Is this possible?? Lameness experts

[splash30]

I have a horse that has been lame since middle of May he has been to the vets twice now.

In May he was sound in a straight line uncomfortable on rough uneven ground, and very lame about 7-8ths on a circle both reins in trot. No funny standing walking and trotting with correct foot falls

Definitely in the feet, x-rayed every possible angle to cover all feet problems plus just in case also did fetlocks, not a lot showed up. Did not respond to hoof testers ( the vet really tried) or flexion tests

Vet wanted him re-shod as did have some toe he wanted pulling back, did this with leverage reduction shoes improvement shown with being more or less sound, this was 3 weeks ago, now he has started to deteriorate again. The original thought was possible soft tissue damage

Went to the vets yesterday not a severely lame prob about 3-4ths lame on a circle but sound in a straight line as above, the vet is now thinking possible laminitis as rings of growth are bigger at the heel than the toe, we x-rayed again but no change. Again no response to hoof testers.

The thing I cannot get my head around is that can he have lami when he displays no other signs? he is now being shod again next week with same shoes but this time with pads, the vets states if its not lami (his thinking is that it’s a funky form of lami) the shoeing will help anyway – oh yes and when shod and trimmed no redness or anything came out.

If this shoeing does not help we will nerve block to pin point the site I pushed for these yesterday but the vet said if it is lami no conclusive findings would come out.

Any thoughts, comments or experiences welcome

 

[asmp]

I assume the x-rays would show up if it was navicular? I had a horse years ago that was only lame on the circle and it was diagnosed as navicular.

Must be very frustrating for you

 

[Rachelk]

Why does everyone always suspect navicular when anyone mentions lameness in the foot!!!! It really bugs me, there are so many different things it could be.

I had a similar problem with my horse has been x rayed numerous differnt times and they do not show anything - has been nerve blocked and this pointed the lameness at the coffin joint. Im suprised the vet has not done nerve blocks already to pinpoint the area. My boy now has wedges and pads to take pressure of the coffin joint and he seems ok.

I know how you feel though it is very frustrating.

Hope you resolve the issue ASAP

 

[mrdarcy]

I assume the x-rays would show up if it was navicular? I had a horse years ago that was only lame on the circle and it was diagnosed as navicular.

Must be very frustrating for you

Soft tissue damage wouldn't show up on x-rays.

To the OP - not sure what your vet meant by some funky form of lami... did he explain further? But effectively if he has growth rings on his hooves then yes some degree of laminitis has been or is present - growth rings are more accurately called stress rings and are formed when the laminae become inflammed. Low grade or sub clinical laminitis is extremely common and may never develop into what is traditionally seen as laminitis - ponies rocked back on their heels, extreme lameness etc - but can cause intermittent lameness, footiness or even just a shortening of stride on hard ground. Have you or the vet checked his digital pulses?

Shoeing won't solve the problem though may temporaily appear to ease the symptoms. To solve the problem you need to address diet. What do you feed him at the moment? What is his grazing like? Hay or haylage? Has your vet advised you to treat him as laminitic until further notice i.e. by taking him off grass and soaking his hay?

 

[Sparkles]

When were the xrays taken?
Our boy showed no classical signs of lami for the first few weeks, he was just 'off' on one foot and with a little digging,found a false sole and abcess there, so treated that thinking it was that. No-one really considered lami, though we did bring it up, but due to having no actual signs and not falling into the 'typical sterotype' category, it wasn't really the first port of call for reasons he was lame. Anyway,absess cleared up but he was still lame. He'd been on box rest and maintainance food anyway at this point. Anyway, his legs then swelled up randomly with cellulitis and we had to chuck him out to get him moving, so was put in the small paddock. Woke up to a phone at 6am the next morning from land lady saying he was down and couldn't get up.
Was FINALLY diagnosed with Acute Laminitis when the vet rushed out again then, and it took nerve blocks in all feet, 5 adults and about 40minutes to get him in the 100metres from the field to this stable. It was awful.
Anywho. Had xrays done then and there were no changes, but this is normal as you usually have them done at the start and then again 4 weeks on.
There were no changes to start with.
Then 3 weeks later they were these:
His worse foot:

And his 'good' foot:

The Imprint shoes were the only things keeping his pedal bone in his foot.
Sadly, we lost him 5 weeks on after. He was a big lad, 18.3hh and the amount of meds he was on to try and control, the pain took their toll. We knew the risk when we decided to try everything, but it was a kill-or-cure situation sadly.
The lami, they're still befuddled over what caused it, as he wasn't over weight or on copious amounts of feed. On the bloods, an unknown toxin was found plus some underlying problem with his liver that may possibly link the two to trigger the lami attack to start with. They know it was was toxin induced lami, but couldn't pinpoint from what exactly sadly.

Anywho. Not trying to be doom and gloom, but it's always best to treat for lami and rule that out first. So don't necesarily rule it out completely. If the xrays were done at the start, I'd get them done again now so your vet can try and see if there's any changes in there.

Once that's ruled out and if it'd definately not lami, then maybe see about sidebone or something similar?

 

[splash30]

Hi

Thanks for your replies.

He has no digital pulses at all in any legs also checked hind legs too just in case, food wise he is on happy hoof, hay, the grazing is very poor, I dont like him to have high sugar feeds and try to keep it as low starch as possible as well.

He was x-rayed 3 weeks ago and yesterday with no change in his feet. The vet means by a funky form of lami that its not run of the mill symptoms and will not be able to charactise him into any ''boxes''.

He is being treated as a lami case for the past 3 weeks just in case.

 

[stranger1612]

It is certainly possible that a horse with laminitis will show minimal or no radiographic abnormalities initially. It is likely, however, that several weeks down the line there will be appropriate radiographic changes. If your vet has confidently localized the lameness to the feet and the horse is still significantly lame I would suggest more advanced imaging. The most obvious, easily available and probably most helpful would be a standing low field MRI. This is a standard procedure now and whilst it does have limitations the general stumbling block is the price. We charge about £1000 inc VAT. Most insurance companies cover this but NFU will pay half.

 

[GMR]

Why does everyone always suspect navicular when anyone mentions lameness in the foot!!!! It really bugs me, there are so many different things it could be.

I had a similar problem with my horse has been x rayed numerous differnt times and they do not show anything - has been nerve blocked and this pointed the lameness at the coffin joint. Im suprised the vet has not done nerve blocks already to pinpoint the area. My boy now has wedges and pads to take pressure of the coffin joint and he seems ok.

I know how you feel though it is very frustrating.

Hope you resolve the issue ASAP

Here Here...I echo this comment...my horse was exactly the same as this my local vet said he had navicular and wanted remedial shoeing...even before the x ray..I didnt believe her so took him to Rossdales in Newmarket and the vet just nerve blocked the coffin joint rather than the whole foot which the previous vet did and he went sound , x rays show he has arthritis of the coffin joint,
I was messing about with a local vet for months, 3 visits and lots of time wasting...
A specialist will give you the answer in 1 day!!!