Is 24/7 grass turnout a no-no for some types?

[AntiPuck]

I'm soon to start looking for my first horse, and am trying to figure out what sort of 'type' to look for. I gravitate towards chunkier types like cobs, IDs, Welsh cobs, and crosses thereof etc. but the yard i'll be using is 24/7 turnout on grass for the vast majority of the year - which is excellent - but am I asking for trouble keeping the mentioned types in this way, with all of that constant access to grass?

If it becomes a problem weight/nutrition-wise, is putting a grazing muzzle on a good enough solution, for example, or is that just going to result in a miserable horse? Can this be managed with exercise instead, or is it not as simple as that?

I'd really appreciate your opinions or experiences on this, and whether or not you'd suggest thinking twice about the 'type' of horse to get based on the living situation. Not something i've had to think about myself in the past with share ponies etc.

 

[teapot]

Depends on the quality of the grazing, how it's maintained etc...

I have all seen all types survive on 24/7 turnout, limited hard feeds, and correct workloads.

 

[stangs]

Depends on the grass/soil and how it's managed. But, for the types you mention, I do think it's entirely doable, with sufficient exercise, although a friend used to have a bunch of Welsh cobs living out 24/7 on a serious acreage with little to no exercise and never had a bout of laminitis. I suspect it was something to do with the quality of the land. They never got any hard feed but a handful of pony nuts every once in a while

That said, imo it's always worth having a back up plan prepared just in case.

 

[BSL2]

We have four. A dartmoor cross, a Welsh D, an Arab and a mini Shetland so a wide variety. We have seven acres of mixed grasses that is treated for weeds every couple of years we keep them out throughout winter as much as possible. Only come in for a bit of respite from torrential rain. However, come summer that's when the hard work begins. There is no way they could be left out 24/7, When that spring grass comes through we have to work hard at deriving ways to limit grass intake, but keep them trickle feeding as horses are meant to do. We use our stables to escape flies, hot sun and abundance of grass.

 

[ycbm]

I had a good doer cob who was in from 10 till 6 every day in summer and out the rest of the time on very old low sugar pasture.

One of the reasons I sold him was that it became a job and a duty and finally a chore to give him enough work to prevent him becoming fat. Good doers can be very hard work.
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[AntiPuck]

Thank you, everyone - this is really helpful to hear. It sounds like I may need to re-think then, as I won't have access to grass-less paddocks, so it sounds like weight management could become very tricky.

 

[Melody Grey]

Mine have all lived out quite happily for years without a problem. They are all native types/ native sports crosses. I strip graze and use muzzles in the summer. We’re currently on a yard which allow us to turnout overnight and bring in for a few hours in the day which works really well. Do you have the option to move to DIY livery with a stable If living out doesn’t work?

 

[teapot]

Thank you, everyone - this is really helpful to hear. It sounds like I may need to re-think then, as I won't have access to grass-less paddocks, so it sounds like weight management could become very tricky.

You don’t necessarily need grass-less paddocks though, especially not if the grazing is poor quality. Strip paddocks, time in during the day etc

 

[Catbird]

We have a 30 yr old native pony, a chunky cob, tb and a young mix of who-knows-what and they're all out 24/7. The tb is brought in if the weather is really horrible and sometimes the cob joins him, but otherwise they're all out. We're on chalky soil and don't apply fertiliser and with the right work, they've all been fine. The 30 year old doesn't have many teeth left which I think helps limit his intake ?
Don't think it's impossible but it'll depend how rich the grass is

 

[Goldenstar]

I have three ID’s and one ID / Clydesdale I would never consider keeping them without the option of stabling all day in summer .

 

[Jellymoon]

Would you be allowed to strip graze if you provided the electric fencing?
And how much time would you have for riding? Good doers really need a lot of work to stay slim, it’s very time-consuming!

 

[MagicMelon]

I find natives harder to keep than non-natives. But really it depends on how much grass there is and its quality? Are you allowed to tape off a corner if your horse started gaining weight? Grazing muzzles I think make quite a lot of horses pretty depressed from what Ive seen and my experience of them.

 

[Melody Grey]

I don’t muzzle mine constantly, usually overnight as I let the fence out for the strip (so it keeps them occupied for longer) and then muzzles off during the day and hay given if the field is otherwise pretty sparse.

 

[maya2008]

I have everything from TB to Shetland out 24/7, no strip grazing. You can leave a grazing muzzle on 24/7 in the summer (the bucket shaped ones) and they manage just fine if you add a bit of fur to the edges so it doesn’t rub.

 

[Gloi]

I've always strip grazed and had no problems. Plenty of miles helps a lot too.

 

[SEL]

The only person I know who manages that type on 24:7 grass has them in a lot of work. 2-3 hours a day type work.

 

[Spotherisk]

Have you assessed the other horses already there? What types are they, and how much work are they doing?

it can be heartbreakingly hard work to deal with a good doer - mine got toxic laminitis, probably linked to AM, at aged five and we had continuing chronic issues from then until I had him pts aged 10. He destroyed muzzles within a maximum of 48 hours and was at his worst with weight in winter as hay would increase his weight very quickly. A couple of years ago the vet said he pretty much had a problem in every limb and wouldn’t come sound enough to hack around the block so I couldn’t exercise weight off. He was living out in a herd of three (at home) and if anyone remembers the winter we had when COVID hit it didn’t stop raining. He was turned out naked, blanket clipped, with recurring hoof abcesses and gaining weight. I had to let him go, and it was soul destroying.

 

[HashRouge]

I have a Welsh D gelding who lives out 24/7. I doing restrict my grazing in the summer as he can get porky, but I don't have to do anything crazy like keep him in a bare paddock. I tend to just start the summer with him on a small-ish paddock and then strip graze (my summer field is long and thin and I have a lot of electric fencing). I have a bit of a balancing act now keeping him with my 29 yr old Arab, as she's not as much of a good doer as she used to be, but we generally manage okay and they spend most of the year on quite a significant acreage. It's more than doable, but be aware that you might need to muzzle and/ or find some creative solutions to allow you to restrict his grazing. Worth having a look at the other horses on the yard too - if they're all fat, you're likely to have a problem!

 

[scruffyponies]

The scruffies are all natives on unrestricted grass all year, but the grass is unimproved rubbish and the weight comes off again over winter. Because the grazing isn't restricted they tend to stand about happily not eating very much in summer.

 

[AntiPuck]

Mine have all lived out quite happily for years without a problem. They are all native types/ native sports crosses. I strip graze and use muzzles in the summer. We’re currently on a yard which allow us to turnout overnight and bring in for a few hours in the day which works really well. Do you have the option to move to DIY livery with a stable If living out doesn’t work?

I will have access to a stable, but it would likely mean the horse being in on its own a lot of the time if I were to use it, as the others are all out the vast majority of the time.

Would you be allowed to strip graze if you provided the electric fencing?
And how much time would you have for riding? Good doers really need a lot of work to stay slim, it’s very time-consuming!

I'm not sure if they would allow electric fencing putting up, as all horses are out in big herds, but I can ask - thanks for the suggestion. I don't expect time for riding to be an issue, as it'll be full livery and don't work crazy hours, but perhaps that is naive of me to say at this stage!

Have you assessed the other horses already there? What types are they, and how much work are they doing?
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I'm really sorry to hear about your boy, Spot, that sounds like such an awful ordeal.

To answer your question, there are a mixture of types there, including a couple of cobs, but unsure about the level of work. I couldn't get a good look at their weight/condition, due to rugs and distance, though, unfortunately. Something I could (very tactfully) ask the YO about though (work, not weight!), thank you for the suggestion.

 

[windand rain]

Never owned any type of horse from Tb ex racers to dartmoor ponies and warmbloods to arabs that couldn't live out 24/7/365 days of the year but it does take management you have to willingly let them drop weight considerable amounts of weight in winter and keep them from gaining too much in summer but it is more than doable if you have some control over their life and grass access

 

[laura_nash]

Mine are both ridiculously good doers in a very low level of work, and they have to live out as oldie has a severe dust allergy. I have struggled at times (one winter we had a lot of flooding and I had to put him in the fertlised hay field which led to a particularly difficult summer). They have to lose weight in winter and the middle of summer, because they will put it on in spring and autumn. The type of grazing and how its maintained makes a big difference.

Muzzles work well for some, mine has very thin skin around his muzzle so gets rubbed very easily. He can wear a modified dinky muzzle for short periods. For me its a useful tool, for example when moving fields, but not a complete solution.

One thing I would say is what do they do in winter? My two absolutely could not have adlib access to a round bale of hay in the field as some places do.

 

[scats]

I think a lot of it depends on your grazing too. We are on rye grass and it’s a nightmare in many ways. I manage it by muzzling in summer, strip grazing and bringing them off it every day.

 

[Ample Prosecco]

My daughters Connie was in regular work last year - evented the full season at BE90. Even so, when the grass came through she had to be muzzled whenever out and fed on soaked hay or bagged low sugar Timothy right through to October. And she was on rubbish grazing too. She would never have coped on 24/7 turnout on rich pasture. I’d rather manage a poor doer in winter than a good doer in summer if I they were out 24/7/365. Much easier to roll in a round bale for them than to try and stop them eating.

 

[ycbm]

The cob I mentioned above would not keep a muzzle on, it didn't matter what I did, it was off by the end of the night. So they aren't the answer for all of them though they were very effective for my PRE mare.
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[Jellymoon]

I think we are all being a bit negative, to find a yard that even allows winter turnout, let alone 24/7 turnout, is brilliant! And in natural herds too. Your new horse will be very happy indeed.
You just have to make sure that you can control it a bit if you need to, and that you have time to do some nice long hacks several times a week to keep the weight off.
I’ve kept natives out 24/7 all year round in the past and I just taped off bits of field in the summer, and then they would have the run of the land in the winter. One or two got a bit fat in summer if I took my eye off the ball, but nothing a bit of a smaller field and extra work wouldn’t sort out. None of them got laminitis.Personally, I find it easier to keep them slim if they can be out all the time moving around, especially if you can have a few of them in together on a larger bit of field. They tend to keep each other moving.
The worst for weight gain, I feel, is coming into a stable munching on hay with no movement and then going out on a tiny little field. You practically have to starve the poor things on this system to keep them slim.

 

[scats]

I think we are all being a bit negative, to find a yard that even allows winter turnout, let alone 24/7 turnout, is brilliant! And in natural herds too. Your new horse will be very happy indeed.
You just have to make sure that you can control it a bit if you need to, and that you have time to do some nice long hacks several times a week to keep the weight off.
I’ve kept natives out 24/7 all year round in the past and I just taped off bits of field in the summer, and then they would have the run of the land in the winter. One or two got a bit fat in summer if I took my eye off the ball, but nothing a bit of a smaller field and extra work wouldn’t sort out. None of them got laminitis.Personally, I find it easier to keep them slim if they can be out all the time moving around, especially if you can have a few of them in together on a larger bit of field. They tend to keep each other moving.
The worst for weight gain, I feel, is coming into a stable munching on hay with no movement and then going out on a tiny little field. You practically have to starve the poor things on this system to keep them slim.

One of the reasons I stay at my yard, despite the struggle in summer, is our winter turnout is fantastic and we are one of the only yards in the whole area that has proper winter turnout that isn’t just horses stood in a quagmire.

 

[AntiPuck]

I think we are all being a bit negative, to find a yard that even allows winter turnout, let alone 24/7 turnout, is brilliant! And in natural herds too. Your new horse will be very happy indeed.
You just have to make sure that you can control it a bit if you need to, and that you have time to do some nice long hacks several times a week to keep the weight off.
I’ve kept natives out 24/7 all year round in the past and I just taped off bits of field in the summer, and then they would have the run of the land in the winter. One or two got a bit fat in summer if I took my eye off the ball, but nothing a bit of a smaller field and extra work wouldn’t sort out. None of them got laminitis.Personally, I find it easier to keep them slim if they can be out all the time moving around, especially if you can have a few of them in together on a larger bit of field. They tend to keep each other moving.
The worst for weight gain, I feel, is coming into a stable munching on hay with no movement and then going out on a tiny little field. You practically have to starve the poor things on this system to keep them slim.

Thank you, Jellymoon - it's ok re. the negativity, I asked for honest opinions after all, and do appreciate getting them

As you say, most of the yards in this area only offer very restricted individual turnout, which I really didn't want, so was very glad (and lucky!) to get a spot somewhere that can offer year round herd turnout.

It sounds like I need to speak to the YO again and ask what specific adjustments, if any, could be made to help manage weight if it becomes an issue, and then go from there. I have a much better idea of what to actually ask about now, though, thanks to all of these responses; they're much appreciated!

 

[I'm Dun]

I have a cob, native and TB. Neither the cob or native would survive turnout on a large acreage. My previous pony was eventing fit and in HARD work. She got dangerously fat turned out with unrestricted access to grazing. To work her hard enough to keep slim while out 24/7 on decent grazing would involve hours of work a day.

I think you are setting yourself up for misery and worry if there is no way to restrict grazing

 

[tiga71]

I have 3 good doers, all cobs of various types.

The Welsh cob was lean when I got him as project 3 years ago. He went in 33 acre field with mixed herd. Old grass, scrubby, not rested, not fertilised, herd of 12-14. He is only worked in hand and last summer was the first time he got fat and I had to use a muzzle.

Other two moved from other end of farm to the 33 acre field in June, both in light work really. One maybe medium work. Muzzled both as the grass was crazy.

They tended to have muzzles for 48 hours on 24hour off. With breaks in stable during 48 hrs on. Horses are fine with the muzzles, can put them on in the field when they could easily sod off if they wanted to.

I am going to start with muzzles earlier this year so they don't need them on as much. I got a bit caught off guard last summer as hadn't had a problem before. It will depend on how the grass comes through really as the field never had as much grass as last year.

They don't get any hay at all over winter and are either naked or lightly rugged (trace clipped) to help with weightloss.

Tbh I don't like putting muzzles on them but I think for mine it is the best option. They can be out with the herd, they move a lot but it reduces grass intake.