In hand hacking? Roads? & Stupid Rule!!!!

Hmm, well I am in hand hacking my horse at the moment as he is recovering (I hope) form injury. I lead him out in a headcollar. I have no more control in a bridle than this with this particular horse as he is well mannered, and it only takes a stern word to bring him back into line. We also lead my sisters youngster out in a headcollar, with a nanny horse (also in headcollar). He is being broken to a bridle, but is not yet used to it enough to be led out in it, that would be more dangerous. :)

We used to ride the riding school ponies down the road, bareback and in headcollars, those were the days eh? ;)
 
horserider said:
Seems like a lifetime ago. A lifetime when people were gentler, less pressured and compensation lawyers didn't randomly text mobiles.
Click to expand...

You took the words right out of my mouth!
Maybe that's why I like nothing more than working in my workshop at home, no driving to work, no boss breathing down my neck, come and go as I please!
I don't own a horse and would never have one until I have a place of my own so I could avoid all the yards politics and rules, like YorksG, they have the right idea!
Oz :)
 
I have to lead my horses up and down a road to the field every day.....I don't use a headcollar......!!

It is unclear from the OP whether you have simply asked the YO if walking your horse out in his hackamore would be acceptable??

A YO has to decide on their rules, and that is their prerogative.....much as we may think the rules are weird/unnecessary, we have the ability to choose whether we stay or not....We don't know the reason that this YO has erected this sign.....there was probably a thoughtless livery client who took their horse out to graze the neighbours gardens every evening or something!!!!
 
OP I will never get off my horse (except for gates) :p out hacking, because I have a lot less control from the ground. Mounted I can use weight, legs, seat and hands/shoulders. On the ground I just have hands. The number of times I have seen people "walking" their horse which involves them being dragged along the road with their left shoulder trying to keep the horse in! That's not good for your baby either!

I think common sense says that when you are mounted you have a lot more ways to direct your horse than you do leading. Therefore why not just put both bridle and headcollar on? Loop the bridle leadrope around his neck, but at least it's there if you need it.

Good luck! Oh and congratulations :)
 
Last edited:
waggerz said:
you are legally required to lead a horse in a bridle and wear a hat on any public road.

though many do not follow this law. If your stable requires you to lead your horse with specifically a bridle on, then just put his bitless on. its still a bridle and therefore you ar enot breaking any rules. But if they state that they require you to lead with a bit in the mouth put the headcollar on under and have both reins and lead rope.
Click to expand...

I have never heard or seen this law written anywhere or in the Highway Code. What about the many equestrian and trekking centres I know where horses are brought in and across and down roads in head collars.

I rode and led for 8 years with my old boy in a head collar.
 
How is a Stephen's Controller halter considered, then? I use one of these and it's infinitely more effective than a snaffle bridle in controlling misbehaviour and running off, in-hand. I use it daily to lead in and out from the fields (along the public road which runs through our farm). Am I legal?????
 
Surely, when you set all the discussions aside, the only real question to be answered is - is a YO entitled to dictate what the owners of horses at their yard do when they are not on the yard?

My answer is no. Perfectly entitled to set up any rules they like when you're on their premises, but not once you aren't. That would be like... I dunno, a school trying to enforce some H+S guideline on parents when they were walking their children down the road. Or the landlord of your flat trying to stop you smoking when you're walking along the street.

All this talk about whether or not Op is safe, insured, legal etc for her actions away from the yard, are again none of the YO's business. Op is a responsible adult ie she is the person responsible if it goes wrong, not the YO.

(I've decided that, as I am happy with my current insurance arrangements, I have no need to reply to people who cross-question me on the details. I've just realised, it's too time-consuming.)
d015.gif
 
Quite agree Tiny Pony.

Yard rules are fine - but they dont/shouldnt extend to when you are out of the yard unless you are causing a nuisance or breaking a law. The only time I would say there might be an exception is rules about what kids need to wear and how they behave because YOs might be deemed to have more of a duty of care as their judgement isnt fully developed until they are older.

Personally for a YO to start making rules about out of yard stuff would be the warning bell for me as a client about control freakery, and if they wanted to boot me out as a result that might be no bad thing for both parties. Where would they draw the line?

Thankfully I have no YO keeping the horses at home (tho I have been on a (good) yard for many years in the past). I dont always agree with my own rules but at least I know I made them when I start arguing with my inner voice telling me I need to poo pick now even tho it's raining....:-)
 
Tinypony said:
Surely, when you set all the discussions aside, the only real question to be answered is - is a YO entitled to dictate what the owners of horses at their yard do when they are not on the yard?
Click to expand...

As far as I know, horse owners do not have a right to livery on a YO's property and a degree of cooperation and respect is needed to make the partnership work. While some yards have very idiosyncratic rules, the bottom line is, if you don't like the way its run, you go else where. So if wearing a bridle on the roads, is too much for a livery to compromise on, then no one is happy and the whole yard suffers with aggrieved feelings.
Some yards refuse to allow horses that are kept shod or riders carrying whips. If this went against your way of thinking, you'd have to be very bloody minded to move to such a yard and ignore the rules.
 
Tinypony said:
Surely, when you set all the discussions aside, the only real question to be answered is - is a YO entitled to dictate what the owners of horses at their yard do when they are not on the yard?

My answer is no. Perfectly entitled to set up any rules they like when you're on their premises, but not once you aren't. That would be like... I dunno, a school trying to enforce some H+S guideline on parents when they were walking their children down the road. Or the landlord of your flat trying to stop you smoking when you're walking along the street.

All this talk about whether or not Op is safe, insured, legal etc for her actions away from the yard, are again none of the YO's business. Op is a responsible adult ie she is the person responsible if it goes wrong, not the YO.

(I've decided that, as I am happy with my current insurance arrangements, I have no need to reply to people who cross-question me on the details. I've just realised, it's too time-consuming.)
d015.gif
Click to expand...

Yup....I would agree with this also....which is really what OP was asking I think? Discussion kinda got sidetracked a bit.
 
As I said way back, if I didn't like the YO and their rules I'd move. However, I still don't think they have the right to EXPECT that they should be entitled to dictate our behaviour away from the yard.
I would not let you smoke in my house if you lived here. I wouldn't consider that I was entitled to expect you to desist from smoking in the road outside though, I don't have that right.
 
I've done in-hand hacking for years and years and invariably use just a headcollar with a lungeline. I used to go running along the banks of the Mersey like that - horse trotting along on the upper bank, me trotting along on the lower one. Caused a few shocks to people coming the other way who couldn't see me!! If I haven't done one for a bit I swap to a bridle plus a lead rope but as part of the idea of the thing is to let my horse graze a headcollar is easier for her. To be honest, I don't think having a bit in makes a jot of difference if you are on the ground. My horse is quite capable of lifting me clean off it and having it away on her toes if she feels like it. I have trained her to walk beside me unless I send her up ahead but even at 28 and with roaring arthritis she can forget everything if we come across other horses when we are out. In an emergency with a headcollar you can wrap the rope around the nose, or pass it through the mouth to make a bit.

I think it is good that the YO has rules which clearly shows they care about the safety of the horses there. Standards can slip an awfully long way if they aren't maintained, but in this case the horse is ridden bitless anyway. What would they do if it had a mouth malformation which made using a bit completely impossible? I think a calm discussion with the YO, even if the OP has to sign a disclaimer, should sort this out. As for the risk of being arrested for leading the horse on the road in a headcollar, ha, that gave me the best laugh in ages. Last year I met a policeman in a shop and told him about the teenage boy I saw regularly in the evening rush-hour traffic, riding his scooter almost sidesaddle while texting non-stop. The amount of times he nearly ran into the back of cars was frightening, but obviously not scarey enough to put him off from doing it. I had the bike's numberplate, make, colour and even what style of mobile it was but was the policeman interested? Um, no. You aren't supposed to drive with a bulb out but do you see the plod pulling people over for that?

OP, enjoy your in-hand hacking. Its great exercise whether you are pregnant or not and its nice to be on your horse's level and out and about together. I usually put a brush in my pocket and when she stops to graze, take the opportunity to give her a good groom or get the knots out of her tail.
 
If you're thinking about taking the horse out on the roads in hand - you'll be just as safe on board (imo, anyway).

And yes, he should be bitted.
 
I think somebody somewhere way bck on this thread asked why I thought the OP was foolish to rely on a headcollar and not a bridle.

A number of you have since been in contact with your insurance companies and discovered that they have varying opinions of this practice. Given that very thing were I a motorist or pedestrian injured by your horse whilst you were leading it on the highway I would have you into the courts so fast! If there is a grey area in law or interpretation of guidelines or the opinion of an insurer or loss adjuster then i would be after you for compensation (were i that way inclined).

Its all very well being pedantic or thinking your horse is the best behaved on the planet (and dont get me started on that one when it comes to people ot wearing riding hats) but most of them weigh half a ton and if they lose the plot you havent a hope in a headcollar.
 
spaniel said:
A number of you have since been in contact with your insurance companies and discovered that they have varying opinions of this practice. Given that very thing were I a motorist or pedestrian injured by your horse whilst you were leading it on the highway I would have you into the courts so fast! If there is a grey area in law or interpretation of guidelines or the opinion of an insurer or loss adjuster then i would be after you for compensation (were i that way inclined).

.
Click to expand...

See that was my feeling...and whilst we are all able to make our own decisions I personally would prefer to err on the side of caution.

IF my horse was involved in an incident/accident and IF someone or something was damaged/injured and IF they decided to sue my ass off then I would be in a position of having to prove that my horse was totally under my control and I had done everything in my power to minimise the risks.......I personally think you wouldn't have a leg to stand on if it went to court and IF your insurance company was faced with a mahoosive payout then quite possibly things could get tricky.

Lots of ifs, I know....but thats my viewpoint and as I said- we are all free to make our own decisions.:)
 
tazzle said:
what law :confused: :confused: :confused: :confused:

insurance companies would not insure anyone to do something that breaks the law.

It is not the law that a horse has to have a bit in on the roads.




and




the only thing that one MUST do is that a child wear a correctly fitting and fastened helmet, the rest is should

if we take it that all reccomendations ( shoulds ) are adhered to and not doing so breaks the law then anyone going out without hi viz could be arrested too. ( maybe thats a good thing :D )


as could anyone leaving the yard with a horse already napping or doing anything other than walking quietly along ;) ( maybe thats a good thing too :D)



technically I cant see anything about a LED horse, just ridden (or ref to herded animals) ...... sooooooooooooooooo

will presume the advice will be included in Never ride a horse without both a saddle and bridle but just not needed the saddle.

bridles are not all bitted ............ well in fact none of them are when we buy them, they are all sold wwithout bits... but thats me being pedantic :D :D :D
Click to expand...



Don't think it's actually breaking a law to not wear hi-viz vest, ride with both a saddle and bridle etc it's a recommendation, however if anything happens will the insurance company pay up, probably not, precendent was set years ago over the hi-viz vests where car drivers were getting let off with causing injuries to horses (admittedly probably not intentionally) because they claimed they didn't/couldn't see the horse and rider, with a hi-viz vest this reason goes out the window, same for controlling your horse, anything can happen to even the best trained horses, bearing in mind that you are probably leading out in hand yourself it would be your word against the drivers about being in control.
 
Not read all the pages, but we're in the same position just about to start walking our girl who's just about to start coming back into work.
I'd never dream of walking her without a bridle on, especially where cars and other potential "off yard" hazards are concerned - she can be very difficult but can't any horse?
I tend to put her bridle on, thread her leadrope through one side of her bit and attach it to the other side (I put myself between her and the traffic) and then put her fluorescent headcollar over the top as well as some hi viz for myself.
I do know people who hack out in hand with just a headcollar but, myself, I wouldn't risk it.
K x
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Top