Individual Turnout

[Buds_mum]

Due to present circumstances involving one of my y/o's horses kicking mine and causing a severe life threatening injury I have ruled to never let him out with this horse again.
This is the third damaging kick he has received from it, and it has also kicked me whilst catching him. So although the level of damage to Buddy is accidental, the chances of it happening again are high. Buddy is bottom of the pile, it is just herd dynamics.

However he is my only horse and I am the only livery so removing him from this horse means removing him from the entire herd.

I am so torn, he is very friendly with the other horses however does spend a lot of time mooching alone, but at other times is in with the others being a horse.

I have always advocated that horses should be allowed adequate time with other horses for their mental well being...

In the summer it may not be an issue, I may be able to persuade y/o's to let me turn him out with the unshod oldies, so he would have horsey pals to hang out with (without the kick happy culprit).

However winter would prop see him cornered off in his own section.... He would have the others in view...

Am I being anthropomorphic believing this is unfair and he would feel left out?

Wish I could afford to get a second horse to be a companion!!!

So who has their's on individual turnout?

I really have no option unless I parcel my new nemesis off to Findus without y/o noticing...

I am just panicking, have weeks of box rest and restricted turnout to get over first, by which time it'll be summer... but next winter will soon role on and my feelings will not of changed towards turnout with this individual....

Would offer Munchie cookies for replies but I ate them all

 

[StormyMoments]

i have 2 horses one on individual turnout who doesnt care if he is around other horses at all and another who can not deal with being alone in a field at all. as in even if there is a horse he can touch over the fence and is surounded by other horses he will still stress and fence hop... or just run through it. it completely depends on the horse some deal some dont... i have one of each give it a go you will soon know if it will work or not

 

[wellsat]

Can you get a mini shettie to live with him?

 

[Littlelegs]

Any reason he can't go out with the oldies year round? Failing that, I think a move might be on the cards when he's well & back to normal routine.

 

[Mongoose11]

I can understand your concern

Hmmmm a difficult one, ordinarily I would say he needs something with him. Even my girl who hates others being 'near' her, to the point that she will always run away, is noticeably happier if there is an old pony in with her - even though she doesn't want it to touch her in anyway she will graze within 6 foot of it.

BUT this horse is a proven kicker, is it worth it? The risk! Is it possible that you could move? Where a more suitable field mate could be found? I realise that is extreme.... But I mean in the long run?

For now, individual it is. I wouldn't be putting mine back in with it. So sorry you are having to go through this! X

Came back to say, look if individual turnout at this yard will keep him safe and well then go for it and stay there if that's the right thing for you. He will get used to it and although I would rather any horse was out with another, if my mare wasn't safe she would go on her own simple as. It's not ideal but sometimes it is necessary so don't agonise over it x

 

[Squeak]

I know a lot of horses that cope with individual turnout and just being able to see another horse or having a neighbour, don't worry about it he will be fine.

 

[Irishcobs]

When I first bought BBB she was kept at work where we had individual turnout. It never bothered her but she is very independent anyway. Then I took her to a yard with group turnout, mares with mares- geldings with geldings. She wasn't the bottom but she wasn't the top of the group and spent most of it alone. She then went in a smaller paddock with another mare as that mare needed to be restricted and would jump out if alone. BBB got kicked by this mare right on the point of her hock. She needed an operation and luckily she was insured. She then spent a winter turnout out with my 2 cobs but again she spent most of her time alone and then went back to the yard turnout out with the mares. She has now been moved to a different yard with individual turnout again. She isn't bothered by being on her own and is happy to go out first and be left till last to come in. She will talk to the horse next door and have a groom with him but she doesn't really play, never has, except with me.
I think if your boy can see and touch the others he may adapt to it, as long as he doesn't get left out on his own.

 

[ATrueClassAct]

Old lady loves individual turnout, means more food for her!
Also she is going to be muzzled this year so can't turn her out with others as she kicks them if muzzled and she's shod all round :/.
Personally wouldn't risk being out with a kicker esp since I see it from the owner of a kicker.

 

[Buds_mum]

i have 2 horses one on individual turnout who doesnt care if he is around other horses at all and another who can not deal with being alone in a field at all. as in even if there is a horse he can touch over the fence and is surounded by other horses he will still stress and fence hop... or just run through it. it completely depends on the horse some deal some dont... i have one of each give it a go you will soon know if it will work or not

I know, i just have no horse atm so my brain is too active with forward planning lol. I think he would be fine, he is very laid back. I just feel sorry for him not having any close equine friends

Can you get a mini shettie to live with him

Logistical nightmare atm but perhaps something to look into for next winter yes, as yard is expanding freeing up some smaller stables... I would love this lol. Wonder if he would get on with one a little un... They would have the same dietry requirements seeing as Buds lives on air!!!

 

[AdorableAlice]

Surely in your situation it is by far the best if the horse is kept safe. He has already been injured more than once, cost a small fortune in bills and heartbreak, all through no fault of his own or yours.

The majority of posters will tell you it is cruel to use individual turnout, but I freely admit I turn out some of mine alone for various reasons. They can see each other over the post and rail which also has electric on cross members to prevent legs through the fence. Gates are meshed.

For horses to be kept in herds they need masses of acreage, no shoes and no changes to the herd balance to keep it all safe. I would not think many of us can achieve that set up.

Most of us spend a fortune, work fulltime and devote all our spare time to enjoying a horse, so why should you have to put up with having the horse kicked into touch or worse by keeping the horse in a disruptive environment. Side by side or pairs has worked for me for a very long time. I would not however, keep a lone horse and if I found myself in this position I would be off to the ILPH to find a friend.

 

[Izzyella]

I've been wondering if it's fair to keep our Shettie away from the boys this Spring because she needs a bare paddock and they need grass. think I'm going to fence them next to each other but rotate them so that she's on their bare patch each time they eat it down. I've been agonising over whether I need to bring one of the boys into the yard for a few hours each day so that she can be groomed and 'touched' by them, and whether I can just bring one boy in as a companion whilst leaving the other out (who will then run up and down shouting). You know, I've decided to just let them get on with it ... if it's a problem I'll have a rethink but her health has to come first and, if grazing separately guarantees this, then so be it!

 

[Buds_mum]

Any reason he can't go out with the oldies year round? Failing that, I think a move might be on the cards when he's well & back to normal routine.

They get winter turnout 'up the wood' which is miles and miles to walk to catch and bring in. So not ideal on dark mornings/nights... I live in an awful area for yards, I mean terrible! This yard is the best i have been on and i would loathe to move, I think y/o's will try and accommodate his new needs as much as poss

I can understand your concern

Hmmmm a difficult one, ordinarily I would say he needs something with him. Even my girl who hates others being 'near' her, to the point that she will always run away, is noticeably happier if there is an old pony in with her - even though she doesn't want it to touch her in anyway she will graze within 6 foot of it.

BUT this horse is a proven kicker, is it worth it? The risk! Is it possible that you could move? Where a more suitable field mate could be found? I realise that is extreme.... But I mean in the long run?

For now, individual it is. I wouldn't be putting mine back in with it. So sorry you are having to go through this! X

Came back to say, look if individual turnout at this yard will keep him safe and well then go for it and stay there if that's the right thing for you. He will get used to it and although I would rather any horse was out with another, if my mare wasn't safe she would go on her own simple as. It's not ideal but sometimes it is necessary so don't agonise over it x

Thanks so much Billie1007, it is rubbish It does boil down to the fact my horse could of had to be pts because this horse kicks him, horses kick, we put weapons on their feet to make that kick 100x worse.
He is such a good chilled lad, I wouldn't to put him in a routine to change that. It may well be that he just adapts to anything as long as he has food!! and I am worrying for nothing I like to agonise though, stops me looking at my bank balance if i'm planning for next winter lol!!!

I know a lot of horses that cope with individual turnout and just being able to see another horse or having a neighbour, don't worry about it he will be fine.

Thank you Squeak you are prob right x

When I first bought BBB she was kept at work where we had individual turnout. It never bothered her but she is very independent anyway. Then I took her to a yard with group turnout, mares with mares- geldings with geldings. She wasn't the bottom but she wasn't the top of the group and spent most of it alone. She then went in a smaller paddock with another mare as that mare needed to be restricted and would jump out if alone. BBB got kicked by this mare right on the point of her hock. She needed an operation and luckily she was insured. She then spent a winter turnout out with my 2 cobs but again she spent most of her time alone and then went back to the yard turnout out with the mares. She has now been moved to a different yard with individual turnout again. She isn't bothered by being on her own and is happy to go out first and be left till last to come in. She will talk to the horse next door and have a groom with him but she doesn't really play, never has, except with me.
I think if your boy can see and touch the others he may adapt to it, as long as he doesn't get left out on his own.

Sorry you had to go through this, did your mare recover well?! Exactly what buds has had done.
She sounds like a good girl, its just horses isn't it always something

Old lady loves individual turnout, means more food for her!
Also she is going to be muzzled this year so can't turn her out with others as she kicks them if muzzled and she's shod all round :/.
Personally wouldn't risk being out with a kicker esp since I see it from the owner of a kicker.

I was the owner of a rig who found sport in attacking other geldings when mare's where in season, I hated people to turn out with him incase he injured one!!
Buddy won't be going out with this one again. a)I can't afford it!! and b) I would never forgive myself if something else happened

 

[Buds_mum]

Surely in your situation it is by far the best if the horse is kept safe. He has already been injured more than once, cost a small fortune in bills and heartbreak, all through no fault of his own or yours.

The majority of posters will tell you it is cruel to use individual turnout, but I freely admit I turn out some of mine alone for various reasons. They can see each other over the post and rail which also has electric on cross members to prevent legs through the fence. Gates are meshed.

For horses to be kept in herds they need masses of acreage, no shoes and no changes to the herd balance to keep it all safe. I would not think many of us can achieve that set up.

Most of us spend a fortune, work fulltime and devote all our spare time to enjoying a horse, so why should you have to put up with having the horse kicked into touch or worse by keeping the horse in a disruptive environment. Side by side or pairs has worked for me for a very long time. I would not however, keep a lone horse and if I found myself in this position I would be off to the ILPH to find a friend.

Lovely reply thank you AA, put my thoughts into better words than I can!!

I've been wondering if it's fair to keep our Shettie away from the boys this Spring because she needs a bare paddock and they need grass. think I'm going to fence them next to each other but rotate them so that she's on their bare patch each time they eat it down. I've been agonising over whether I need to bring one of the boys into the yard for a few hours each day so that she can be groomed and 'touched' by them, and whether I can just bring one boy in as a companion whilst leaving the other out (who will then run up and down shouting). You know, I've decided to just let them get on with it ... if it's a problem I'll have a rethink but her health has to come first and, if grazing separately guarantees this, then so be it!

i'm glad someone else agonises as much as me about things which are inevitable!!!

 

[Goldenstar]

I have one who I keep alone .
He's not trustworthy with others he started a huge fight with the boss luckily he was the damaged one at the end of it .
But he acts inappropriately and just attacks for no reason lashing out .
He will break someone's leg so he's out alone.
I feel bad for him but it just safer.

 

[Sussexbythesea]

I really worried when I went to a yard with individual turn-out as my boy is pretty sociable. However he has thrived there and seems to be very happy and settled - he loves his neighbour Seamus and they are paired up in that they go out next to each other and move fields together. Ideally given the right mix of horses I would prefer group t/o but this is difficult to control on livery yards.

He also got kicked and had a bone chip at my previous yard - thankfully not serious and not the reason I moved to this yard.

 

[Zorya]

My mare's turned out in her own paddock all year round. At her previous yard she was out with two other mares, but she suffered at the bottom of the pecking order and came in on numerous occasions with scratches and scrapes. Now she's on her own she's much happier. Even if all other horses are brought in before I get to the yard, she is almost always to be found contentedly grazing at the far-end of the paddock. I guess she's a bit of lone wolf!

Contrariwise, there are two geldings (also in their own paddocks) who can't be first out/last in. They will pace at the gate unless another horse is in clear view, but as long as they don't appear to be alone they're just fine.

 

[Buds_mum]

I have one who I keep alone .
He's not trustworthy with others he started a huge fight with the boss luckily he was the damaged one at the end of it .
But he acts inappropriately and just attacks for no reason lashing out .
He will break someone's leg so he's out alone.
I feel bad for him but it just safer.

Needs must you would feel terrible if having knowingly thought 'he could break someone's leg' and he did... why cant they just be lovely to each other lol!

I really worried when I went to a yard with individual turn-out as my boy is pretty sociable. However he has thrived there and seems to be very happy and settled - he loves his neighbour Seamus and they are paired up in that they go out next to each other and move fields together. Ideally given the right mix of horses I would prefer group t/o but this is difficult to control on livery yards.

He also got kicked and had a bone chip at my previous yard - thankfully not serious and not the reason I moved to this yard.

Positive though that your lad has coped well though, thank you x

My mare's turned out in her own paddock all year round. At her previous yard she was out with two other mares, but she suffered at the bottom of the pecking order and came in on numerous occasions with scratches and scrapes. Now she's on her own she's much happier. Even if all other horses are brought in before I get to the yard, she is almost always to be found contentedly grazing at the far-end of the paddock. I guess she's a bit of lone wolf!

Contrariwise, there are two geldings (also in their own paddocks) who can't be first out/last in. They will pace at the gate unless another horse is in clear view, but as long as they don't appear to be alone they're just fine.

Hopefully Bud's will be exactly the same as your girl!! one can dream!

 

[only_me]

What about a donkey?
My boy goes out with a pair of donkeys, he's very happy with his mates and would regularly lie down with them

 

[Buds_mum]

What about a donkey?
My boy goes out with a pair of donkeys, he's very happy with his mates and would regularly lie down with them

Haha my y/o hates donkeys When my horse was a foal he was next to local seaside donkeys so he loves them

 

[nikkimariet]

Ours are on individual turnout.

Bruce is a different kettle of fish; not a thug in any sense but a retired good doer who needs to be kept on his own mown lami paddock for his health.

Fig and CS didn't used to be, but are now separated. CS has a superiority complex who loves being top dog, whereas Fig is a total wuss who just wants to be left alone. I've spent well over £130 replacing rugs and hoods for Fig, and CS has felt the brunt of a well aimed (and well deserved!) kick to the thigh, shoulder, knee and face!

As long as other horses are in sight, individual turnout is perfectly acceptable. Whilst some may tell you group turnout is 'best', it's worth noting that 'best' is not always fitting for the situation in question.

Re: shettie/likewise companion.... Please consider come spring/summer their weight will need to be watched very carefully and are likely to need restricted grazing. So unless yours will be in a similar set up, I wouldn't have thought a small companion is the answer.

 

[Buds_mum]

Ours are on individual turnout.

Bruce is a different kettle of fish; not a thug in any sense but a retired good doer who needs to be kept on his own mown lami paddock for his health.

Fig and CS didn't used to be, but are now separated. CS has a superiority complex who loves being top dog, whereas Fig is a total wuss who just wants to be left alone. I've spent well over £130 replacing rugs and hoods for Fig, and CS has felt the brunt of a well aimed (and well deserved!) kick to the thigh, shoulder, knee and face!

As long as other horses are in sight, individual turnout is perfectly acceptable. Whilst some may tell you group turnout is 'best', it's worth noting that 'best' is not always fitting for the situation in question.

Re: shettie/likewise companion.... Please consider come spring/summer their weight will need to be watched very carefully and are likely to need restricted grazing. So unless yours will be in a similar set up, I wouldn't have thought a small companion is the answer.

Yes luckily mine is a good doer to the extreme cob who i would be happy to never let have a sniff of grass again

Sounds like yours have a good setup and are happy settled in it

 

[Littlelegs]

Just had another thought, any chance yard owner or another livery might move a horse into that field? If you could get one in there also that will put the kicker in its place it could solve it. One yard I was on my mare was out with half a dozen geldings, one of which was constantly hounding the previous alpha, & the others quite often got a bit carried away playing rough. She didn't stop them playing but certainly toned it down & kept the aggressor in line. Not massively likely, but could it be a possibility by the time he's back to normal turnout?

 

[nikkimariet]

Yes luckily mine is a good doer to the extreme cob who i would be happy to never let have a sniff of grass again

Sounds like yours have a good setup and are happy settled in it

Hah! Sounds like Bruce! He just has to look at it and :explodes:

Yes - Fig much much happier these days, and so is my bank account!

 

[Buds_mum]

Just had another thought, any chance yard owner or another livery might move a horse into that field? If you could get one in there also that will put the kicker in its place it could solve it. One yard I was on my mare was out with half a dozen geldings, one of which was constantly hounding the previous alpha, & the others quite often got a bit carried away playing rough. She didn't stop them playing but certainly toned it down & kept the aggressor in line. Not massively likely, but could it be a possibility by the time he's back to normal turnout?

No i am the only livery, and the only other horses who are not in current herd are either decrepit or very young... good idea though x

Hah! Sounds like Bruce! He just has to look at it and :explodes:

Yes - Fig much much happier these days, and so is my bank account!

my bank account is very sad atm

 

[marmalade76]

Mine are often in seperate paddocks during the summer due to different grazing needs. I wouldn't want them to be on their own perminantly but for a few weeks at a time it's fine. Sometimes there's only a fence between them, sometimes theres a field between them and their all fine with it.

If yours is fine on his own and it's only for the summer, I can't see a problem.

 

[lhotse]

My mare is turned out on her own, although next to my small ponies. They need to be on less grass than her and they are separated by a small gap between their electric fencing. Everything is happy. She has been kept in a herd prior to me purchasing her a year ago, the scars on her back legs are testament to her place in the pecking order. My old mare much preferred to be by herself, apart from an elderly arab who she adored. I think sometimes it gives them confidence that they are not going to be bullied, and they are happy with their own company.

 

[Roasted Chestnuts]

I would rather my horse be in individual turnout that being damaged or causing damage to others.

My old boy can be very free with feet and teeth in the field with other horses. Never lifts a leg under saddle and on the yard or with people.

When i took him to where he is now, to be with my other pony and my friends horses, him and my mare had a few rounds and now its all settled down, was hair raising to watch and im glad hes not shod, as he gave her a few hamerings, she wont take a telling though, kept coming back for more and is a typical mare .

Hes only ever been turned out with my horses or on his own since i moved him from the livery yard where I worked when i bought him. He was quite nasty in the herd back then as well, he wasnt the only one there though, there was a right dirty kicking mare that had to be separated as she was just horrendous. Great horse though, wonderful under saddle and very talented.

So I can understand from the point of view as the owner of a bossy horse, I wouldnt like my horse permanently damaging another person's horse.

 

[Lulup]

If he is in an individual paddock within the same field as the others I think you'll find that he will be perfectly happy - probably very happy to be safely fenced off from the aggressor!

People aways talk about horses being herd animals and living naturally etc. but in reality that is unachievable for most of our horses and simply chucking them all in a limited space together (especially with shoes on) is far from natural - it's just dangerous and leaves them no escape. Dogs are pack animals but does that mean you would chuck your dog in a run with a load of others and just leave them to get on with it and hope for the best?? Packs/herds have to become established and they develop a pecking order - it's all about survival not 'love thy neighbour'!

Look at the number of threads on here about injuries incurred via field mates..

All my horses (except unshod and youngsters) are turned out individually but they are all next to one another divided up with electric fencing and they are very settled and content plus no injuries! They can still graze side by side and play/groom over the fence but can't get at one another and have the option of walking away without being followed/harassed.

You could cause other problems (separation anxiety etc) by getting a companion so I'd see how he is before you start worrying or committing yourself to having another.

You'll probably be surprised by how much less stressful it is for you and your horse