Info on permanent Tracheotomy please....

[Lady Ruby]

My Welsh Sec D has been having breathing issues and following an overground scope it has revealed that her pharynx is intermittently collapsing and her soft palate is billowing. This is resulting in a complete collapse of her airway (intermittently). Unfortunately there is no surgery that can be performed on her palate and the only surgery option is a permanent Tracheotomy. I'm really interested to hear of anyone that has been through this. How did the op go and mainly the aftercare. Any advice would be greatly appreciated. Obviously the surgeon is providing me with info but would really like to hear of someone who has experienced this. Thank you.....one worried owner

 

[be positive]

Not seen one in years but it used to be fairly common in racing before the new techniques became more advanced, there are probably a few still racing with one, from memory they caused little trouble as long as they are kept clean, the horse will have a better quality of life and should be able to work as normal , just avoid swimming!

 

[scats]

Hi there, I can’t offer any advice on the tracheostomy but I am I interested in following your story.

My mare has a similar issue but backwards to yours- she has a permenantly collapsed trachea that then causes her pharynx to shut at exercise as she inhales harder.
I was told that a tracheostomy would not help in her case, apart from stopping the pharynx issue. The underlying trachea issue would still be there.

 

[Lady Ruby]

Thank you for your replies. I'm just trying to weigh up all options. At the moment she can cope with light hacking. Walking, and she lets me know when she's struggling in trot by slowing and lowering head. She seems to swallow and gurgle and sort it out and she's then happy to continue again. This happens in all gaits. I'm told that due to all her problems being in the palate region the Tracheotomy will bypass this and give her a new airway. She should also be able to cope with much more exercise. She can be a fizzy mare and she really enjoys her work but I'm trying to find out as much info as possible.

 

[scats]

A horse at a local riding school has a tracheostomy and coped absolutely fine. They had to keep it clean and the smell could get pretty bad, but the horse was able to carry on his normal level of work.

Let us know what you decide and how you get on.

 

[Lady Ruby]

Thank you and yes I will definitely let you know my decision. I'm am really considering this as I feel her quality of life will significantly improve. She loves a good canter in the field but at the moment initially she thinks she's a racehorse. So I am protecting her by not putting her in a sutuation where her enthusiasm outweighs what she can actually do. Ideally I'd love to find someone who has been through this and speak to them face to face and see the horse. Can't seem to find anyone local to me, certainly no clients through my veterinary practice. Can I ask what area the horse at the riding school is? I'm in North Devon and I'd be willing to travel a fair distance if they were happy to chat with me.

 

[scats]

Thank you and yes I will definitely let you know my decision. I'm am really considering this as I feel her quality of life will significantly improve. She loves a good canter in the field but at the moment initially she thinks she's a racehorse. So I am protecting her by not putting her in a sutuation where her enthusiasm outweighs what she can actually do. Ideally I'd love to find someone who has been through this and speak to them face to face and see the horse. Can't seem to find anyone local to me, certainly no clients through my veterinary practice. Can I ask what area the horse at the riding school is? I'm in North Devon and I'd be willing to travel a fair distance if they were happy to chat with me.

Quite a way away unfortunately- in the North west.

 

[Lady Ruby]

Just to let you all know that I have decided to go ahead with the Trachy. Ruby hasn't been able to cope with much work at all. She's had a few episodes out hacking, in walk, where she has almost fallen down but she has saved herself at the last minute. The surgeon feels that this could be due to lack of oxygen therefore I have stopped exercising her. She has the op done on Monday and I'm really really hoping this makes a positive difference for her.

 

[Quigleyandme]

best wishes to you and Ruby for a successful outcome. Just think how that first canter will feel for you both!

 

[Ruby's Mum]

Keeping everything crossed for a good recovery for Ruby (from another Ruby's Mum), what an awful situation but it will be fabulous to see how well she will do after the op, keep us posted I will be watching with great interest for your updates. xx

 

[scats]

I’ve got everything crossed for you both and I would be really interested to follow this if you wouldn’t mind posting updates?
I will be thinking of you both on Monday xx

 

[Lady Ruby]

Ruby has had the op and has been an absolute star. She stayed in hospital for 3 days and has now been home for 2. She is really happy in herself and you really wouldn't know what she's been through. She is an absolute star to have it cleaned and stands with no head collar while I clean it. It's now just keeping it clean and hoping for no complications healing. I have to say it wasn't nice to look at on day one but after spending an hour with her at the hospital and she was saying please and giving kisses as normal for treats I realised she was her happy self....oh and demanding scratches for an hour!! I will keep you posted...another check from vet on Tuesday but all looking good. x

 

[Ruby's Mum]

Absolutely fantastic news! How lovely that she is feeling so well. Lovely news to hear she is doing so well, please keep us updated on her progress too, I would love to hear how she gets on once she is recovered and you start doing some work with her, would be fascinated to hear how she progresses and the change it makes to her life.

 

[scats]

Ruby has had the op and has been an absolute star. She stayed in hospital for 3 days and has now been home for 2. She is really happy in herself and you really wouldn't know what she's been through. She is an absolute star to have it cleaned and stands with no head collar while I clean it. It's now just keeping it clean and hoping for no complications healing. I have to say it wasn't nice to look at on day one but after spending an hour with her at the hospital and she was saying please and giving kisses as normal for treats I realised she was her happy self....oh and demanding scratches for an hour!! I will keep you posted...another check from vet on Tuesday but all looking good. x

Fantastic news, I am so pleased for you both. Hope all goes well at the vet check this week.

 

[Lady Ruby]

Thank you all for your support, thoughts and interest about my girl. I will keep you posted as we progress....with any luck sometime in the near future I can say we are back doing our early morning rides up the fields watching the deer can't wait... xx

 

[Lady Ruby]

Just a quick update. Ruby is doing really well and it's healing well albeit slowly. By all accounts because she's a D and has a chunky neck this has made healing a bit longer but we've had no problems or infection. She back out in the field and so far showing good signs of getting more oxygen in. Vet visit next week with view to see if we can start exercise. She is so well in herself and has been a complete dude. Will update next week....

 

[scats]

Just a quick update. Ruby is doing really well and it's healing well albeit slowly. By all accounts because she's a D and has a chunky neck this has made healing a bit longer but we've had no problems or infection. She back out in the field and so far showing good signs of getting more oxygen in. Vet visit next week with view to see if we can start exercise. She is so well in herself and has been a complete dude. Will update next week....

That’s really encouraging news! So pleased for you both. What is it like cleaning it etc?
Hope all goes well with the vet next week x

 

[ycbm]

Great news but we do need some photos

 

[Ruby's Mum]

Just a quick update. Ruby is doing really well and it's healing well albeit slowly. By all accounts because she's a D and has a chunky neck this has made healing a bit longer but we've had no problems or infection. She back out in the field and so far showing good signs of getting more oxygen in. Vet visit next week with view to see if we can start exercise. She is so well in herself and has been a complete dude. Will update next week....

That is brilliant news! She must be feeling so much better being able to breathe better. So pleased for you both. Would be very interested to see some photos if you feel like sharing them.

 

[Lady Ruby]

Hi Scats...to begin with it was really yukky to clean....only way to describe it...is yellow gunk. Not easy to clean initially as had to be really gentle and it was such sticky stuff! It improved once stitches came out. I have cleaned it and still do twice a day but now it's only just snotty stuff that would normally come out her nose. Really easy to do. I almost became obsessed with getting it completely clean haha The strangest thing is the noise that comes out. Ruby aka 'Puff'. She makes some odd noises but I've soon got used to it. x

 

[Lady Ruby]

If I can work out how to add a pic I'll pop one on!! Might take me a while hahaha

 

[Marmaduke]

I am pleased that you have had a good result. Could i just ask what specific symptoms you had ie noise or no noise, exercise intolerance at a particular pace, head position? Clear standing scope? Anything else? Going through breathing issues with my horse and have pushed vet for overground scope. Thank you.

 

[Lady Ruby]

Hi Marmaduke....It all started with Ruby about two years ago. She was always noisy (grunts) in canter and when she got excited (danced on spot) but by all accounts D’s can be noisy so I didn’t take a great deal lot of notice. About 2 years ago she started short striding in trot and wanted to come back to walk. My vet actually rode her to see what I meant and it was decided that we would do a standing/sedated scope. This revealed that she was quite fat and floppy around the palate but he felt that it didn’t warrant this level of exercise intolerance. At this point we thought Ruby wouldn’t be a good candidate to have the working scope ‘un-sedated’, she was such a stressy type with things like that and we would never get the scope in not sedated. The short striding continued but I noticed she did this more on the roads than in the school. The vet then looked at foot balance and her feet were unbalanced. Lots of remedial shoeing and x-rays and a massively reduced work load but she still did this on the roads. Last summer we did a fun ride and at the time we thought she had slipped as she had pads on her feet. We were cantering up a field and she just fell, completely down on her side. Luckily she was unhurt. I continued to hack out but she was still short striding so we were hacking out for an hour max in walk. Around Christmas we had two episodes where she almost fell down again, saving herself at the last minute. After the second time I decided to stop riding her in case she (or me) got hurt. Thankfully we decided to go ahead with the working scope and the surgeon and vets that came down were able to give her a little sedation to get the scope in and once it had worn off she was worked. This revealed that in walk, trot and canter her pharynx was collapsing (from above) and her soft palate was displacing and billowing causing intermittently a complete collapse of her airway. The surgeon felt that there was no palate operation that would help Ruby and my only option was the Trachy. Ruby would gulp and gurgle when she was struggling…..she would trot, gurgle, come back to walk, put her head down, gulp and swallow and then she was happy to continue. As you’ve probably read she had the op done and so far all is going well. I really didn't have many options for her and I felt she got progressively worse over the two years and exercise had stopped. She's feeling well and very spiritely when I turn her out mornings. Get the feeling I might need some glue on the saddle when we start exercise haha. The surgeon felt that the falling episodes could have been little faints due to lack of oxygen. I'm so glad I went through with it. I do hope this is helpful for you marmaduke, feel free to ask any questions. When is your scope happening? x

 

[Marmaduke]

Thank you very much that is helpful. My scope is booked for a couple of weeks time. Mine has had a lot of issues over this last year but having remedied everything (like you) I feel he is struggling to get oxygen, he doesnt gurgle like yours, there is a slight wheeze, but finds canter difficult without head up and out like a racehorse or higher. And he wants to stretch down. Also has a cough to clear in either trot or canter. Despite hardly sweating in the heat he is hyper ventilating. For me i need to know if it is bull necked confirmation and weight/ lack of fitness or something else allergies and inflamed airway /weak hind end?). He didnt always do this despite other issues. It may not be as severe as yours but like you, you know your horse despite the vets trying to convince you otherwise! Ill keep you posted.

 

[Lady Ruby]

Sounds like you are going through lots of investigations, like I did. But you just know when they are not right. I can't dis my vet at all he has been amazing, he's gone way beyond what would be expected. Calling me off duty and replying to emails at weekends. To be honest we were both baffled at one point. But I kept on saying she's not right. Keep on pushing...I know when Ruby had her working scope I prayed it showed something....although it wasn't good news, at least I had answers. Ruby never coughed but she did want to stretch neck out. She gets pollen allergies so summer time she did sound wheezy but this was pollens. Her glands would come up in throat which didn't help matters. I'll be interested to know how the scope goes, please update me. Are they coming to you? I was able to watch as they brought the scope to me, really interesting watching their airway on screen. I could see it go from open normal to completely collapsing. At the same time Ruby had a heart monitor on too which thankfully didn't reveal anything abnormal. Pls let me know how you get on xx

 

[Lady Ruby]

Just to let you all know vet is coming Monday to assess if we can start exercise. So I will let you know...
I think it's looking sooooo good but I'm no vet....so fingers crossed.
I am still trying to work out how to get a pic on here....if anyone can give me any pointers??

 

[scats]

Thank you very much that is helpful. My scope is booked for a couple of weeks time. Mine has had a lot of issues over this last year but having remedied everything (like you) I feel he is struggling to get oxygen, he doesnt gurgle like yours, there is a slight wheeze, but finds canter difficult without head up and out like a racehorse or higher. And he wants to stretch down. Also has a cough to clear in either trot or canter. Despite hardly sweating in the heat he is hyper ventilating. For me i need to know if it is bull necked confirmation and weight/ lack of fitness or something else allergies and inflamed airway /weak hind end?). He didnt always do this despite other issues. It may not be as severe as yours but like you, you know your horse despite the vets trying to convince you otherwise! Ill keep you posted.

Hope you get some answers soon. I had a problem with my mares breathing, although she didn’t make a noise other than being very out of breath once in trot and canter, major exercise intolerance and showed signs similar to PSSM at work. She had a slightly raised respiration rate at rest and didn’t tolerate heat of any sort. I had to have a battle with my vets (there is a thread on this somewhere) because I couldn’t really get anyone to take the problem seriously, as she had just had the symptoms of an unfit pony, despite me knowing she wasn’t unfit.
I took he in for an overground and normal scope and she was found to have a permanent full length tracheal collapse. Whereas the trachea should be like an upside down D shape, hers is like a thin crescent moon all the way from throat to lungs. In trot and canter, because she has to suck air harder in to try and get enough, her pharynx shuts off so she then gets even less air in, which caused the lack of oxygen to her muscles. Unfortunately for us, there is no cure or treatment. We just manage best we can with what we’ve got.

 

[ester]

Just to let you all know vet is coming Monday to assess if we can start exercise. So I will let you know...
I think it's looking sooooo good but I'm no vet....so fingers crossed.
I am still trying to work out how to get a pic on here....if anyone can give me any pointers??

For pic you need to have it on facebook/tinypic etc and copy the image location and paste here with

tags either way.
alternatively Im happy to pm you my email and Ill put it up for you (I'm interested!)

 

[Lady Ruby]

Well we've been given the go ahead to start exercise. My vet says "lots of hacks in walk and go gentle and build her up slowly". Go gentle??? Took her out this evening for her first hack....definitely more energy. Going out she was like a coiled spring...pranced all the way home, knees touching her nose! Thinking Ruby feels good....

 

[ester]

ha, he forgot she was welsh obviously!