I am so angry - advice please

giddyupalfie

giddyupalfie

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I have been at my current yard for just over a year now. I've never really had any major problems apart from the fact that I am still waiting for my hay storage area to be cleared (was told it would be done within my first week there) and my stable was also rented out to someone else whilst I was still paying for it (admittedly I don't use my stable but I do rent one in case of an emergency) but my horses seem happy enough there.

But now it's a bit of a different story in my eyes... The field where my horses are kept is very large but I am pretty much happy with it. When I first came to the yard in Nov 11 I was told that the two smaller paddocks that connect to my field were also mine but I have always kept the gate shut because it's boggy in there all year round and I also don't want my horses to have access to any more grazing.

A few months back there was a few sheep put in there but that was fine by me, I didn't mind so I never said anything to YO. Then the sheep were gone and it was empty for a while, now they have put 10 or so calves in there. At first I thought they were lovely and cute but not having a clue about cows I had no idea how common it was for them to get ringworm.

Anyway long story short my horses now have ringworm and I am being faced with a vets bill for the treatment which I am not happy about!!! If YO never double rented that paddock in the first place this would never have happened. The cattle owner has admitted that they have ringworm but didn't seem to give a flying f*!% that mine have caught it from his scabby cows.

If you were in my shoes would you be making the cattle owner pay for the bill as it's his cows? I have no idea what road to take with this but am not happy about the bill one bit!!!!!

Sorry it's so long - mince pie and a cream of choice for anyone who got this far :D
 
I'd be furious- no hay storage as promised. My stable double then my paddock double rented-then as a result my horses needing the vet and getting ringworm? I'd be not paying my rent-I'd leave without paying rent (although I would have left ages ago) and hell yeah I'd expect bill to be paid and cows removed. I kick up a fuss
 
Your YO sounds like a very greedy person!

Firstly once the ringworm has cleared up, move your Horses! She rented out your stable? I would be fuming.

I wouldn't be asking the owner of the cattle, he is renting that space, so is able to turn his cattle out there. However I would be having words with the YO. I would minus the vets bill from my livery bill, explaning that the fields were yours. Then I would move pronto.
 
Umm, You could mention your views to your YO and see where it goes from there. In the meantime, treat the horses, and any wooden fencing that your horses have access to. This will help keep everything under control. I think you spray it with something, but am no expert. get the receipts for everything and go from there.
 
I have been trying to move my horses closer to home for a while now but nothing around :( having them 15 miles away isn't ideal, especially when I can't drive and have to rely on the very unreliable bus to get me there, which is then followed by a 30-45 min walk from town centre to the yard. So if anyone knows of any grazing in the Exeter area then please let me know :D

I have spoke to YO. She rang me the other day apologising about the stable situation as I wrote a note and put it in the envelope when I payed last months rent. Whilst talking to her I mentioned the whole ringworm caught from cattle situation and she basically just said 'well there's not really anything we can do about that' :confused::confused: my response (in my head) being "well there is... either move my horses or those cows!!!!" :mad:

This is when being a person that HATES confrontation sucks :(
 
As a YO myself I'm shocked by the fact that a stable which was supposed to dedicated to your exclusive use was rented out to someone else.

Personally, I wouldn't mind at all if someone turned out Sheep in a field where my horses were without necessarily asking permission, BUT I would certainly mind the calves being out there because cattle are far more damaging to pasture and fencing than sheep.

Em, what does your contract say about all this?? (pleeeese don't say you've got no contract in place........:().

I would certainly be very unhappy that your horse has contracted Ringworm from this; and feel that your YO should offer you some compensation on account of it. After all, it was THEIR decision to put the cattle in. They're probably double-renting the grass, i.e. the farmer concerned who's calves they are, is probably blissfully unaware that YOU are also paying livery and in effect "renting" this grass. Whilst I appreciate how difficult it is to deal with disease control in cattle, surely the animals should have been checked BEFORE putting in this field? My feelings are that someone, somewhere, has been negligent. If the YO doesn't pay up for the vets bills you've incurred, then perhaps you could also approach the farmer concerned? His stock are what's caused the problem after all.

Sorry, have just read you're in the Exeter area: I'll PM you. But Town & Country supplies (near Broadclyst) - sorry now Countrywide - have got a noticeboard and there's always someone offering livery there so worth a look???

Also "jhoward" on here is in the area and might have some ideas (where are you Hun??) - so worth PM'ing her? I've got a DIY yard but sorry no room at the mo!

TBH your YO should NOT be double-renting the stable either and it seems to me that biosecurity in this yard leaves a lot to be desired.

I'd certainly ask for your vets bill to be recompensed; and MOVE asap.
 
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SpanishNeddy said:
I would not be happy about that either, especially as they admitted your horse would have got it from the cows.

How do you treat ring worm? I have no idea!

Once I know I will tell you what I would do!
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Well I have antibiotics to stop infection for the wounds where they have rubbed so much from the itching and I have this shampoo type solution which I need to dilute with water and wash their whole body. 3 days later, I need to just do the patches which they have, repeat that again three days later and again after three more days. So four treatments in whole. But I know for a fact that trying to do this on my 22 month old Clydesdale x who doesn't even like water is going to be one hell of a challenge :( :( DREADING IT
 
Get in writing from farmer or YO that the calves had and they knew about them having ringworm if possible. Vet bill would be passed on to YO. Or possibly farmer (might be worth contacting defra to see whether you have to notify anyone if you know you have it).

What happens if your horse needs emergency stabling?! I'd have the amount when you were paying and someone else using deducted. I'd also look at reducing field payment due to not having access to all you're paying for.

Depressing how many times I've said this in the last couple of weeks, but I'd be moving off there. Worth posting a thread with the title of your area on here as people locally may know of tucked away yards that aren't easy to find on the internet :)

Problem you'll have though is the ringworm. I wouldn't take a horse near any others that has it, I'd want to see vet reports etc to confirm it was cleared and I'd probably still quarantine for the period if I knew that there were infected animals still on site.

Also please keep an eye on yourself! It's contagious to humans as well as other livestock.
 
Poor you OP, this is rubbish,

I dont know how old this ad is but maybe worth orth a phone call.

Grazing Exeter Devon

from Gograzing.com
Exeter, EX5 5AG
Price: £POA pcm
Flat grazing securely fences in 3 lots approx 20 acres. 5 mins from Exeter city centre. Please call day: 07860 611302 or evenings: 01392 851644
 
lachlanandmarcus said:
Poor you OP, this is rubbish,

I dont know how old this ad is but maybe worth orth a phone call.

Grazing Exeter Devon

from Gograzing.com
Exeter, EX5 5AG
Price: £POA pcm
Flat grazing securely fences in 3 lots approx 20 acres. 5 mins from Exeter city centre. Please call day: 07860 611302 or evenings: 01392 851644
Click to expand...

I noticed that just a min ago whilst having a look around. Got the number saved and will call later ;) thanks!
 
Farmers don't bother to treat ringworm unless it is really bad and the animals are covered in patches. The calves usually grow out of it when put onto summer grazing and start putting on weight and condition and it clears up by itself.

It is a lot less common than it used to be in cattle though, and isn't a great sign that they have been well cared for, but it is not a welfare issue.

As for the horse, it will get better. Mine was COVERED from his ear to his tail with great raw patches. He was 4 and it definitely affected him. Someone who had worked at a dealers yard said that if they get is badly it can knock them back. I had pots of stuff and washes from the vet, but found that the patches that I hadn't found and treated recovered and grew back over just as quickly as the ones that had.

Mine was pretty low, so I gave him a course of Gobal Herbs "tonic" that I can't remember the name of now, but it seemed to give him a boost.

It is very contagious and of course you can't go out among other horses to a competition for instance and would be a disaster in a showing yard, but it is a nuisance rather than a serious issue. Very annoying in the circumstances though.
 
lachlanandmarcus said:
Poor you OP, this is rubbish,

I dont know how old this ad is but maybe worth orth a phone call.

Grazing Exeter Devon

from Gograzing.com
Exeter, EX5 5AG
Price: £POA pcm
Flat grazing securely fences in 3 lots approx 20 acres. 5 mins from Exeter city centre. Please call day: 07860 611302 or evenings: 01392 851644
Click to expand...

that's an old ad
Op I think I've pms you before but there s plenty of places around Exeter ...prehaps pm be again if I've got the wrong person ..
 
Just to go against the grain a bit, I agree if you are paying rent for the stable and field they should be empty and it was very naughty of the YO to use them however you also say that you allowed them to graze sheep in their without saying anything and were happy with the cows until they passed on ringworm. IMO you should have insisted the field was empty or stopped paying rent.

Your issue is the YO not the farmer. IF you can get any money it should be from the YO not the farmer, he was renting fields as you were.
 
Orangehorse said:
but it is a nuisance rather than a serious issue. Very annoying in the circumstances though.
Click to expand...

But combined with paying for stable and field that is re-rented out. And the cattle being in a field the YO shouldn't be putting them in.... I'd be out!

Lots of annoying things that make you wonder whether it'll cross that line to more serious. It's not a one off.
 
Thats one very greedy yard owner! On the plus side if they keep treating people like this they will soon have an empty yard. I hope you find somewhere really nice to make up for being treated like this. Disgusting.
 
Batgirl said:
Just to go against the grain a bit, I agree if you are paying rent for the stable and field they should be empty and it was very naughty of the YO to use them however you also say that you allowed them to graze sheep in their without saying anything and were happy with the cows until they passed on ringworm. IMO you should have insisted the field was empty or stopped paying rent.

Your issue is the YO not the farmer. IF you can get any money it should be from the YO not the farmer, he was renting fields as you were.
Click to expand...

Regardless of whether the OP has said anything the YO should not have done this.
It's not always easy to complain when your horse is somewhere. I was without stable as it was flooding at previous yard and the response was that I wasn't using it anyway (because it was flooding!). Sometimes it's not very easy to speak up and make a complaint, personally now I'd never make a complaint again I'd just go. That's after a very bad result from complaining though.

A good YO should not have been double renting fields and stables. And at the very least should have consulted OP first.

Agreed issue lies with YO not farmer.
 
I do feel quite sorry for you op, you sound like a nice easy going person and your yo sounds like a greedy git, but tbh from what youve said, youve never adressed it and let it go, youve gave an inch and theyve taken a mile. I'd never have let them rent out the stable you were paying for :eek:and to wait a year on a storage space is ridiculous, i cant understand why you let this happen and never took them to task for it.
Its a true saying "you get what you settle for" and youve settled for being treated like this, the yo must be rubbing their grotty hands in glee.
 
cloe1993 said:
I have been at my current yard for just over a year now. I've never really had any major problems apart from the fact that I am still waiting for my hay storage area to be cleared (was told it would be done within my first week there) and my stable was also rented out to someone else whilst I was still paying for it (admittedly I don't use my stable but I do rent one in case of an emergency) but my horses seem happy enough there.

But now it's a bit of a different story in my eyes... The field where my horses are kept is very large but I am pretty much happy with it. When I first came to the yard in Nov 11 I was told that the two smaller paddocks that connect to my field were also mine but I have always kept the gate shut because it's boggy in there all year round and I also don't want my horses to have access to any more grazing.

A few months back there was a few sheep put in there but that was fine by me, I didn't mind so I never said anything to YO. Then the sheep were gone and it was empty for a while, now they have put 10 or so calves in there. At first I thought they were lovely and cute but not having a clue about cows I had no idea how common it was for them to get ringworm.

Anyway long story short my horses now have ringworm and I am being faced with a vets bill for the treatment which I am not happy about!!! If YO never double rented that paddock in the first place this would never have happened. The cattle owner has admitted that they have ringworm but didn't seem to give a flying f*!% that mine have caught it from his scabby cows.

If you were in my shoes would you be making the cattle owner pay for the bill as it's his cows? I have no idea what road to take with this but am not happy about the bill one bit!!!!!

Sorry it's so long - mince pie and a cream of choice for anyone who got this far :D
Click to expand...
Ringworm is a fungal infection endemic in horses and cattle and the spores can live on wooden fencing etc., for considerable time without infecting animals. It is spread by direct with the spores but not necessarily by animal to animal contact They may even have picked it up while in the field so you would have difficulty proving your horse's ringworm came from this man's cattle. Once they've had it healthy horses will be effectively immune for a few years and then may pick it up again from infected posts, etc.

If I understand you properly, your main problem seems to be that you are paying for exclusive use of a stable and fields which your YO is sub-letting. Do you have a written contract which includes this? A verbal agreement is as legally enforceable as a written one but is a lot more difficult to enforce. I suggest you consult your nearest Citizens Advice Bureau about this, or you can have a free 15 minute interview with a solicitor to establish whether you have a case.

Incidentally, humans can catch ringworn from contact with animals so don't be surprised if you get it. The old treatment used to be topical applications of Gentian Violet (ie purple spray in the proper dilution) but some people swear by Canestan. If it's really bad go to the doctor. And don't share towels while you have it.
 
PandorasJar said:
Get in writing from farmer or YO that the calves had and they knew about them having ringworm if possible. Vet bill would be passed on to YO. Or possibly farmer (might be worth contacting defra to see whether you have to notify anyone if you know you have it).

What happens if your horse needs emergency stabling?! I'd have the amount when you were paying and someone else using deducted. I'd also look at reducing field payment due to not having access to all you're paying for.

Depressing how many times I've said this in the last couple of weeks, but I'd be moving off there. Worth posting a thread with the title of your area on here as people locally may know of tucked away yards that aren't easy to find on the internet :)

Problem you'll have though is the ringworm. I wouldn't take a horse near any others that has it, I'd want to see vet reports etc to confirm it was cleared and I'd probably still quarantine for the period if I knew that there were infected animals still on site.

Also please keep an eye on yourself! It's contagious to humans as well as other livestock.
Click to expand...
No, at the time of writing ringworm is not a notifiable disease.
 
Batgirl said:
Just to go against the grain a bit, I agree if you are paying rent for the stable and field they should be empty and it was very naughty of the YO to use them however you also say that you allowed them to graze sheep in their without saying anything and were happy with the cows until they passed on ringworm. IMO you should have insisted the field was empty or stopped paying rent.

Your issue is the YO not the farmer. IF you can get any money it should be from the YO not the farmer, he was renting fields as you were.
Click to expand...

I totally understand what you are saying and yes you're right, I didn't say anything but TBH I didn't feel the need to. In the year that I have been here I never even stepped foot in those paddocks apart from those first few days when I was looking at how boggy it actually was. I know that I was technically still paying for it as I was told it was mine but I have the biggest plot of land even without those extra paddocks and I still pay the same per horse as the other liveries who have smaller plots. So in my eyes I was still getting more for my money.

So no, I didn't mind the sheep or cattle there until my horses caught the ringworm.
 
cloe1993 said:
Well I have antibiotics to stop infection for the wounds where they have rubbed so much from the itching and I have this shampoo type solution which I need to dilute with water and wash their whole body. 3 days later, I need to just do the patches which they have, repeat that again three days later and again after three more days. So four treatments in whole. But I know for a fact that trying to do this on my 22 month old Clydesdale x who doesn't even like water is going to be one hell of a challenge :( :( DREADING IT
Click to expand...

The best thing I've found for ringworm is sponging horses down with Virkon and warm water. That kills EVERYTHING. A vet recommended it to me, and I've used it ever since. We managed to control an outbreak when one of my liveries came in with it. 22 horses on the yard, only one got it. Brilliant stuff.

Regarding the yard, your YO sounds vile - I'd be ashamed of myself if I did anything like that to my liveries! I'd move, sharpish.
 
Ellen Durow said:
If I understand you properly, your main problem seems to be that you are paying for exclusive use of a stable and fields which your YO is sub-letting. Do you have a written contract which includes this? A verbal agreement is as legally enforceable as a written one but is a lot more difficult to enforce. I suggest you consult your nearest Citizens Advice Bureau about this, or you can have a free 15 minute interview with a solicitor to establish whether you have a case.
Click to expand...

Yes a contract does not have to be in writing. However, verbal contracts, if they go to court etc. will be looked at in terms of conduct so try see the implied contract as there is nothing in writing. Unfortunately, in this case, your conduct has been to allow other animals into stables and fields designated as yours so, from that point of view, it looks like either you haven't agreed to have these designated areas or you have agreed to let other animals be kept in there. I'm sure someone else will have something more informative than this to say as I am only speaking from a contract law point of view which I had to work on for accounting qualifications rather than being a solicitor!
 
Ellen Durow said:
No, at the time of writing ringworm is not a notifiable disease.
Click to expand...

Went straight on to DEFRA after posting that :D There site is far friendly to navigate than it used to be!

I'm not surprised at it not being notifiable (takes a fair amount for that and defra don't even manage to comply themselves.... still a little pissy about last lot of F&M!)

Surprised there isn't something to notify people on the same land though. I get that it's not major and goes away after weeks without treatment if left... but it's so simple to stop people going out to shows/hacking etc if they know it's on site and making it more dificult to spread.
 
leannesanx said:
Yes a contract does not have to be in writing. However, verbal contracts, if they go to court etc. will be looked at in terms of conduct so try see the implied contract as there is nothing in writing. Unfortunately, in this case, your conduct has been to allow other animals into stables and fields designated as yours so, from that point of view, it looks like either you haven't agreed to have these designated areas or you have agreed to let other animals be kept in there. I'm sure someone else will have something more informative than this to say as I am only speaking from a contract law point of view which I had to work on for accounting qualifications rather than being a solicitor!
Click to expand...

I didn't agree to let any animals anywhere, especially not in the stable. I was actually unaware that the stable was being double rented until another livery notified me that someone else was paying for an extra stable on top of the one they already have and that it was mine which they were renting. I then went to YO straight away to complain about this.

I certainly won't be going to court about this anyway so it's ok :D
 
PandorasJar said:
Went straight on to DEFRA after posting that :D There site is far friendly to navigate than it used to be!

I'm not surprised at it not being notifiable (takes a fair amount for that and defra don't even manage to comply themselves.... still a little pissy about last lot of F&M!)

Surprised there isn't something to notify people on the same land though. I get that it's not major and goes away after weeks without treatment if left... but it's so simple to stop people going out to shows/hacking etc if they know it's on site and making it more dificult to spread.
Click to expand...

I would have thought there would have been something of the kind too! People who I come across in the yard have been informed about it - a certain livery seems to have her knickers in a bit of a twist at me saying how she has been touching my horse and then touching her own which I understand but I wasn't aware that the horse who she has had contact even had ringworm at the time. So I'm hoping and praying her horse doesn't get it as she is the sort to be sending the bill my way even though none of this is my fault :(

Anyone got any advice on what to do if that situation occurs?
 
cloe1993 said:
I didn't agree to let any animals anywhere, especially not in the stable. I was actually unaware that the stable was being double rented until another livery notified me that someone else was paying for an extra stable on top of the one they already have and that it was mine which they were renting. I then went to YO straight away to complain about this.

I certainly won't be going to court about this anyway so it's ok :D
Click to expand...

Well it's more about having a leg to stand on if you decide to not pay your livery etc. Wish you luck anyway and I know how you feel, I'm very non-confrontational too and it does lead to people taking the pee!! :mad:
 
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