean bill of health.

With best regards,

Corporate Communications
Fédération Equestre Internationale
Chemin de la Joliette 8
1006 Lausanne
Switzerland

#vanah Very pleased to hear the horse was ok afterwards and received a veterinary inspection. Clearly Ben DID do something wrong if his actions warranted a caution, just as most people believed!
And very much despite his very venomous attacks to people who speak out, by his die hard friends and supporters who claim he is perfect!
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Well done VANAH, and everyone, who took the time to write a complaint.
 
fburton said:
Yes, but sometimes a horse needs to know it has done something wrong or that it has been naughty. That is what telling off is for. In no uncertain terms! Several cracks with the whip, HARD, would have been better in retrospect. Leave the real reprimanding till later...
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I take it this sarcasm or else I'm baffled by this quote. Horses are generous creatures who try their best with the requests we make of them, we have no right to batter them into submission over fences, if they don't want to take them on for their own reasons, be it bad stride, lack of confidence for a second etc - If an otherwise honest horse refused a jump I'd give it the benefit of the doubt and re-present calmly.
 
fburton said:
Yes, but sometimes a horse needs to know it has done something wrong or that it has been naughty. That is what telling off is for. In no uncertain terms! Several cracks with the whip, HARD, would have been better in retrospect. Leave the real reprimanding till later...
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What do you mean "leave the reprimanding till later"?
 
fburton said:
Yes, it was a sarcastic pastiche of a certain mentality. "Telling a horse off" in a way that isn't firmly rooted in sound behavioural principles is anathema to me. Sorry if I alarmed or offended anyone.
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i was wondering !?! didn't sound like your normal response!
 
blazingsaddles said:
What do you mean "leave the reprimanding till later"?
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fburton is being ironic. The way I read his comment was that certain people think nothing of cracking a horse hard with the whip as a reprimand (which they view as being good training), yet are up in arms about this. I think he is also commenting that many people will do that in public but much worse in private. At least that's how I read his comment.

ETA: I have just seen that he has explained his comment now!
 
Wagtail said:
fburton is being ironic. The way I read his comment was that certain people think nothing of cracking a horse hard with the whip as a reprimand (which they view as being good training), yet are up in arms about this. I think he is also commenting that many people will do that in public but much worse in private. At least that's how I read his comment.
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Thanks WT - I did think what a strange post from a 'normally' sensible poster!
 
All of the rounds were being filmed by the Shows Video producers,
They had the same side on view that I had.
I am pleased at least some action has been taken,
Did we ever find out who owns the horse?
 
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dneXQOCwyTg

I'd be interested in thoughts on a bit of this video, start at 0:45. Young horse started pulling so he stops it at a wall, puts "leg on, hands back" resulting in a couple of rears before he gives up and moves on. Can anyone tell me what he might have been hoping to achieve because it doesn't make sense to me?
 
He was trying to achieve rein back. The horse was getting strong and probably a bit on its forehand, rein back in this instance would encourage the horse to come back onto it's quarters and learn forward isn't the only direction it may be asked to travel in. It should also encourage the horse to listen better to hand aids such as the half halt.

In this case he doesn't know the horse and it may not understand rein back (or used to different aids for rein back) and got a bit confused of what was being asked of it. The horse also has a weak topline which can make rein back a harder exercise. As the horse was displaying unwanted behaviour repeatedly, BM made the decision not to persist as in front of an audience.

He should have also exercised that restraint at HOYS.
 
fburton said:
Yes, but sometimes a horse needs to know it has done something wrong or that it has been naughty. That is what telling off is for. In no uncertain terms! Several cracks with the whip, HARD, would have been better in retrospect. Leave the real reprimanding till later...
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That's the ticket! Work against your horse's sense of self-preservation and they'll always try their heart out for you. Especially if they associate being ridden under pressure with harsh consequences.

Might have to disagree about the judicious use of a whip. If used at the exact moment of unwanted behaviour with split second timing. Never in temper and never by anyone who thinks a horse can be 'naughty'.
 
I gave up riding with a whip years ago I always found my young horses went better for praise than any punishment. However I don't produce a certain discipline I allow the horse to follow what it enjoys I see no point making a horse compete in dressage when it enjoys jumping or vice versa. I have also found my voice works better than a whip.
 
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