Introducing New Dog to Established Pack - thoughts on how to make it go well please

[MrsMozart]

Currently have two male Rotties (brothers) who are three years old, and a GSD bitch (approx. six years old I think).

We've had the Rotties from eight weeks and we're the GSD's third or fourth (and last!) home and have had her for about four years.

Due to a distant relative's change in Life circumstances I'm going to take their eighteen month old wee terrier (possibly a Jack Russell). She's a sweet little thing, though very spoilt.

I know her as I helped look after her a few months ago when she became unexpectedly pregnant - she's a bright little thing and learns quickly, though will need some work as she's been used to ruling the roost, however her little world has been turned upside down and she's been staying with another relative for a couple of months so we'll have to take it into account. I'm hoping she takes comfort from knowing at least me.

The existing dogs very much consider me to be theirs. They've not shown a nasty bone however they are big, strong and surprisingly quick, so I need to work out the best way to make sure everybody is safe and happy. The Grots are crated overnight (as they still chew if we're not around) and the GSD sleeps near them. Apparently the wee dog has started chewing a bit, which she didn't used to do so I'm assuming it's stress, and I think a small crate next to the other dogs might be the plan. I know it'll be tempting to just scoop her up and have her with me, but the others won't like that and she'll (possibly) become an ar$e.

There's a lot of garden and whilst she comes to call it's all going to be new and different so maybe she'll have to go in a big pen. The big dogs have one however I'm not, currently, keen on the idea of leaving her in there with them until they consider her part of the pack. They keep themselves pretty much in check and know their own pecking order and I'm sure she'll slot in given time.

I'm told she's become yappy over toys. We don't have any as the Grots destroy them in minutes. They have Nylabone and horn chews, which are probably the same size as the wee dog . I don't want to introduce toys unless y'all advise it's the thing to do. They'll have to live in the wee dog's crate otherwise the Grots will be in trouble.

What am I missing? What should I be doing now to get them prepped (if anything)? What should I be considering for when she arrives - I have about a week unless someone brings her sooner.


Please no negative comments - the owner has a new baby with lifelong issues. It's been a rollercoaster of a time for all involved. She's looking to do the best by her wee dog and is very upset about having to give her up, however the amount of time the baby will be in hospital means keeping the dog will be incredibly unfair on her unless they come up with a plan that nobody has yet thought of.

 

[meleeka]

My advice would be to never leave them unsupervised. I’m sure it would be terribly upsetting for all concerned if they did attack her and that’s a big pack of dogs to argue with (if she’s a terrier she’s likely to start it. Terriers usually come out fighting if they are intimidated!)
I think you have to plan to keep them separate and only introduce them together when you have the time to supervise them very closely. Take away anything that may cause guarding such as food bowls and chews and introduce them on neutral territory if you can. Be especially mindful of the bitch as when two bitches decide they don’t like each other it can be almost Impossible to get them to change their mind.

 

[MrsMozart]

Thank you M.

Definitely no leaving them alone together. I'm thinking that if she's crated close then they'll get used to her scent.

Will definitely keep an extra eye on the GSD.

I'm thinking that in the evenings I'll keep the wee one on a lead attached to a harness so I can haul her out of the way if anyone starts. I'm really not expecting any trouble and am possibly overthinking things, but can't help it, it's my nature to look at what could go wrong.

 

[Cinnamontoast]

No toys, it’s the big cause of trauma according to my trainer. When I had my bil’s puppy for a bit, she was of the opinion that he should just mix with her pack. He was not thrilled and he and the fox terrier did not get along. With such big dogs, I’d introduce via the pen-can the others get in?

 

[Pearlsasinger]

When we got the Lab pups to comfort/console the remaining Rott, we kept them separately for a month because of her size. She thought we were mad but we needed to keep everybody safe. We allowed everybody to go outside together on leads and then separated them again by putting pups together in one crate and Rott either loose in the house or in the other crate (crates are next to each other. All were used to being crated. They were all in the same room but never able to reach one another. We fed them all together, with plenty of humans around to intervene if necessary, but I'm not sure that I would feed another adult dog with the pack, at first anyway.
We do have regular visiting dogs (in normal times) but 2 of that pack are older than her and she has known them since she was a pup and 'their' pup who is about the same age as ours is part of their pack, so she just accepts her, too. We might have to be a bit more careful at first when we can all get together again (they live in Scotland). I think the main thing is to be vigilant and have plenty of adult humans around to direct behaviour and step in if necessary.
I think the secret to success is to plan for the worst and hope for and expect the best, so I would probably do what you are planning to do. Success will also depend on the responsiveness to commands of all the dogs.


ETA, definitely no toys to be argued over but just to give you some hope that you might be able to reintroduce toys eventually, our Rott and 12 mth old black Lab (who is tiny for a Lab) have been playing tug this morning with a Kong Wubba, Rott allowed the Lab to pull her along by the Kong!

 

[MrsMozart]

Ta CT.

No toys.

The pen is a big outdoor run. We have more panels so could make another one, also have the Grots old crates which are very big. Can make all of it accessible or not.

 

[MrsMozart]

Thanks P.

Feeding time will be with wee one in a pen or crate close to the others but contained so she can't make a dart for one of their bowls.

Am debating taking her with me when I go out and about. It would mean ther others could have free time without any small dog stress. Not sure what it would mean in terms of me being theirs and having to share with a stranger. They'll very happily go to other people for strokes and I'm forgotten then!

 

[Clodagh]

I would not try to single her out for special treatment and everyone elses suggestions sound good. As has been said terriers tend to be their own worst enemies in a tense situation.
I'm so sorry to hear about the current owners problems, that must be the worst thing anyone can think of to deal with in life.

 

[{97702}]

No toys to be left around ever, any feeding times to be closely supervised and social distancing observed between feed bowls, and never leave them together unsupervised!

Mine aren’t guarding breeds I know but it was fun and games initially introducing George, and he is a feisty little sod who told them all to go away (very rudely!) - the lurcher wouldn’t take a telling and snapped back, the greyhound boys laughed at him and wandered off.

Alternatively I’ll give her a home of course.... ????

 

[twiggy2]

I would introduce them out on a walk and how that goes would lay the foundations for everything else.
Is she used to other dogs especially big dog?
Echo no toys, I would also remove all chew etc for now.
I would not put her on a lead in the evenings dogs can become very defensive when in a lead as you remove their ability to remove themselves from a scary situation if they feel the need.
I would not crate her next to all of thw other dogs unless she seems very relaxed and at ease with them and I also would feed her in a seperate room and that's possibly something I would always continue.
The rest really just depends on how everyone is with each other.

 

[SusieT]

Separate feeding time altogether so no risk of tension.
No toys until you are sure everybody gets on.
Watch out for tension when going through doorways, rushing to get out in am etc- maybe best to let others out first then bring her out after to join them.
Hopefully all will be fine .

 

[planete]

The advice we were always given with rescue fosters was to take them on a lead walk with our dogs for the first contact, then keep them separate but able to see and smell each other in the home with a dog gate between rooms. When they looked relaxed, supervised sharing of same large room with no toys or chews, not paying much attention to the newbie and making sure our dogs were getting the usual attention to avoid jealousy. No feeding in the same space, no leaving alone in the same space. It often took only a day or two for everybody to settle down but I did not feed in the same room for a long time and sometimes never.

 

[FinnishLapphund]

When I got my first dog we had 3 older cats, 1 of them did not like dogs or cats not belonging to the family on her territory. We bought enough parts of sturdy compost net so that I could split the living room into two areas, and still have enough to make a large puppy pen in my room. It only took a few weeks for the cats to get used to seeing the puppy in their territory, even the cat who once had aimed to try and kill an adult Dobermann who came into our garden (my mum managed to save the dog before Dolly launched her attack), and the puppy got used to our house being her new home.

You could just as easily use the same method to keep older dogs on one half of a room, and new dog on the other half of the room, to make all of them used to the idea of the newbie becoming a part of the family.

Personally, I introduce new dogs/puppies in the garden, but with new cats outdoors introductions is simply not an option, so that has to take place indoors, and my dogs simply have to accept that I decide if someone should live here or not. If they don't like the newbie, they don't have to interact with the newbie, but they're not allowed to be grumpy towards them only because they've moved in with us.

My 3 dogs have their own spots in the room where I place their feed bowls, about 1 metre apart or more (my summer home is quite tiny, about 1 metre between 3 feed bowls is basically as much as is possible), and they quickly learn that trying to see if they could eat from other food bowls than the one in their spot, is not something I allow (ETA which I feel helps making them relaxed eating together, they learn that they don't need to think about the other dogs when eating).

I sort of thinks that it can help if they get fed more than once per day, because then the newbie quickly gets a lot of training in the feeding routine in their new home, but also it can make feeding times a little less of the big event, because in a few hours time the next serving is going to be offered to them.

Even though there is some bitches who really doesn't like other bitches, I think that in general there seems to be less of a risk for that to occur when they're of different breeds.

 

[windand rain]

Generally speaking it was always the bitches that fought when we had multiple dogs. the dog used to sit on them to stop them. It was always very sudden too would live together for years then suddenly try to kill each other then maybe a year or wo later be fine again it was very strange. So in your case it would be the girls I would worry about

 

[Pearlsasinger]

Generally speaking it was always the bitches that fought when we had multiple dogs. the dog used to sit on them to stop them. It was always very sudden too would live together for years then suddenly try to kill each other then maybe a year or wo later be fine again it was very strange. So in your case it would be the girls I would worry about

We have introduced many bitches to other bitches with no problem, both as pups and adults, with only one causing a problem. She was a stray that we found and after a few days of her biting both people and dogs, she had to go to the Dog Warden, unfortunately, so I think you will be unlucky if it doesn't work out MrsM. We have always fed more than once per day and of course, the Rotters have had to have 3 equal sized meals per day, so I thin FL is correct about the fact that meal time isn't such a big deal here.

 

[AmyMay]

I would introduce them out on a walk and how that goes would lay the foundations for everything else.
Is she used to other dogs especially big dog?
Echo no toys, I would also remove all chew etc for now.
I would not put her on a lead in the evenings dogs can become very defensive when in a lead as you remove their ability to remove themselves from a scary situation if they feel the need.
I would not crate her next to all of thw other dogs unless she seems very relaxed and at ease with them and I also would feed her in a seperate room and that's possibly something I would always continue.
The rest really just depends on how everyone is with each other.

I agree with everything Twiggy has said.

As you know we do doggy day care, and make it very clear to owners that we don’t have toys in the house. They’re reserved for the garden (if at all), because alongside food it can be a source of tension. Dogs are always fed separately.

 

[{97702}]

I’m absolutely sure it will work out, you are so sensible MrsM.... but I’ve checked with George and we are here as back up in case anything unforeseen ?

 

[deb_l222]

Everything that Twiggy has said plus:

Stop overthinking things. Just because new dog is little and existing dogs are big makes no difference. They are still dogs. Do not be tempted to scoop up the little one at all, you will be setting yourself up for a whole heap of trouble further down the line.

My plan, when I get any new dog is this. First thing, we all go for a MASSIVE long walk together. Dogs that walk together, bond together. They will also be too knackered to cause problems when you get home. Remove everything that can cause a fight, toys, chews etc. Always feed separate. Not just separate bowls, a totally separate space.

Totally ignore your new dog and carry on your normal routine with the others. This will be a highly stressful time for the newbie and they need to settle in their own time.

You don’t need to put the crates next to each other. They know who’s in the house, without having them so close. Yes, I agree with not leaving them unsupervised but you will get a feeling for how things are going within the first 24 hours so this doesn’t need to be permanent.

If you relax, they will relax

 

[TheresaW]

Mrs M, I hope your friend and her baby are ok, and that it all works out.

Lev, what are you like? ?

 

[{97702}]

Mrs M, I hope your friend and her baby are ok, and that it all works out.

Lev, what are you like? ?

I know, I’m sorry..... but I was looking for a little female terrier so I just thought I say... you know, just in case.... you never know.... I’m sure it will all be absolutely fine of course ???

 

[Blazingsaddles]

Currently have two male Rotties (brothers) who are three years old, and a GSD bitch (approx. six years old I think).

We've had the Rotties from eight weeks and we're the GSD's third or fourth (and last!) home and have had her for about four years.

Due to a distant relative's change in Life circumstances I'm going to take their eighteen month old wee terrier (possibly a Jack Russell). She's a sweet little thing, though very spoilt.

I know her as I helped look after her a few months ago when she became unexpectedly pregnant - she's a bright little thing and learns quickly, though will need some work as she's been used to ruling the roost, however her little world has been turned upside down and she's been staying with another relative for a couple of months so we'll have to take it into account. I'm hoping she takes comfort from knowing at least me.

The existing dogs very much consider me to be theirs. They've not shown a nasty bone however they are big, strong and surprisingly quick, so I need to work out the best way to make sure everybody is safe and happy. The Grots are crated overnight (as they still chew if we're not around) and the GSD sleeps near them. Apparently the wee dog has started chewing a bit, which she didn't used to do so I'm assuming it's stress, and I think a small crate next to the other dogs might be the plan. I know it'll be tempting to just scoop her up and have her with me, but the others won't like that and she'll (possibly) become an ar$e.

There's a lot of garden and whilst she comes to call it's all going to be new and different so maybe she'll have to go in a big pen. The big dogs have one however I'm not, currently, keen on the idea of leaving her in there with them until they consider her part of the pack. They keep themselves pretty much in check and know their own pecking order and I'm sure she'll slot in given time.

I'm told she's become yappy over toys. We don't have any as the Grots destroy them in minutes. They have Nylabone and horn chews, which are probably the same size as the wee dog . I don't want to introduce toys unless y'all advise it's the thing to do. They'll have to live in the wee dog's crate otherwise the Grots will be in trouble.

What am I missing? What should I be doing now to get them prepped (if anything)? What should I be considering for when she arrives - I have about a week unless someone brings her sooner.


Please no negative comments - the owner has a new baby with lifelong issues. It's been a rollercoaster of a time for all involved. She's looking to do the best by her wee dog and is very upset about having to give her up, however the amount of time the baby will be in hospital means keeping the dog will be incredibly unfair on her unless they come up with a plan that nobody has yet thought of.[/

she’s a terrier. ?Rotties look the part but are generally big softies and yours are both male which is a positive when introducing a new bitch.. Personally, I would keep a close on your GSD bitch whilst introducing. Take them all on a walk together before the terrier enters your home and just watch the GSD. Any dominant behaviour by either bitch needs to be nipped in the bud, either when exercising, playing, feeding or bed time. Don’t give the terrier any excuses regarding dominance towards her ‘possessions’. In fact, don’t give her anything to argue about.?

 

[MrsMozart]

Thank you all.

Was awake far too early this morning and been driving most of today. Will reply properly tomorrow ???

 

[{97702}]

Thank you all.

Was awake far too early this morning and been driving most of today. Will reply properly tomorrow ???

With pictures pleeeease ???

 

[MrsMozart]

Thank you folks. All responses must appreciated.

I think I'm wittering as I've had the time to. I'd have probably been fine if I'd gone and got her there and then

Sorry for giving the wrong impression on my last post! Yesterday for me was a day of driving around doing domestic stuff. The owner is at the hospital with the baby (news is currently good - by gosh they're a pair of fighters those two, and their immediate family who have been amazing) and the wee dog is with her sister.

I'm setting up various things with additional fencing (smaller holes!), have a stairgate coming and she'll come with her crate, bed, etc., so she'll have her own things and sniffs with her. Definitely no toys! Will find a way for one of the Grots to have time with his chew as it's his stress release.

L your thoughts are definitely being kept in mind If things don't work out I'll be in touch! We'll, hopefully, give it time and take it steady and all will be good.

 

[MrsMozart]

She's coming on Thursday

I'm trying to be sensible... She's only an hour away so I could theorectically go any time, but I want to be able to concentrate on her and the others and not be wittering about client work. Have spoken with the lady who she's been with for the last couple of months or so. She'll be sorry to see her go.

I need to make sure that the garden fencing is secure as apparently wee dog has lost her recall abilities... . I think we'll be right back to basics on almost every count.

Currently lying on my bed working (as the study is a bombsite!) with the GSD lying across my feet and a Rottie or two littering the floor. Can't wait 'till all are settled and wee dog is in amongst them

Actually this is going to be excellent practice and training for the future, as one day I'd like to start taking in rescue dogs that are coming to end of life, i.e. the ones that get left in shelters, so it will be good to learn how to manage the rest of the hounds when a new dog comes in.

 

[FinnishLapphund]

Fingers crossed that it all goes as smooth as possible, and that the awol recall ability, isn't too difficult to fix.