If you have other people clip your horse, please read...

[_GG_]

Check the insurance of the person clipping your horse for you. It may sound obvious, but I have offered this service in the past and only two companies would insure me with cover for the horse. Yep...that's right. Most grooms insurance, even where it is stipulated that there is specific cover for clipping do NOT cover a clients horse for accident or injury as a result of or during clipping. another thread prompted me to post this just so anyone who wasn't aware of this can check if they wish to. Most policies cover for damage to equipment, buildings (i.e. a horse being clipped breaks a door), the clippers and the person clipping but DO NOT cover the horse for any vet bills needed following accident or injury during clipping, even if it is the person clipping that injures the horse. My insurance did cover it, but was almost a grand a year which is why I cannot afford to offer the service anymore. Just a word of caution if you have a horse that is likely to be difficult and someone else is clipping it. You may not be able to recoup any vet bills through their insurance. It was only last year I cancelled my policy, so hopefully some companies have added it now but I know a few grooms who have checked after I told them, only to find out they thought they had the cover, but didn't. Better safe than sorry

 

[marmalade76]

Loads of people offer a clipping service and I bet the vast majority have no insurance at all.

 

[Honey08]

Very interesting. There was a question about this on FB recently. I too think that most people offering clipping will not be insured.

 

[_GG_]

Loads of people offer a clipping service and I bet the vast majority have no insurance at all.

Nope....a lot don't, or they think they are covered as a BHS gold member. It's not that simple and I don't know many people that offer the service that could afford the vet bills and possible battles if it all goes wrong. More importantly though, for owners...knowing your groom has ensured they are correctly covered is a massive comfort. Don't be afraid to ask to see not just the certificate of insurance, but the policy as well. I have been asked before and I always carried the originals with me when going to clients. No good groom will say no if you ask to see it.

 

[foraday]

Very very good point GG

none of the 'grooms' offering their mobile services will be insured!!!

They stick out like a sore thumb!!!!!

They don't use a circuit breaker for starters! There is no paperwork from them like a booking form with all their details on and an insurance policy number.

I questioned one of these professional grooms who just turned up to under charge the groom onsite who WAS insured via the yard insurance and she assumed Gold membership from the BHS was enough! And so did the clients!

Anyone offering to clip for under £50 a horse is no way insured!!!!

That's why I have my own set for my own ponies! Safer all round!

Uninsured grooms are like the cowboy transporters-only interested in your money! And they disappear over the horizon if something goes wrong never to be heard of again!

If you love your horse don't cut corners!

 

[_GG_]

Very very good point GG

none of the 'grooms' offering their mobile services will be insured!!!

They stick out like a sore thumb!!!!!

They don't use a circuit breaker for starters! There is no paperwork from them like a booking form with all their details on and an insurance policy number.

I questioned one of these professional grooms who just turned up to under charge the groom onsite who WAS insured via the yard insurance and she assumed Gold membership from the BHS was enough! And so did the clients!

Anyone offering to clip for under £50 a horse is no way insured!!!!

That's why I have my own set for my own ponies! Safer all round!

Uninsured grooms are like the cowboy transporters-only interested in your money! And they disappear over the horizon if something goes wrong never to be heard of again!

If you love your horse don't cut corners!

Perfect post. I didn't charge over £50...I was very reasonable, but I did do everything above board and my charging less was down to me not doing it as a proper job. It was something I did for friends and acquaintances but still I made sure I was fully insured and registered self employed. If I wanted to do it now as a business, yes, with insurance prices the way they are, if you weren't a friend, I would charge more...I'd have to, but then you'd know your horses were covered.

Circuit breakers were part of my policy. if I didn't use one, my cover was invalidated.

 

[tickety_boo]

she assumed Gold membership from the BHS was enough!

Anyone's BHS Gold becomes null and void when at any point money changes hands, as it then becomes 'business use'.

 

[Carrots&Mints]

Interesting thread.... I got my friend to clip my horse, she did it as a favour... how do I stand then? Also another girl on the yard was clipping horses for £20 and I doubt she has insurance.

 

[Tnavas]

Interesting to know - what sort of damage can the person clipping do to a horse?

I no longer clip for others but never had insurance as at the time we weren't all suing each other at every opportunity. Sad to see UK developing some of the undesirable American customs!

I'd refuse to clip troublesome horses unless they were well sedated. I had one smash my clippers badly when it struck out at them. Owner didn't tell me the horse was difficult to clip. Cost me a fortune to have them repaired.

 

[Polos Mum]

Surely injury to the horse would be covered by the horse owners vet insurance policy?

I totally agree that the grooms should have themselves insured, a friend of mine had her instructor clip her horse, a tree branch fell on the stable roof and he kicked out, got her and so she screamed so he kicked again!! A year or more later the instructor was going Para dressage her injuries were so bad :0(

 

[ILuvCowparsely]

Check the insurance of the person clipping your horse for you. It may sound obvious, but I have offered this service in the past and only two companies would insure me with cover for the horse. Yep...that's right. Most grooms insurance, even where it is stipulated that there is specific cover for clipping do NOT cover a clients horse for accident or injury as a result of or during clipping. another thread prompted me to post this just so anyone who wasn't aware of this can check if they wish to. Most policies cover for damage to equipment, buildings (i.e. a horse being clipped breaks a door), the clippers and the person clipping but DO NOT cover the horse for any vet bills needed following accident or injury during clipping, even if it is the person clipping that injures the horse. My insurance did cover it, but was almost a grand a year which is why I cannot afford to offer the service anymore. Just a word of caution if you have a horse that is likely to be difficult and someone else is clipping it. You may not be able to recoup any vet bills through their insurance. It was only last year I cancelled my policy, so hopefully some companies have added it now but I know a few grooms who have checked after I told them, only to find out they thought they had the cover, but didn't. Better safe than sorry

I have never asked anyone for insurance , right back since early 80's. I do my own now good idea but most wont do it.

 

[ILuvCowparsely]

Interesting to know - what sort of damage can the person clipping do to a horse?

Nick a horse
bad handling of cabling so allows horse to stand on it.
Burns horse with over heated clippers/ blades
bad clip
scare a horse
getting kicked by a horse

 

[MissTyc]

Interesting to know - what sort of damage can the person clipping do to a horse?

I no longer clip for others but never had insurance as at the time we weren't all suing each other at every opportunity. Sad to see UK developing some of the undesirable American customs!

I'd refuse to clip troublesome horses unless they were well sedated. I had one smash my clippers badly when it struck out at them. Owner didn't tell me the horse was difficult to clip. Cost me a fortune to have them repaired.

I accidentally cut my friend's horse. 15 years of clipping and never had a problem and i still don't quite know how it happens, but one moment I was happily clipping his chest (I clip this horse every year) and the next he'd struck out and there was blood everywhere and a nice little straight line of minicuts. I didn't know it was possible. Luckily this horse took the pain as a punishment for striking out and has never moved again during a clip, but it was not pleasant. Can imagine with perhaps tougher clippers (mine are only lister liberty), genuine damage could be done soft skin and legs/etc?

... Perhaps more likely to this discussion, however, would be a horse rearing up/falling over to get away from the clippers/etc ... let's try to place the blame on the groom, perhaps the person is not careful with the clipper coards and panics the horse? ...

 

[TarrSteps]

Grooms should also check that they are covered for their own injuries. Many 'care, custody, and control' policies specifically exclude clipping as it's high risk.

 

[_GG_]

Grooms should also check that they are covered for their own injuries. Many 'care, custody, and control' policies specifically exclude clipping as it's high risk.

Yep!

It's one of those issues where people are likely only to really bother about it when they know of something going very wrong. Unfortunately, we all know that can happen easily with horses.

There are many injuries that can happen with horses when clipping as a direct result of the clipping. The insurance advisor I spoke to at a very well known equine insurance company mentioned the following to me:-

Loss of eye due to irreparable damage
Loss of use due to superficial flexor tendon injury
I'll never forget those two as they make me wince so much
Burns, nicks, temporary loss of use

It was mentioned to me that the insurance cover of the horse is irrelevant as when money changes hands, it is a professional service and the insurer of the horse would claim against the professional. There have apparently been legal cases but I have no actual knowledge of that.

People who offer the service most definitely need to be insured for injury to themselves. The potential financial implications of being out of work could be awful BUT...anyone who decides to do this work has a brain and makes that decision for themselves.

This thread is mainly aimed at owners who use these services. Again, individual choice and I won't judge what others do with their horses BUT...the fact is, I have met so many people who weren't aware of this, grooms and professionals included that I thought it best to put it out there so that at least decisions can be made in receipt of the facts.

All it takes is for an accident to happen and a groom to blame the horse and an owner to blame the groom and the situation becomes difficult. I'm an owner, I do my own horses but if I couldn't, I'd be mortified if my horse was injured and I had to foot the bill. I would, but I wouldn't be happy!

 

[Polos Mum]

Yep!

It was mentioned to me that the insurance cover of the horse is irrelevant as when money changes hands, it is a professional service and the insurer of the horse would claim against the professional. There have apparently been legal cases but I have no actual knowledge of that.

I'd be interested to know if anyone else has heard of this, seems very odd and unlikely otherwise the same could apply say if you were having a lesson and your horse was injured - you've paid a professional so have to claim on their insurance?? or a physio or vet etc. or even a livery yard owner.

I've never spotted anything in insurance that states it won't cover accident/ injury where there is a third party professional involved. But happy to stand corrected if I'm wrong

Thats not to say the vet insurance co wouldn't try and recover some of the costs from the professionals insurer - but that's irrelevant to me as an owner I don't care who ultimately foots the bill as long as it's not me!!

 

[_GG_]

I'd be interested to know if anyone else has heard of this, seems very odd and unlikely otherwise the same could apply say if you were having a lesson and your horse was injured - you've paid a professional so have to claim on their insurance?? or a physio or vet etc. or even a livery yard owner.

I've never spotted anything in insurance that states it won't cover accident/ injury where there is a third party professional involved. But happy to stand corrected if I'm wrong

I don't know, but in a lesson, you are still in charge of your horse and can still decide what you do and don't do. Clipping is a service where a sharp electric piece of equipment is being used by someone else on your horse. If an EDT damaged your horses teeth, you'd expect their insurance to pay for any costs...I would anyway. If the responsibility lay with the recipients insurance, malpractice would not exist.

There will be loads of views to this, lots of different experiences and I am not the oracle, lol....I just had it made clear to me so thought it worth sharing so others can find out for themselves and make informed choices

 

[Tiddlypom]

Well done for bringing this up GG.

In the book 'Milton' by Gillian Newsum pub 1991, on page 22 there is a description of the potentially career ending injuries that the great horse sustained during clipping. He was admittedly difficult to clip, but he damaged his near fore tendon and had to undergo a split tendon operation to aid recovery.

 

[Carrots&Mints]

Well done for bringing this up GG.

In the book 'Milton' by Gillian Newsum pub 1991, on page 22 there is a description of the potentially career ending injuries that the great horse sustained during clipping. He was admittedly difficult to clip, but he damaged his near fore tendon and had to undergo a split tendon operation to aid recovery.

Grim!! Note to self... dont let the hairy cob get hairy!!

 

[Goldenstar]

The insurer would of course have to prove that the groom was negligent in some way in order to have a chance of a claim succeeding .
It's not as simple as horse injured ,groom liable .
A friend severed her horses DFT clipping it was PTS clipping is dangerous but more humans will be harmed by horses during clipping than roses by humans .

 

[Ahrena]

This is very interesting.

I'm a freelance groom who offers a clipping service. I am insured but to be honest I need to check if clipping is included! I assume it would be as carefully read through the t&cs and if it was excluded it would of stood out to me given i got it at the end of last October so was definitely clipping season!

Luckily my clippers are battery operated so no wires or circuit breakers involved anyway.

 

[_GG_]

The insurer would of course have to prove that the groom was negligent in some way in order to have a chance of a claim succeeding .
It's not as simple as horse injured ,groom liable .
A friend severed her horses DFT clipping it was PTS clipping is dangerous but more humans will be harmed by horses during clipping than roses by humans .

Completely agree...just raising it as a lot of people think they are covered and are not or think they are covered for damage to the horse and are not. I too believe it would be a case of proving liability, but this is just a highlighting thread rather than a black and white one

This is very interesting.

I'm a freelance groom who offers a clipping service. I am insured but to be honest I need to check if clipping is included! I assume it would be as carefully read through the t&cs and if it was excluded it would of stood out to me given i got it at the end of last October so was definitely clipping season!

Luckily my clippers are battery operated so no wires or circuit breakers involved anyway.

There are two companies that include it as standard so you may be with one of them.

 

[xDundryx]

..bad horsey mum alert..my lad has just been clipped by a friend at the yard..I wasn't even present as I'm stuck in work but I trust her and he is now happily sporting a very dapper high trace clip..I looked at a couple of people offering 'services' online then figured he knows this person well and she did a great job on her own horse so it was easier than trying to arrange a stranger!

 

[_GG_]

..bad horsey mum alert..my lad has just been clipped by a friend at the yard..I wasn't even present as I'm stuck in work but I trust her and he is now happily sporting a very dapper high trace clip..I looked at a couple of people offering 'services' online then figured he knows this person well and she did a great job on her own horse so it was easier than trying to arrange a stranger!

Sounds like a great arrangement. Doesn't make you a bad horsey mum IMO. My tone may come across a certain way but I don't mean it to. I don't think there's anything wrong with offering a service or being paid etc, I just think it's important to know the facts

 

[xDundryx]

My lad can be a complete muppet at times and people that don't know him get frustrated/angry with him (he's like an adhd child but is nearly 18!) luckily Bex deals with him brilliantly and he knows her so is a bit better to work with! Its a really interesting thread,glad it was started so many people are advertising clipping services (some people look really young too!) how do you know who on earth is good or not apart from going on recommendations.

 

[_GG_]

My lad can be a complete muppet at times and people that don't know him get frustrated/angry with him (he's like an adhd child but is nearly 18!) luckily Bex deals with him brilliantly and he knows her so is a bit better to work with! Its a really interesting thread,glad it was started so many people are advertising clipping services (some people look really young too!) how do you know who on earth is good or not apart from going on recommendations.

Honest opinion, pay a bit more and go for someone with qualifications or someone that you know or have known references that you trust for. There are people advertising around me that make me quiver to think of them charging people for the service. Not dangerous I don't think but there will be some wonky clips about this year

 

[xDundryx]

Honest opinion, pay a bit more and go for someone with qualifications or someone that you know or have known references that you trust for. There are people advertising around me that make me quiver to think of them charging people for the service. Not dangerous I don't think but there will be some wonky clips about this year

Someone did suggest spraypainting the clipping lines on a horse (fb page shall remain unnamed!) made me spit my tea out! Ive only ever gotten friends at the yard to clip (after having a good look at their own horses clipped out) I will happily hog a mane or take feathers off legs but thats my limit.

 

[Goldenstar]

Tomorrows job is starting clipping I am apprehensive now .
But thinking about seriously if they are not great to do I just get them sedated it's safer for the grooms ( and me) and less stressful all round .

 

[MerrySherryRider]

I think it must have been Milton that I read about years ago, when the groom sliced his tendon whilst clipping him. They didn't know if he'd ever compete again at the time. Can you imagine how that groom felt ?

The 'friend who clipped my cob many years ago nearly needed to go to A &E after she thought it would be 'funny' to clip his moustache off. He didn't hurt her, but I felt pretty murderous.

 

[Morgan123]

Glad to read this - thank you for posting.

I will never allow a friend to clip mine again, after a friend of mine clipped my horse last year and he ended up kicking her literally off her feet - was awful and she couldn't walk for a week. It was just one of those things that wasn't really either of their fault really - but it could clearly have created a very difficult situation if she had done the blame/claim thing.
He is a nervous horse, but still - these things can happen anytime.... I'll only get a professional now or do it myself, since I don't want to risk anyone getting hurt or things going wrong.