Insurance advice for new loan horse please

[Dedicatedhorseowner]

Hi Everyone. I'm about to take on a new loan horse. The horses value is a decent amount (over £5K) so I need to insure her. Current owner doesn't currently have her insured. I have looked for a few quotes but all insurance companies require vetting and X-rays so I don't know how I am going to do this other than get her vetted and x-rayed!! The owner had her vetted and x-rayed when she bought her last year but this won't count now will they for me to use?

 

[ihatework]

I’d ask the owner to insure the horse themselves and then you reimburse them the monthly premium. As owner it should be easier for them to get a policy. I’d suggest using a broker.

 

[Dedicatedhorseowner]

I’d ask the owner to insure the horse themselves and then you reimburse them the monthly premium. As owner it should be easier for them to get a policy. I’d suggest using a broker.

Not sure if any insurance companies will use a vetting that is a few months old though?

 

[Polos Mum]

The owner should really be the one worried about insurance and having it in their name is important (if there is a long term injury - you might well choose to give the horse back and if it's your insurance that would then stop - the owner needs to be sure they have long term cover in place that remains even if the loan ends)

Similarly if the horse died the pay out would go to you (as the policy holder) and there isn't necessarily the obligation in law for you to give the cash to the owner

Much safer all round if they hold the policy (as it covers their asset) and that you pay the premiums to them - if that is what you have agreed in the loan.

 

[doodle]

I agree with the others. The owner should take out the insurance and then you can pay the premium to her. I did this with Abbey and her loaner.

 

[bouncing_ball]

Over £10K? Under should just be a 2 stage vetting.

 

[iknowmyvalue]

Depends how old the vetting certificate is, some might accept it if it’s <12mo old. Otherwise most vets will do an insurance vetting for you so you’ve got an up to date certificate. But agree, owner should be policyholder, and you can just pay the premium as part of the loan cost.

 

[Dedicatedhorseowner]

Thanks everyone. The vetting was carried out last July.

 

[Melody Grey]

Thanks everyone. The vetting was carried out last July.

I can’t imagine an insurance company accepting a 6month old vetting- an awful lot can change in the condition of a horse in that time.

 

[Dedicatedhorseowner]

I can’t imagine an insurance company accepting a 6month old vetting- an awful lot can change in the condition of a horse in that time.

Yes I totally agree.

 

[Wishfilly]

I agree, the owner should take out the policy in their name- they're also the one who will make decisions in potentially catastrophic situations. And, as others have said, if the horse goes long term lame and you hand it back, they are then stuck in a difficult situation! It also becomes even more difficult if down the line at renewal there are exclusions- will the owner expect you to pay premiums and vets bills for something that is excluded?

I'd offer to pay for an insurance vetting, get the owner to take out the policy, and come to an agreement over paying premiums (personally I wouldn't necessarily expect to pay 100% of the premiums, but if you really like the horse you may agree to this).

 

[Safi2]

As you do not own the horse you have no insurable interest the owner will need to take out insurance for the horse if the horse was to be put down the insurance company would not pay you as you are not the registered owner. If it’s public liability you need cover for I would suggest taking out a policy with the BHS. Most will not accept a vetting after 30 days

 

[bouncing_ball]

As you do not own the horse you have no insurable interest the owner will need to take out insurance for the horse if the horse was to be put down the insurance company would not pay you as you are not the registered owner. If it’s public liability you need cover for I would suggest taking out a policy with the BHS. Most will not accept a vetting after 30 days

the not paying out if you are not the owner is not correct.

 

[Muddywellies]

You have no insurable interest therefore the owner needs to insure it. You can pay the premium to the owner though.

 

[poiuytrewq]

Going slightly against the grain here, I’m quite surprised at the above replies. I’m assuming the loaner/op isn’t insuring to claim the horses value in the event of a loss, rather to cover vets fees. In which case in a full loan situation the insurers will pay out to a loaner and it is the loaners responsibility to either cover vets fees or insure for them.
So When I had a horse on loan i insured him for vets fees, the value of the horse being unimportant I kept it under the vetting required limit. This has no effect on vet fee cover.
The owner can then insure for Lou or whatever if it’s required to them. Maybe explain that only an owner can get that and that (if that’s correct I’ve not heard that before) xrays/vetting are required but that you’ve covered vets bills.
I think that’s reasonable.

 

[OldNag]

As you do not own the horse you have no insurable interest the owner will need to take out insurance for the horse if the horse was to be put down the insurance company would not pay you as you are not the registered owner. If it’s public liability you need cover for I would suggest taking out a policy with the BHS. Most will not accept a vetting after 30 days

It definitely us possible- I have insured several ponies I have had on loan. One ran up big vet bill and then had to be PTS - insurance Co paid out vets fees direct to vets and paid out to me the sum insured, which I paid over to the owner.

I have also as owner kept my pony insured when she went out on loan.

I agree with the others here who suggest owner arranges and loaner reimburses for premiums.

 

[teddypops]

As you do not own the horse you have no insurable interest the owner will need to take out insurance for the horse if the horse was to be put down the insurance company would not pay you as you are not the registered owner. If it’s public liability you need cover for I would suggest taking out a policy with the BHS. Most will not accept a vetting after 30 days

Not true.

 

[Bernster]

I’m loaning with full responsibility inc vet bills. I’ve added horse to my insurance policy. Insured at the level that doesn’t require a vetting so no issues there. Isn’t the full price of the horse only relevant for things that I wouldn’t claim on anyway eg loss of use, pts? Must admit, I’m not sure what the position is on claims like that.

 

[Dedicatedhorseowner]

I'm just looking to insure said horse for her value and I do require LOU but I don't think this is going to be possible with a 6 month old vetting and x-rays is it?

 

[Bernster]

Not from my experience, they want more recent vetting. Would you be willing to have a vetting done now for ins purposes?

 

[w1bbler]

When I linsured a loan horse vetting was required for over 5k, so I insured at £4950 ? with the owners blessing
The insurance company were aware it was a loan pony & made it clear that a payout for pts would be to the owner not me.

 

[Dedicatedhorseowner]

When I linsured a loan horse vetting was required for over 5k, so I insured at £4950 ? with the owners blessing
The insurance company were aware it was a loan pony & made it clear that a payout for pts would be to the owner not me.

Unfortunately the mare is worth more than that so I need to insure for over £5K

 

[Polos Mum]

loss of use insurance will be very expensive (likely more than £1k per year) and pay out for death is very hard to meet the criteria to actually get.
Other than those two it is irrelevant what the horse is worth - you can insure a £10k horse for £1k

I would have a proper detailed conversation with the owner about what they expect you to be responsible for to make sure you are both clear about what's what

 

[popletaa]

I'm just looking to insure said horse for her value and I do require LOU but I don't think this is going to be possible with a 6 month old vetting and x-rays is it?

I don't mean to intrude if this is the agreement you have made with the owner, but why would you need to insure for LOU? I once loaned a horse that I arranged insurance for, I also included LOU and in hindsight I wouldn't have done this. I suppose it depends on the context though; in my case the owner had never insured her horse before, so it could be interpreted that I was a bit of a mug for offering to pay insurance premiums on LOU that would ultimately get paid to her. Whereas if I were loaning a valuable horse from someone who had previously insured them for LOU then perhaps it would be different story.

I agree that maybe you need to speak with the owner about what they can reasonably expect. If you're not insuring for LOU then the value of the horse is irrelevant and you could insure for less than £5k to avoid the added paperwork. If it were me I would expect to insure for vet cover, perhaps disposal, but leave LOU to the owner.

 

[w1bbler]

Unfortunately the mare is worth more than that so I need to insure for over £5K

But that really isn't down to a loaner to worry about, its the owners issue. Its a bit of a cheek to not insure a horse & then expect a loaner to insure for its value, especially including loss of use ( which is very expensive)
I understand being responsible for vets fees whilst in your care, but the horses financial value should not be your responsibility.
Do you know the owner, I'm just wondering if they are aware of a niggling issue & are hoping to get it sorted or get a payout. I'm a very suspicious sort

 

[Wishfilly]

Going slightly against the grain here, I’m quite surprised at the above replies. I’m assuming the loaner/op isn’t insuring to claim the horses value in the event of a loss, rather to cover vets fees. In which case in a full loan situation the insurers will pay out to a loaner and it is the loaners responsibility to either cover vets fees or insure for them.
So When I had a horse on loan i insured him for vets fees, the value of the horse being unimportant I kept it under the vetting required limit. This has no effect on vet fee cover.
The owner can then insure for Lou or whatever if it’s required to them. Maybe explain that only an owner can get that and that (if that’s correct I’ve not heard that before) xrays/vetting are required but that you’ve covered vets bills.
I think that’s reasonable.

It's not always the case the loaner covers vets fees- it depends what is agreed with the owner. Obviously some loaners do cover vets fees, but as an owner I think this can put you in a difficult situation- because if the loaner is covering vets fees you lose a level of control about the veterinary care the horse may get.

I have seen some nasty disputes arise between loaner and loanee because of this, so IMO it is better for the owner to take ultimate responsibility, with the loaner taking some responsibility by EG reimbursing the owner for premiums. But obviously everyone should do what works for them!

Unfortunately the mare is worth more than that so I need to insure for over £5K

Given everything you've said, clearly you will have to pay for an insurance vetting. Vets do these all the time and they don't cost that much. Given the value of the horse, it's not that much to spend! Insurances may accept a 2 stage vetting, depending on the LOU value.

 

[AmyMay]

Unfortunately the mare is worth more than that so I need to insure for over £5K

Is she currently insured?