I’m not sure about this?

[Clodagh]

Is the driver at fault? I feel terribly sorry for the dog owner but if she saw the van why didn’t she stop the retrieve?
I wouldn’t wish it on anyone but when we work our dogs we have to be aware of where they are and hazards they might meet.

 

[ester]

It's not worded that well as to which point she did see the van is it. I'm surprised amazon paid the vet fees given the situation.

 

[TPO]

I would hazard a guess that most people not familiar with shoots wouldn't see a collection of people and expect that to mean loose dogs.

She states that she saw the van then heard the collision. Why didn't didn't have eyes on her dog and/or know if it was in the vicinity of the van?

Why were they shooting near a road? Isn't that illegal? If they weren't Why was a dog being sent near/across a road to do a pick up?

Tragic for the dog and I'm sure the driver got a fright too but from whats in that attached article it sounds like it was 100% an accident caused by the owner/handler

 

[cauda equina]

'The driver should have been aware' - what of - a lot of people in a field next to the track?
If he wasn't familiar with shoots a lot of people in a field wouldn't necessarily lead him to think that there might be loose dogs about

eta cross posted with TPO

 

[Clodagh]

I would hazard a guess that most people not familiar with shoots wouldn't see a collection of people and expect that to mean loose dogs.

She states that she saw the van then heard the collision. Why didn't didn't have eyes on her dog and/or know if it was in the vicinity of the van?

Why were they shooting near a road? Isn't that illegal? If they weren't Why was a dog being sent near/across a road to do a pick up?

Tragic for the dog and I'm sure the driver got a fright too but from whats in that attached article it sounds like it was 100% an accident caused by the owner/handler

I got the impression it was on a farm drive. You can end up having to cross a road for a retrieve but you would not send your dog, you’d go with it. (Imo).

 

[Tiddlypom]

100% the owner's fault. Just because you see a load of people and dogs in an adjoining field you wouldn't necessarily expect to have a loose dog run across a farm track in front of you. Silly woman, and her dog paid the price.

Why wasn't a human spotter positioned on the farm track if it was open to traffic?

Sounds like another case of country sports expecting the unsuspecting public to give them absolute priority to carry on with their pastime.

 

[Clodagh]

Why wasn't a human spotter positioned on the farm track if it was open to traffic?
Sounds like another case of country sports expecting the unsuspecting public to give them absolute priority to carry on with their pastime.

Im not sure why you would need a spotter? Just a dog handler with a brain!
And a bit unfair on country sports to say they want absolute priority, it was only this one woman SFAIA.

 

[FinnishLapphund]

The van driver was driving on a farm road described as a dirt track, with at least a hedge on one side of the track. That doesn't strike me as the most public of roads, which could be treated by drivers as just any other public road with nice pavements on the side for pedestrians.
Even if the driver saw the bunch of adults standing on a field next to the road, and didn't understand that it was a shoot with dogs going on, how come he didn't think that all these adults might have some children lurking around, which might unpredictably suddenly come out of the hedge somewhere in front of his van?

I do think that it sounds dubious with shoots taking place close to roads, and it definitely sounds very questionable to allow retrieves to take place close to, crossing over, or actually on a road that haven't at least been closed off to traffic.
But still, even if both the dog owner, and shoot did wrong, it still doesn't excuse a driver from doing something illegal, like a hit and run. Which is exactly what this van driver did, he hit the dog, and sped off.

According to my quick googling, if a driver fails to stop at the scene after hitting something, like for example a dog, with their vehicle in the UK, they may face legal consequences.

 

[Pearlsacarolsinger]

We get delivery drivers coming along our private track to 12 houses just about every day. If they weren't watching carefully they could easily run over children/cats/dogs/equines/even sheep and cattle sometimes but they don't.What on earth was the driver thinking? But yes, it would have been helpful to have a spotter stationed at the road end of the farm track to warn delivery drivers to take care.

ETA I couldn't quite understand the sequence of events and when the owner first saw the van.

 

[CorvusCorax]

Sounds like an accident. Nothing more, nothing less. If your dog goes out of your sight, this is the risk.

 

[Errin Paddywack]

According to my quick googling, if a driver fails to stop at the scene after hitting something, like for example a dog, with their vehicle in the UK, they may face legal consequences.

I think this sounded to have happened on private land so would this apply or would it be a civil matter?

 

[Goldenstar]

It would be a civil matter .
It’s very sad .
But it sounds like an accident to me .

 

[FinnishLapphund]

I think this sounded to have happened on private land so would this apply or would it be a civil matter?

I blame google if this isn't correct, but the first search result that came up said:

But courts have tended to hold that, if a statute doesn't refer to public roads, drivers can be convicted of hit and run for incidents on private property.

ETA Either way, even if it is classed as a civil matter, I presume that it is still illegal to willy-nilly run over humans, dogs, livestock etc, even on private land.

 

[CorvusCorax]

My Mum's friend has been in court for leaving the scene of an accident where a dog was killed. I think it was council owned land. He doesn't know I know (was having a nose through local court reports) and she's too scared to ask.

 

[Spotherisk]

I would think the dogs owner is at fault - she has said the dog exited the field onto the track. The dog should have been sent on one bird after the handler had assessed the safely of the track.

We had a spaniel run down our drive flat out and bounce off the wheel of a passing car. My instant fear was that I had caused an accident by not being in control of the dog (dog survived just fine, lost a bit of hair). Driver probably didn’t even notice it happen. Totally my fault.

 

[Clodagh]

I blame google if this isn't correct, but the first search result that came up said:

But courts have tended to hold that, if a statute doesn't refer to public roads, drivers can be convicted of hit and run for incidents on private property.

ETA Either way, even if it is classed as a civil matter, I presume that it is still illegal to willy-nilly run over humans, dogs, livestock etc, even on private land.

I agree fault or no fault he should have stopped. Maybe he panicked?

 

[Pippity]

I agree fault or no fault he should have stopped. Maybe he panicked?

If I knew nothing about country sports, had just run over a dog, and saw a group of probably-angry people coming towards me, carrying guns? I'd get the f*** out of there.

 

[DabDab]

Well legally speaking I'm pretty sure it goes that you should be driving in such a way as to be able to stop if something/someone appears in the road in front of you.

A car is a weapon, and drivers should remember that. It could have been a child instead of a dog. I've driven up a fair few farm tracks in my life, but I can't recollect ever going up one fast enough that I would have had the momentum to completely run over the top of a dog the size of a viszla

So yeah, the woman may have been foolish (though from that article it is hard to tell), but no I don't think that excuses the van driver.

 

[Goldenstar]

All of those people with guns may have spooked the driver he perhaps was not accustomed to seeing a shoot and perhaps did not know what was going on .
It’s nonsense to say that all drivers can prevent all accidents I was a passenger when a dog was killed it ran straight out of a gate and into the front wheel of the car the car was moving very slowly through a village it happened in a second .
It’s a terrible thing for the dogs people awful but it’s an accident , however some of those delivery drivers are a bit sketchy in the driving department .

 

[Goldenstar]

Btw nasty wriggly insurance company some of them are a disgrace .

 

[Errin Paddywack]

My husband ran over the next door farm's dog years ago. It was running loose ahead of them and ran straight through the open gate onto the road. Husband braked and pinned it to the floor. Totally not his fault but they blamed him for ever after. The son whose dog it was eventually got another one and the same thing happened to that too. 100% the driver should have stopped in this case.

 

[Moobli]

So sad for the dog and her owner. It’s very hard to tell from the article whether the owner sent her dog for the retrieve before she saw the van or after so I wouldn’t like to speculate whose fault it was. Just driving off is awful (and an offence) but as has been said the driver could have been in shock and panicked.
I live up a rough farm track and it scares and often angers me at how fast some of these delivery drivers speed up to my cottage. We have free range hens and often have the dogs out (with us and not alone) and they wouldn’t stand a chance if they happened to be in the way. I’ve had a word with quite a few drivers over the years and it’s apparent how stressed and under pressure they are, often with ridiculous deadlines to meet, but it’s no excuse to not slow down and take care when approaching or leaving properties.

 

[Moobli]

I have this sign before the approach to my house as a bit of fun but with a serious message to drivers delivering parcels etc.

 

[Moobli]

My husband ran over the next door farm's dog years ago. It was running loose ahead of them and ran straight through the open gate onto the road. Husband braked and pinned it to the floor. Totally not his fault but they blamed him for ever after. The son whose dog it was eventually got another one and the same thing happened to that too. 100% the driver should have stopped in this case.

I hear so many similar sad tales. I will never understand those people whose dogs mean so little that they are left to roam around getting into all sorts of trouble and often ultimately being run over ?. Horrific for the dogs themselves and often for the car drivers as well.

 

[some show]

Agreed. Someone I know ran over an Irish setter on a really fast main road because it was off lead on a forestry walk and ran after a deer, straight into the road - I would be so devastated if I hit a dog, even if it was unavoidable.

 

[Widgeon]

I've driven up a fair few farm tracks in my life, but I can't recollect ever going up one fast enough that I would have had the momentum to completely run over the top of a dog the size of a viszla.

You should see the speed they go up the farm drive next one down from ours. I can see it from the yard and they absolutely hammer up and down it. Anything in front of one of those vans would be dead. Thankfully they can't do that along ours because of the depth of the pot holes (silver linings?!)

 

[Errin Paddywack]

We have a farm track down the side of our field, it is fenced off but still part of our land, at least the bottom half is. Top half belongs to the owner of the fishing pools opposite and he maintains the bit his customers use but the bit between that and our stretch is deliberately left very rough to slow drivers, particularly delivery drivers down so that they don't hit people exiting his property. Lots of complaints about the state of it but any improvement would result in people speeding, they go fast enough as it is. There is a public footpath down it too so lots of dogwalkers at risk.

 

[Spotherisk]

All of those people with guns may have spooked the driver he perhaps was not accustomed to seeing a shoot and perhaps did not know what was going on .
It’s nonsense to say that all drivers can prevent all accidents I was a passenger when a dog was killed it ran straight out of a gate and into the front wheel of the car the car was moving very slowly through a village it happened in a second .

Exactly what happened to our dog when she ran into the wheel of a passing car, although she was unharmed. Mr StR killed a pet duck one day (I was with him, saw it happen) when the bird ran out of a gateway under the van wheel,we would have been in first gear coming to a halt in a small stable yard. Gutting but not avoidable by the driver in that circumstance.

 

[DabDab]

It’s nonsense to say that all drivers can prevent all accidents I was a passenger when a dog was killed it ran straight out of a gate and into the front wheel of the car the car was moving very slowly through a village it happened in a second .
.

Who said that all accidents can be prevented?

There are certain situations/laws where you can be legally responsible for an accident.

Driving a car is already almost the only activity where you can kill or seriously injure people and generally get away with little more than a slap on the wrist. I'm not sure why you would spend the emotional energy arguing for there to be even less onus on drivers not to damage other creatures with their vehicles.

 

[Goldenstar]

Who said that all accidents can be prevented?

There are certain situations/laws where you can be legally responsible for an accident.

Driving a car is already almost the only activity where you can kill or seriously injure people and generally get away with little more than a slap on the wrist. I'm not sure why you would spend the emotional energy arguing for there to be even less onus on drivers not to damage other creatures with their vehicles.

In the car I was in the dog ran into the side of the car .
There’s no different in this sad case between a deer and a dog I have hit a deer I was proceeding down a dual carriage way at sixty when the deer came over a hedge right in front of me no way to see it or stop.
You cannot always prevent accidents with loose animals .