Scratchline
Well-Known Member
Perhaps you could start a little fan club (snigger)
Hunting: The Tide is Turning
- Thread starter DavidDent
- Start date
Perhaps you could start a little fan club (snigger)
HeWasGeeBee
Well-Known Member
Scratchline by posting comments like ZZZZZZZZZZZ do you not realise that you just come across like a complete tosser?
Scratchline
Well-Known Member
Oh FFS! You have one serious flaw in your arguement and banging on about NAZI this and NAZI that is not only pathetic it is desperate!
Typically you will spout your bile and outragous attacks yet refuse to engage those who dont immediately kiss your backside. Fine, I couldnt give two hoots. You ignore all the people like me, all the number 5's you have to leave off your list because you fear us.
For others, number 5's are born in the countryside. Live and work in the countryside and are 100% behind the banning of fox hunting as was.
Fox hunting as was is cruel, wrong and unnaceptable regardless of DD's rather emotional, sensationalist, stereotypical nonsense.
The law should be changed, I agree. The answer is trained marksmen, all very simple and the least cruel. Chasing a fox for however long and then the hounds killing it is cruel and therefore illegal and not before time IMO.
It is a blood sport and will not be tolerated by people like me!
Typically you will spout your bile and outragous attacks yet refuse to engage those who dont immediately kiss your backside. Fine, I couldnt give two hoots. You ignore all the people like me, all the number 5's you have to leave off your list because you fear us.
For others, number 5's are born in the countryside. Live and work in the countryside and are 100% behind the banning of fox hunting as was.
Fox hunting as was is cruel, wrong and unnaceptable regardless of DD's rather emotional, sensationalist, stereotypical nonsense.
The law should be changed, I agree. The answer is trained marksmen, all very simple and the least cruel. Chasing a fox for however long and then the hounds killing it is cruel and therefore illegal and not before time IMO.
It is a blood sport and will not be tolerated by people like me!
HeWasGeeBee
Well-Known Member
The wound/kill ration is the same for trained marksmen as it is for inexperienced shots. It is just that trained marksmen hit a higher proportion of foxes whereas inexperienced shots miss more.
If I (a crap shot) went out shooting foxes I'd cause far less suffering than an experienced shot.
If I (a crap shot) went out shooting foxes I'd cause far less suffering than an experienced shot.
CorvusCorax
'It's only a laugh, no harm done'
Scratchline, you and I had a perfectly civil debate on the DDA in Latest News a while ago, we agreed with each others points and you wished me luck with my dog, which I really appreciated.
We can agree on some issues and disagree on others, can we not, and still remain civil?
Cheers!
DavidDent
Member
The origin of the very term 'animal rights' attached to a firm philosophy was Heinrich Himmler.
This is will documented. They of course banned foxhunting too.
Once again it is the antis who show their complete ignorance; or more likely the eagerness to forget the origin of their abhorrent ideas were the Nazis.
I have posted links earlier in this thread but here they are again.
http://huntfacts.org.uk/hitler.htm
http://www.kaltio.fi/index.php?494
The problem becomes NOT if you think hunting or fur are cruel. BUT that you think you can enforce your morality on other who do not share it. In doing so and the ban coming into effect, you hasten the demise of habitat for many species. The fact that you believe you have moral authority over others brings you into believing you have the right to resport to conflict and violence; including the intimidation of others who do not share your beliefs. This is also typical of the mindset of Fascism.
I am not in a forum that is anti hunting. It is you the antis who are here being abusive.
Every time you post you show what kind of people you are, to many who perhaps are uncommitted on the issue. Thank you this helps enormously in winning the case.You are clearly motivated by hate not misplaced compassion.
This is will documented. They of course banned foxhunting too.
Once again it is the antis who show their complete ignorance; or more likely the eagerness to forget the origin of their abhorrent ideas were the Nazis.
I have posted links earlier in this thread but here they are again.
http://huntfacts.org.uk/hitler.htm
http://www.kaltio.fi/index.php?494
The problem becomes NOT if you think hunting or fur are cruel. BUT that you think you can enforce your morality on other who do not share it. In doing so and the ban coming into effect, you hasten the demise of habitat for many species. The fact that you believe you have moral authority over others brings you into believing you have the right to resport to conflict and violence; including the intimidation of others who do not share your beliefs. This is also typical of the mindset of Fascism.
I am not in a forum that is anti hunting. It is you the antis who are here being abusive.
Every time you post you show what kind of people you are, to many who perhaps are uncommitted on the issue. Thank you this helps enormously in winning the case.You are clearly motivated by hate not misplaced compassion.
Scratchline
Well-Known Member
Point taken, it was unfair of me and I apologise.
CorvusCorax
'It's only a laugh, no harm done'
No worries!
HeWasGeeBee
Well-Known Member
Give him a big whop on his bot
Scratchline
Well-Known Member
The origin of the very term 'animal rights' attached to a firm philosophy was Heinrich Himmler.
This is will documented. They of course banned foxhunting too.
Once again it is the antis who show their complete ignorance; or more likely the eagerness to forget the origin of their abhorrent ideas were the Nazis.The Nazi's didnt get everything wrong. Understanding and being against foxhunting doesnt make someone a supporter of Hitlers Germany and your constant referal to Nazism in relation to those who merely believe foxhunting to be cruel is offensive and frankly childlike.
The problem becomes NOT if you think hunting or fur are cruel. BUT that you think you can enforce your morality on other who do not share it.Absolute nonsense. The ban was the result of a democratic decision by an elected government who fully represented the views of the vast majority of my fellow countrymen. You just dont like it. Your arguement can be used by those who support any banned blood sports. It is you who out of place on this forum, not I and I am sure the moderators are watching you very carefully chum.
In doing so and the ban coming into effect, you hasten the demise of habitat for many species. The fact that you believe you have moral authority over others brings you into believing you have the right to resport to conflict and violence; including the intimidation of others who do not share your beliefs. This is also typical of the mindset of Fascism.Fascism? lol lol Your not right mate PMSL
I am not in a forum that is anti hunting. It is you the antis who are here being abusive.The vast majority of members of this forum do not post about hunting either way so are not known to be pro hunting actually. And it is you who has appeared here name calling those who do not support hunting. If you cant takle it but like to dish it you could always trot off mate!
Really lol lol lol Everytime you post your anti fascism extremist views you just make me laugh
Scratchline
Well-Known Member
Give him a big whop on his bot
Very funny but I am a tad to big to be physically chastised and wouldnt respond kindly lol lol
Scratchline
Well-Known Member
Thanks. I will leave this thread to you lot. Cannot stomach much more of our newbie, Stan Boardman and his crazy German fixation! lol lol
Springs
Well-Known Member
soggy
Well-Known Member
Not necessarily! Initially it makes you a utter spamhead, the trolling and bullshitting usually comes later. When you find yourself over matched, and ill informed.
DavidDent
Member
The Nazis banned foxhunting. That is fact.
Heinrich Himmler was the first to formally write about 'animal rights' in an in house SS magazine. The ideas became an integral part of Nazi politics.
There is no dispute. The links I gave include Mark Almond professor of Modern History at Oxford.
It is an abuse of democracy to attack the way of life of a minority.
QUOTE SCRATCHLINE: 'The Nazi's didnt get everything wrong'
I rest my case. I do hope that while the hunting of trolls on this board is banned it is acceptable to flush them.
Heinrich Himmler was the first to formally write about 'animal rights' in an in house SS magazine. The ideas became an integral part of Nazi politics.
There is no dispute. The links I gave include Mark Almond professor of Modern History at Oxford.
It is an abuse of democracy to attack the way of life of a minority.
QUOTE SCRATCHLINE: 'The Nazi's didnt get everything wrong'
I rest my case. I do hope that while the hunting of trolls on this board is banned it is acceptable to flush them.
rosie fronfelen
Well-Known Member
well, do us all a favour and stick to what you say and take yourself off, you write utter tripe mainly to wind up, you are a nasty ill-informed bigot and not fit to be on what is a hunting forum, not an anti hunting forum. if you can hold a reasonable debate fair enough but you can't! you dare to come on here and argue with the many people who know and understand the real needs for hunting and abuse them all.
Scratchline
Well-Known Member
I was going to leave you to your rants but whilst you continue to post this nonsense maybe I shouldnt let you without response. Yes, the Nazis banned fox hunting. So yes, my statement about them not getting everything wrong stands regardless of the fact you now desperately try to use it against me?! lol lol
I will not apologise for believing some of Hitlers policies were bloody fantastic. What I find absolutely abhorant is 'some', of HIS methods of reaching HIS goals.
Elimination of unemployment.
Elimination of hyperinflation.
Expansion of production of consumer goods to improve middle- and lower-class living standards. Why shouldnt I see such things as good policy whether it be our governments or the Nazis????!!!!
You obviously have some serious issue with certain politics. Fine. But this is the Horse and Hound forum. Not the anti nazi league were you are no doubt well known ;o)
I will not apologise for believing some of Hitlers policies were bloody fantastic. What I find absolutely abhorant is 'some', of HIS methods of reaching HIS goals.
Elimination of unemployment.
Elimination of hyperinflation.
Expansion of production of consumer goods to improve middle- and lower-class living standards. Why shouldnt I see such things as good policy whether it be our governments or the Nazis????!!!!
You obviously have some serious issue with certain politics. Fine. But this is the Horse and Hound forum. Not the anti nazi league were you are no doubt well known ;o)
Scratchline
Well-Known Member
Oh look, you have taken me off ignore? ROTFLMAO at you as always.
It is not your forum, never has been. All you manage to do is post abuse with your potty little mouth. You are not on here discussing hunting, never have been so its not me who will be moving on thanks very much! lol lol lol
Scratchline
Well-Known Member
[/quote]Not necessarily! Initially it makes you a utter spamhead, the trolling and bullshitting usually comes later. When you find yourself over matched, and ill informed. [/quote]
Any chance you actually have anything to add to the debate or are YOU still just trolling and looking for a fight which you wouldnt be able to habdle either?
Any chance you actually have anything to add to the debate or are YOU still just trolling and looking for a fight which you wouldnt be able to habdle either?
rosie fronfelen
Well-Known Member
i pity Cornwall being stuck with you, it's such a lovely county with great hunting packs! that's it, more abuse and asides, that's all you know to print. i NEVER said it was "my" forum so grow up. i've tried to be reasonable but no you don't do "reason" just abuse. as i said this is a HUNTING forum not an ANTI hunting forum, and all you can do now is throw up this crap about Hitler and the Nazis, this is 2009 you know!!!!
Scratchline
Well-Known Member
I couldnt agree more. However, the vote to ban fox hunting as was merely matched the wishes of the vast majority of people in our country.
Now, all the supporters of hunting do is verbally attack those against it and scream time and time again that they just dont understand fox hunting. Happens to me, all the time on here and fortunately I just find it funny to be honest. What is very noticable is that if you support hunting you can post any attack you wish on an anti and nobody says a word, not one. An anti posts anything 'iffi', and all hell breaks loose on them. I think DD would say that is a bit like the Nazi's (only if he wasnt pro hunting of course!).
Fox hunting as was, is illegal and finished forever and no amount of attacks from some other posters (not yourself),on here is going to bring it back.
Scratchline
Well-Known Member
Wonderful. You come on here to abuse me out of the blue then complain that I abuse you? lol lol I take it you have broken up for the summer holiday young un!
Oh, and of course it is me who has 'thrown up crap', about Hitler and the Nazi's?! Not me responding to posts from one of yours who constantly harps on about them, who you just dare not criticise?!! See, you choose to ignore what others post but home in on me acting all big and tough.
Of the few idiots on this forum and fortunately most arent like you, you have to be the most daft. Keep it coming, you brighten my days buddy x x x
DavidDent
Member
I will now take you through what some of the modern leaders of the Animal Rights movement who 'educate' and use the muscle of the kind of antis we see here actually believe:
"We are not especially 'interested in'
animals. Neither of us had ever been
inordinately fond of dogs, cats, or
horses in the way that many people are.
We didn't 'love' animals." --Peter
Singer, Animal Liberation: A New
Ethic for Our Treatment of Animals,
2nd ed. (New York Review of Books,
1990),Preface, p. ii.
Peter Singer is the godfather of the modern animal rights and also believes in human eugenics.
"Pet ownership is an absolutely
abysmal situation brought
about by human manipulation."
-- Ingrid Newkirk, national director,
People for the Ethical Treatment of
Animals (PeTA), Just Like Us?
Toward a Nation of Animal Rights"
(symposium), Harper's, August 1988,
p. 50.
Ingrid Newkirk is head of PETA
"The cat, like the dog, must disappear
... We should cut the domestic cat free
from our dominance by neutering,
neutering, and more neutering, until our
pathetic version of the cat ceases to
exist." --John Bryant, Fettered
Kingdoms: An Examination of A
Changing Ethic
(Washington, DC: People for the
Ethical Treatment of Animals (PeTA),
1982), p. 15.
"Arson, property destruction, burglary
and theft are 'acceptable crimes'
when used for the animal cause."
-Alex Pacheco, Director, PeTA
"...the animal rights movement is not
concerned about species extinction.
An elephant is no more or less
important than a cow, just as a
dolphin is no more important than a
tuna...(In fact, many animal rights
advocates would argue that it is
better for the chimpanzee to become
extinct than to be exploited
continually in laboratories, zoos
and circuses." (Barbara Biel,
The Animals' Agenda, Vol 15 #3
Torturing a human being is almost
always wrong, but it is not absolutely
wrong." --Peter Singer, as quoted in
Josephine Donovan, "Animal Rights
and Feminist Theory, " Signs: Journal
of Women in Culture and
Society, Winter 1990, p. 357.
"Not only are the philosophies of
animal rights and animal welfare
separated by irreconcilable differences...
the enactment of animal welfare
measures actually impedes the
achievement of animal rights...
Welfare reforms, by their very nature,
can only serve to retard the pace
at which animal rights goals are
achieved." --Gary Francione and
Tom Regan, "A Movement's
Means Create Its Ends," The
Animals' Agenda,
January/February 1992, pp. 40-42.
These are the leaders of the animal right movement who have directly and indirectly influenced Labour policies. Anybody who cares about animal welfare or Conservation clearly has a great deal to fear from these ideas; which have a clear fascist agenda. It may be 2009 salimali but the ideas of these people...as our anti friend acknowledges...remain the same.
IFAW for example has a clear animal rights raison d'etre.
"We are not especially 'interested in'
animals. Neither of us had ever been
inordinately fond of dogs, cats, or
horses in the way that many people are.
We didn't 'love' animals." --Peter
Singer, Animal Liberation: A New
Ethic for Our Treatment of Animals,
2nd ed. (New York Review of Books,
1990),Preface, p. ii.
Peter Singer is the godfather of the modern animal rights and also believes in human eugenics.
"Pet ownership is an absolutely
abysmal situation brought
about by human manipulation."
-- Ingrid Newkirk, national director,
People for the Ethical Treatment of
Animals (PeTA), Just Like Us?
Toward a Nation of Animal Rights"
(symposium), Harper's, August 1988,
p. 50.
Ingrid Newkirk is head of PETA
"The cat, like the dog, must disappear
... We should cut the domestic cat free
from our dominance by neutering,
neutering, and more neutering, until our
pathetic version of the cat ceases to
exist." --John Bryant, Fettered
Kingdoms: An Examination of A
Changing Ethic
(Washington, DC: People for the
Ethical Treatment of Animals (PeTA),
1982), p. 15.
"Arson, property destruction, burglary
and theft are 'acceptable crimes'
when used for the animal cause."
-Alex Pacheco, Director, PeTA
"...the animal rights movement is not
concerned about species extinction.
An elephant is no more or less
important than a cow, just as a
dolphin is no more important than a
tuna...(In fact, many animal rights
advocates would argue that it is
better for the chimpanzee to become
extinct than to be exploited
continually in laboratories, zoos
and circuses." (Barbara Biel,
The Animals' Agenda, Vol 15 #3
Torturing a human being is almost
always wrong, but it is not absolutely
wrong." --Peter Singer, as quoted in
Josephine Donovan, "Animal Rights
and Feminist Theory, " Signs: Journal
of Women in Culture and
Society, Winter 1990, p. 357.
"Not only are the philosophies of
animal rights and animal welfare
separated by irreconcilable differences...
the enactment of animal welfare
measures actually impedes the
achievement of animal rights...
Welfare reforms, by their very nature,
can only serve to retard the pace
at which animal rights goals are
achieved." --Gary Francione and
Tom Regan, "A Movement's
Means Create Its Ends," The
Animals' Agenda,
January/February 1992, pp. 40-42.
These are the leaders of the animal right movement who have directly and indirectly influenced Labour policies. Anybody who cares about animal welfare or Conservation clearly has a great deal to fear from these ideas; which have a clear fascist agenda. It may be 2009 salimali but the ideas of these people...as our anti friend acknowledges...remain the same.
IFAW for example has a clear animal rights raison d'etre.
rosie fronfelen
Well-Known Member
i get what you are saying but, do we have to buckle at the knees and "fear" these imbeciles? to just let them bully all who don't agree with their farcical ideas- no!! i live in the real world, not attached to the students, the clever city types, the quacks and the benefit freaks with nowt else to do- i am a farmers wife, living deep in the country, supporting hunting. i refuse to be preached at by these typeswhen i know that the bloody fox is going to do his best to kill my chooks and our lambs next spring- this is MY concern- the rest of this darned world with it's bureaucratic crap can go to hell!
soggy
Well-Known Member
Gosh you are feeling brave. Especially if read in conjunction with your earlier post
A less stout heart might read the above as attempted threats. LOL
Unfortunately for you I always add to the debate, the fact that you dislike those additions matters not in the slightest.l
DavidDent
Member
Unfortunately Salimali it is the insular nature of what you are saying, whilst no doubt correct, that the vast majority of people have not understood. Unless there are sounder reasons for justifying hunting the majority will not accept it: they have to have it explained why traditional hunting with hounds:
1. Is the fairest most discriminate and humane method of control as opposed to say poison or shooting.
2. Has as a side benefit the best habitat conservation for a whole host of species of flora and fauna: the landscape and countryside of the UK is that way through hunting, shooting, game , fishing etc.
Unfortunately it is the ignorant urban bereaucrats petit bourgois and student-types that have come to exert control over the rest of us. It is time for academics , conservationists and hunters and animal farmers themselves to explain 'why' to the public and this IS working. We have seen the public go from 80% in favour of a ban to 59% in favour of a repeal in just a few years; and a massive revival in the use of fur in fashions.
Most reasonable people when they see the hideous agenda of the animal rights lobby and how extreme they are lose sympathy for them very quickly.
People say
"you can't just condemn animal rights ideas out of hand, surely they are just trying to improve animal welfare?"
to "oh my God I didn't know what they stood for I will stand against them too"
Very quickly. Most reasonable people do NOT want to stop eating meat , seeing a prairie or soya landscape with habitat destroyed or facing a future where there are no cats or dogs or horses.
Education is the key; to what these people really want and its no less than what you read in the quotes above from the principals in the movement.
However the media is stacked against us getting our points across.
One example of this was a recent Channel 4 documentary broadcast two long discredited pieces of film purporting to show fur farms. They were nothing of the sort. Despite presenting channel 4 with the evidence that the claims were fradulent, they STILL have not issued a retraction. I will not rest until the truth comes out.
When you see the advertising budgets of animal rights organisations it is clear why the media is keen to lap up to them.
It is ridiculous that people sympathise for example with PETA and think they care about animals when this is what they do:
http://www.petakillsanimals.com/petaTrial2.cfm
The Hunting fraternity as a lobby has to unite with other targets of the animals rights lobby , and Conservationists Anthropolgists and those concerned with genuine animal welfare and start winning the battle for hearts and minds by showing just how insidious and abhorrent the animal rights movement is.
Demons don't go to hell on their own; they have to be sent there.
1. Is the fairest most discriminate and humane method of control as opposed to say poison or shooting.
2. Has as a side benefit the best habitat conservation for a whole host of species of flora and fauna: the landscape and countryside of the UK is that way through hunting, shooting, game , fishing etc.
Unfortunately it is the ignorant urban bereaucrats petit bourgois and student-types that have come to exert control over the rest of us. It is time for academics , conservationists and hunters and animal farmers themselves to explain 'why' to the public and this IS working. We have seen the public go from 80% in favour of a ban to 59% in favour of a repeal in just a few years; and a massive revival in the use of fur in fashions.
Most reasonable people when they see the hideous agenda of the animal rights lobby and how extreme they are lose sympathy for them very quickly.
People say
"you can't just condemn animal rights ideas out of hand, surely they are just trying to improve animal welfare?"
to "oh my God I didn't know what they stood for I will stand against them too"
Very quickly. Most reasonable people do NOT want to stop eating meat , seeing a prairie or soya landscape with habitat destroyed or facing a future where there are no cats or dogs or horses.
Education is the key; to what these people really want and its no less than what you read in the quotes above from the principals in the movement.
However the media is stacked against us getting our points across.
One example of this was a recent Channel 4 documentary broadcast two long discredited pieces of film purporting to show fur farms. They were nothing of the sort. Despite presenting channel 4 with the evidence that the claims were fradulent, they STILL have not issued a retraction. I will not rest until the truth comes out.
When you see the advertising budgets of animal rights organisations it is clear why the media is keen to lap up to them.
It is ridiculous that people sympathise for example with PETA and think they care about animals when this is what they do:
http://www.petakillsanimals.com/petaTrial2.cfm
The Hunting fraternity as a lobby has to unite with other targets of the animals rights lobby , and Conservationists Anthropolgists and those concerned with genuine animal welfare and start winning the battle for hearts and minds by showing just how insidious and abhorrent the animal rights movement is.
Demons don't go to hell on their own; they have to be sent there.
Scratchline
Well-Known Member
As DD says. Put a sock in your wild mouth because you are of no help to the cause whatsoever! )
)Scratchline
Well-Known Member
Feeling brave, with you? Threatening? PMSL
Scratchline
Well-Known Member
May I make something clear please. As stated before, I am not an animal rights idiot.I simply live in the country, have many friends involved with the NC hunt and do not find hunting, as was, acceptable. I still shoot and years ago used to keep and work lurchers.
Some on here try desperately to expose the 'real', me which is frankly pathetic and they border on stupid in their attempts to be honest. They need me to be someone else to unleash all their pent up frustration and aggression on but it cannot change the fact that I know, and dislike hunting foxes with hounds.
Indeed as far as PETA go you can shoot the bloody lot of them for all I care. As a huge fan of Diane Jessup and her work in the States, my thoughts on PETA are mostly unprintable.
Some on here try desperately to expose the 'real', me which is frankly pathetic and they border on stupid in their attempts to be honest. They need me to be someone else to unleash all their pent up frustration and aggression on but it cannot change the fact that I know, and dislike hunting foxes with hounds.
Indeed as far as PETA go you can shoot the bloody lot of them for all I care. As a huge fan of Diane Jessup and her work in the States, my thoughts on PETA are mostly unprintable.
rosie fronfelen
Well-Known Member
i don't see anyone being so course as to tell me to shut my wide mouth, as for the long epistles above from DD, of what cause are they helping? you are a prat of the lowest order scratcharse and with that you're both on ignore permanently!!lol-