Incompatible mare and rider...... help

[Missy4945]

I have a beautiful 6 year old ISH mare that I have had since 2, she is very sensitive and I have taken my time to break her done with an instructor, she is very spooky and there is many times I have ended up on the floor, I have sent her away several times to be schooled and be she is very sensitive spooky, she is so inconsistent, one minute we are doing dressage competitions and getting 70%, then our next lesson I am on the floor again from her spinning out over nothing. In June we were having our lesson and it started raining and I told her to go forward she reared and I fell off and broke my back, I haven't been on her since, she is in the field living her best life. I've had her back, teeth and vet check her over and nothing identified. I don't want to sell her to anyone, I do not want her passing her from pillow to post, I don't want to ride her myself because I'm not sure I can trust her and she would feel it, I don't have my own arena so getting someone to come to me isn't really an option, I have my own land so I can keep her but I want her to go out and see if its just us that aren't compatible, my question is what should I do that is right for her. Shall I loan her out? Would anyone want to loan her, I could get her re-schooled for a few weeks first if needed, I would always be open and honest ( I read all the sites!!) I'm not bothered about selling her I just want her to be happy and she will always be able to come back to me. Please no nasty comments just helpful ideas its really upsetting because she was my forever horse !

 

[TheMule]

I'm sorry, but she’s dangerous. She has already broken your back, next time it could be someone's neck and no-one's life is worth that. Just because you haven’t found the cause of her pain doesn’t mean she isn’t in pain. Keep her as a retired pet if you can, otherwise there’s only one responsible option

 

[JBM]

Sounds like pain or neurological
Or she’s incredibly unconfident in which case ground work but it’s hard to know
Horses act a way for a reason

 

[SEL]

When you sent her away to be schooled what was she like with other riders?

 

[poiuytrewq]

Agree with TheMule for sure. How will you feel if you loan her out and she seriously injures or even worse someone?
Its really sad but retire or PTS- and I'd be leaning towards the pts.

 

[PinkvSantaboots]

When you say her back has been checked has it been x rayed?

 

[Equi]

My first port of call would be an xray of her neck, back, hocks and a performance work up. If you can’t do all that, retire her as a pet.

 

[CastlelackSportHorses]

I have this issue but the opposite, I bought my 6yr old warmblood in the hopes she would be like her half sister which I own and compete at 130, but unfortunately my young lady is way too chilled for that sort of madness. I was tempted to sell her but shes too kind and safe, and pretty!

As for your girl, have you had teeth checked and check for Kissing spines, their not predisposed to it but my old ISH developed it.
If everything seems fine, what is she like with another rider?

 

[Ceifer]

Sounds like pain or neurological
Or she’s incredibly unconfident in which case ground work but it’s hard to know
Horses act a way for a reason

This. I’ve said many times before about a mare I had that was dangerous in windy/rain and turned out to be neurological.

 

[Burnerbee]

Would you loan someone a car that you knew, occasionally, without warning, span out of control and caused the driver life threatening injuries? I do feel for your situation though, can’t be easy.

 

[Pearlsacarolsinger]

This. I’ve said many times before about a mare I had that was dangerous in windy/rain and turned out to be neurological.

I used to have a TBx WelshD mare, your name sounds very like her. Eventually, after years of vet visits for different symptoms, we realised that she was hypersensitive to cereals and sugar. She was like a different animal when fed on just alfalfa. Unfortunately she had been so damaged and was so creative to even the smallest tidbit fed by passersby that she was permanently retired aged 12. She made a great companion for her best friend, though.

 

[Ceifer]

I used to have a TBx WelshD mare, your name sounds very like her. Eventually, after years of vet visits for different symptoms, we realised that she was hypersensitive to cereals and sugar. She was like a different animal when fed on just alfalfa. Unfortunately she had been so damaged and was so creative to even the smallest tidbit fed by passersby that she was permanently retired aged 12. She made a great companion for her best friend, though.

She was great in warm weather. Notably I purchased her in the summer . She was fine until the weather changed. I stuck it out thinking it was the ‘change in the weather’ coldness the can affect some horses. Then got vets involved. On a wet and windy day she would not go out in the field and was dangerous to lead. Full blown panic to come in if the weather was windy and she injured a groom. The livery yard then refused to turn her out which is fair enough. Diet was one of the first thing that was looked at and she was only on soaked hay at one point when in to eliminate any elevated sugar in grass behaviour. She was scoped too and she was on hifi but then cut that out too, by that point I wasn’t riding her as she’s had me off nastily 3 times so no need for that before work.
I used to soak her hay and then chop some up with scissors and put it in a bowl for her when the others were fed. To be fair to her she ate it.

 

[paddy555]

I have my own land so I can keep her but I want her to go out and see if its just us that aren't compatible, my question is what should I do that is right for her. Shall I loan her out? Would anyone want to loan her, I could get her re-schooled for a few weeks first if needed, I would always be open and honest ( I read all the sites!!) I'm not bothered about selling her I just want her to be happy and she will always be able to come back to me. Please no nasty comments just helpful ideas its really upsetting because she was my forever horse !

why do you have to do anything? clearly you are not going to ride her. She may have a problem for anyone else to, she may not. What difference would it make.
I'm sure she will be perfectly happy living her best life in your fields. She is a horse. That is all they need to do. They don't need to be reschooled, go out on loan etc. It is not going to make any difference to her and if you send her somewhere and then she comes back to you it is just disruptive. If she is happy and not in pain in the field leave her there. At least you will know she is well looked after.

 

[Zoeypxo]

Leave her in the field, she obviously finds being ridden stressful/uncomfortable

 

[irishdraft]

OP what's she like in company hacking and doing things other than lessons & dressage comps. I have an incredibly over reactive mare but I've worked around it, she's much better doing things in company as in group rides etc which gives her confidence
although I do hack her on her own but always with ear plugs in and on the same routes . It's a horrible situation when you have had a bad fall and your confidence is knocked.

 

[Squeak]

Although there is a good possibility it's pain related - OP what sort of level rider are you? You don't have to answer on here but if you're not that experienced with riding young horses or aren't the most experienced rider anyway then it is possible she is just too much for you. Sometimes a horse doesn't suit a novice or nervous rider and would be fine with a more experienced rider. You just need to be really honest about whether you think it is your skills and a pro would be safe trying the horse or if you are enough of an experienced rider that the horse shouldn't have done it and it's more likely to be physical.

 

[catembi]

If it was a change in the weather, I would suspect PSSM type 2. I had a QH x TB who tested p1, p4, px/px, iirc. A real sweetie all summer, then when the weather changed & the clocks changed so I couldn't ride every day (before I got my arena) he became absolutely impossible. It also affected him very, very badly if he got caught out in the rain. He could not cope at all with being wet or cold. I know that there is a lot of controversy over the test, but regardless, the change in season/exercise made him do a complete transformation from something you'd put your granny on to a bucking, spooking, fire breathing dragon.

 

[Tiddlypom]

Ahem, before anyone goes off down a PSSM2 rabbit hole based on non validated commercial tests.

https://www.rvc.ac.uk/Media/Default/Comparative%20Neuromuscular%20Diseases%20Laboratory/PSSM12%20genetic%20testing.pdf

There is currently no scientifically validated genetic test for PSSM2.

 

[catembi]

Oh for goodness' sake. As I said, REGARDLESS of testing/not testing, the catalyst for mine was a change in the weather & he couldn't tolerate being cold or wet, which it sounds is OP's issue. Change in the weather = dramatic change in behaviour. Mine was a QUARTER HORSE as well which (regardless of testing or diagnosis) are known for having muscular type issues, whatever umbrella you like to put them under.

Another person to pop on UI. Byeeee.

 

[Amymay Again]

Morally you can’t sell her or loan her out.

So leave her in the field or have her put down.

 

[Wishfilly]

It's worth bearing in mind that if you loan her out and she injures someone, even if you were completely honest, you could end up liable. There have been a few cases where people have been seriously hurt by other people's horses, sued the owners and been awarded a large some of money. Rider insurance via the loaner may not prevent this (sometimes it is the insurance company that sues). Even if you fully trust the loaner, they may let a friend ride her, or have an instructor hop on or similar- if she goes away from your yard, you do lose that day to day control.

Apart from any welfare/moral issues, that would put me off loaning out a horse like this. I do understand what you're saying, in that in a few years, with a confident rider, she may come good (or it may be related to pain you haven't found, or neurological issues you haven't found, and it may get worse). However, I think the risks involved for the horse, rider and you are too great, so I wouldn't risk loaning her out.

 

[nutjob]

What actual vet checks have been done? Any bloods run, neurological tests, xrays or ultrasound scans?

 

[shortstuff99]

I'm going to go again the grain a bit here and say, it is hard to say what to do without seeing the actual horse and how she goes and the experience and nature of the trainers and training that she has had. A young horse that has been very confused by training and the backing process could behave like this as much as one that is in pain.

Interestingly Pippa Funnel at her demo at Burghley said they back about 70 horses a year and none of them are ever "difficult" or "spooky" because they are so clear in their training system and most issues come from lack of clarity.

If all vet checks are okay I would really consider having a proper, very experienced, young horse trainer come and assess her.

 

[Bellaboo18]

Morally you can’t sell her or loan her out.

So leave her in the field or have her put down.

Yep or continue looking for a reason for her behaviour (poor performance workup).

 

[poiuytrewq]

This. I’ve said many times before about a mare I had that was dangerous in windy/rain and turned out to be neurological.

This is so interesting to me. Did you find out specifically what or why or anything?

 

[TPO]

Yep or continue looking for a reason for her behaviour (poor performance workup).

Exactly, just because a source of pain hasn't been found doesn't mean that's not the reason.

 

[JenJ]

Exactly, just because a source of pain hasn't been found doesn't mean that's not the reason.

This.

Thoroughly Equine

I hear this phrase ALL the time and every time I do my heart breaks for the horse in question. It is a very big misconception in the industry that pain can be ruled out in the horse. What leads to...

www.facebook.com

 

[Ceifer]

This is so interesting to me. Did you find out specifically what or why or anything?

Neurological myopathy was the diagnosis given by the vet. In layman’s terms he said that the wind hitting her face would be like being stabbed in the head. I had hit the insurance limit with investigations having gone through back x-rays, scoping, hock x-rays, nerve blocks, and eventually CT scan work ups and that diagnosis came from a great vet who said that we could throw more money at it with in depth diagnosis but she was never going to be rideable.
She went to a friend of mine who had a barn turnout regime so she could choose where she wanted to be. She was ok here for a year but then her behaviour deteriorated again in winter. She tried to run through a wall so we called it a day and PTS. Could have been a brain tumour but I didn’t post mortem.
Ironically she had the best conformation you could wish for, she absolutely flew through the 5 stage vetting and the vet said she’s the best horse he’d vetted in a long time. Famous last words eh

At the time I had her on a competition yard (she was going to be the horse that I wanted to progress up the levels) and was convinced by the YO and the pro rider that it was my riding that was the issue and that I wasn’t good enough. The pro rode her and took her round a 1.20 course but after every fence she would let rip and fly buck. Absolutely no way I would have sat that so I convinced myself they were right - she was just a competition horse that I had seriously over horsed myself with. Took me another two months and a serious fall to make me listen to my inner voice and get it investigated and I’ve regretted that for years.