I need some reassurance please :(

Equus Leather

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You wouldn't think I was a VN in a previous life, I'm being so wet about this.

Bit of history. Amber (Italian Spinone) was diagnosed with an underactive thyroid about 3 years ago. Over the first 2 years from diagnosis there was lots of to-ing and fro-ing having bloods taken to get the levels of drugs right. This seems to have finally been achieved, around about last October.

She has hairloss, and this started when the thyroid issue was found. It's not typical of a thyroid problem though, in that she has lost hair on her face (each cheek and top of head), under her jowels, down the backs of her front legs and tummy.

The skin often goes through stages of looking very red and angry, it has a waxy sebaceous type thing sometimes on it, though this is more apparent on her legs and tummy. Thyroid hairloss, we are told, is more often along the back, and this is where her coat is best.

So, secondary skin infections and such like have been diagnosed along the way and treated with ABs.

About 2 weeks ago, the skin under her neck and jowels was very sore, scabby and weepy. We put it down to the new puppy hanging off her all the time, and took her to the vets (a new one as we have swapped). He prescribed ABs and priton (which have worked and it's all cleared up), but when he was giving her a once over he noticed her lymph nodes under her front scapulas where really enlarged. My OH says they've been like that for a long time, years probably, and she is a very lumpy dog in all other respects too.

Anyway, vet stuck a needle in and took some cells and sent them off. Came back inconclusive, which vet warned us they might do. Said there where some sinister looking cells, but also lots of vey normal cells. He also said her back leg lymphs seemed enlarged too. He didn't know whether it was due to fighting the infection that had developed in her skin under her neck.

So, the upshot is they want her in for a GA to whip out a lymph node to send it off for testing. I'm scared because she's 10 now, 11 in September...she's not a young dog anymore. vet thinks there might be a form of skin cancer. She's started developing little white pimples/spots that come and go over a period of days...he says that it could be due to some underlying issue with the skin and that might have been the problem all along and thyroid is secondary to it.

I know the right thing to do is have the op and find out once and for all if something sinister is going on, but I'm so scared for her. My OH is heartbroken. She's his dog really, and before I moved in they lived together on their own for 6 years so he's very attached to her.

Just need some reassurance I think. he is hoping it's a dermatitis thing, but she's been skin scraped (although not recently) and is regularly washed in malaseb etc etc, so i don't think it's anything like that.

She's just so well in herself. No other symptoms of any type of cancer. She eats well, is energetic, loves her walks, toilet stuff all fine. Don't know whether to have the op as she is ok on the outside..

Gah
frown.gif
 
I would be guided by your vet. Tell him your concerns and see what he thinks. I have no idea what they give as a good age for that breed, but my ridgeback is 10 next month and that is a good age for her breed. I would do everything I could if I thought it would give her a better quality of life in the future. I do understand how you feel...kind of if it's not broke don't fix it? Fingers crossed for you and my pups have their paws crossed.
 
I just wanted to tell you abut my dog who was in a similar situation a few months ago. He developed a perianal tumour, he also has a heart murmur with mild heart failure. We tried treating the tumour with anti testosterone drugs with no effect so our only option was surgery.I was terrified, like your dog he was fairly well in himself but the lump obviously bothered him. In the end we decided to try and remove it. The op also involved him being castrated. He flew through the op, (in fact, vet was so pleased with how the op was going he also removed a large (harmless) cyst from his foot at the same time!) and has recovered better than I dared hope, in fact he seems a good few years younger now!

I know it's not exactly the same but I too was so worried because of his age so I wanted to tell you about it.
 
I have to admit to not liking invasive surgery unless it's absolutely necessary for anyone, not just dogs and horses and to me, this doesn't sound a matter of life or death although I am the first to admit, I'm no vet, lol!

Have you tried any homoeopathic remedies at all as with her being so well otherwise, it could point to some form of allergy IME? Ben, our Border Terrier, has always had an allergy to hay and straw, pollen, that sort of thing and when it affects him, he scrapes his tummy along the ground; looks like he's doing the breaststroke, which makes his tummy and inside thighs, red raw. We have managed it very well with sulphur tablets from the chemist and sulphur is very good for skin conditions as a whole. You can also get rock sulphur to keep in their drinking water. It could be well worth trying for say a month and if no improvement, then think harder about the biopsy.
I think Global or Hilton Herbs also do things for dog skin conditions but they will be a lot more expensive than the sulphur tablets! I know expense is not an issue in this case but the sensible hat on me always thinks why not try the cheaper stuff first if there's a chance it will work and nothing could be better in our case, it's cooled the skin down and stopped him itching within an hour or so?!
Good luck, let us know how you get on.
 
Thanks MFH for your reply, it is much appreciated.

vet thought there could be a hypersensitivity, which is why she's on piriton...but tbh, because she was on AB's as well as the piriton we can't really see if there has been any improvement.

The problem is the vet said her lymph nodes are the size of hens eggs, rather than the pea size they should be....
 
TBH as long as she's comfortable I'd be inclined not to put her under esp. at her age. Though I fully understand as our oldest HWV is 13 this year, she's still herself and loves her walks still but she too has an underactive thyroid, her hairloss is mostly along her waist though. She has a melanoma (sp?) on her neck which has got bigger and, the vet says, is something nasty (most likely cancer). She also has a couple of lumps and bumps and we know she has cancerous cyst like things internally which were picked up when she was spayed. On top of that the poor old biddy has a grade 5 heart murmer - they only grade to 6.

Ok so she's prob worse off and 3yrs older. I still wouldn't put a 10yr old under, that's still classed as old with a big dog like a Spin or the HWV.
 
Well I spoke to the vet yesterday and we have agreed to do the exploratory op. Will be tomorrow at 10.30....he's agreed to me waiting around and being with her post op, so please everyone cross their fingers she comes through the GA ok.
 
[ QUOTE ]
Well I spoke to the vet yesterday and we have agreed to do the exploratory op. Will be tomorrow at 10.30....he's agreed to me waiting around and being with her post op, so please everyone cross their fingers she comes through the GA ok.

[/ QUOTE ]

Not quite the same and sorry for writing a whole essay about it, but some years ago when my first Norwegian Buhund was 14,5 years old, with a liver that wasn't quite fit for fight anymore, we had the choice between either removing three teeth or euthanasia. Her heart was fine but it's the liver that so to say has to handle any remaining/unused stuff from the GA in her body, so they were afraid that the GA could kill her, particularly after the operation there was a risk her liver would seize to function.
So because of the risk, our usual vet sent us to a specialist on teeth that works certain days at the largest vet hospital for small animals in my city, to make sure the teeth was removed as fast as possible.



Nessie was a somewhat stubborn old lady and she never liked being alone at the vets (and being a Spitz she had no problem with how to tell the world about her problem). So I brought crosswords and something to eat and told them that because I wanted to keep her stress level at a minimum, I wanted to be with her as much as possible (also that since I didn't know when it was her turn, I came prepared for a long waiting).
Preferably I wanted her to sit and wait with me in the waiting room until they needed to prepare her for the operation and that she was returned to me as soon as possible after the operation, even if it meant she would not be prepared to leave at once.



They were a little sceptical, but since they knew her age and about the liver issue, they agreed to do it my way. The operation went well and I was allowed to wait in a room they rarely used, then a nurse came and was a little worried saying that they would come with her to me now, but she wasn't awake yet and because she still had a tube in her throat, they were worried I might freak out if she screamed a little when it was removed and/or if it might be some blood. I said I didn't care one bit about screaming or blood, as long as I could be with her.



She was carried in still a sleep, but as soon as she began to wake up she tried to lift her head and sniff around to see if she was alone, so I held my hand in front of her nose and as soon as she scented I was there, she relaxed and went back to sleep for a while. Next time she woke up she thought she was fit to go home.
I must admit that it wasn't until by that evening when she was so happy, energetic and gnawing on bones, that we realised how much it had slowly began to affect her behaviour.



Nessie died/was acute euthanized a little more than three months later, due to what we think was some sort of haemorrhage in her brain, but without that teeth operation we wouldn't have gotten that extra time.


Fingers crossed for tomorrow.
 
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